Why are humans tribal?

[Greg]

Well, I married outside my race.   :tongue:  I think culture matters more than race in terms of marital success, because of expectations for how just about everything in life works or should work.  So if someone does marry outside their culture, it can be a bit rocky.  I think it would be harder for a white American to marry a native European than it would for him to marry a Chinese American whose family has been here since the railroads were being built.  Not to say you can't make it work, but it takes a bit more work.

I don't know if it's possible to get away from tribalism completely, especially if you extend the definition to all forms of "us vs them."  Even something as innocent as college sports rivalries can be viewed as a form of tribalism.

I think when people fight, cry or get emotional over sports, as opposed to simply enjoying them as a form of entertainment, then they cannot be viewed as anything but tribalism.

I've always enjoyed watching athletics, soccer and many other sports just for the pleasure of seeing physical excellence.  I really don't care who wins the world cup final as long as it is an entertaining game has great goals and does not end in a penalty shoot out.  Same with the Olympics.

[Jayne]

Could be.  Were there any significant events before the Tower of Babel in the Bible that would hint at Tribalism as a pre-existing human condition?

The story of Noah is chronologically before Babel, right?  Does the Noah story suggest Tribalism?

The three sons of Noah are supposed to represent three peoples who descended from them. This could be seen as suggesting tribalism.

[Greg]

Tribalism is a very deep human instinct or trait.  Either it was there pre-fall, (which does not seem to make a lot of sense, why would you need it?), or it came about as a result of the fall, or God kinda sorta injected it into all of human kind at some point long ago, Tower of Babel, when societies had not wandered off to Australia, the Americas and the Pacific Islands and become separated, but then failed to reference this action in the Bible.

Wherever anthropologists or early explorers have shown up they have found tribes and "them and us" attitudes. There appears to be a magic number of number range of people that you know and can perceive as being in your tribe, of a few hundred people.

I ran a banger rally once two years running where I invited a bunch of random petrol heads to show up and race old cars from London to Naples.  On the first year we had 12 cars and the rally was really successful and had a great spirit about it, everyone pulled together, had fun, nobbled each other's cars but in ways that were repairable and also funny which made for some great memories.  One team for example took the drivers seat out and locked it in the trunk of the car but put all the bolts in the glove box.  Everyone had the attitude of it is us versus the French, Swiss or Italian police.  When other teams broke down they stopped to help them.

The second year there were 40 cars and by the second day people had divided into factions and were taking parts of cars and throwing them into bushes where they would never be found and thus either really inconveniencing people or leaving them stranded.  Sometimes from teams that had done nothing to offend them but just were not in their clique.  It's a ugly side of human nature. After that I gave up and let someone else run it.

It's well known that small businesses and large businesses cannot be run and managed in the same way because of tribalism.  And don't even get me started on the fragmentation you witness in Traditionalist circles.

[Jayne]

I agree with your comments on the extent of tribalism, Greg.  As was already mentioned, it could be a distortion of some good quality that was meant for humanity before the Fall.

[nmoerbeek]

Sects and Factions are identified as a work of the flesh in the Bible in Galatians Chapter 5.

[Greg]

What is it that was distorted then?  Charity?  Love of family and friends?  What good human trait was warped?

[OCLittleFlower]

Well, I married outside my race.   :tongue:  I think culture matters more than race in terms of marital success, because of expectations for how just about everything in life works or should work.  So if someone does marry outside their culture, it can be a bit rocky.  I think it would be harder for a white American to marry a native European than it would for him to marry a Chinese American whose family has been here since the railroads were being built.  Not to say you can't make it work, but it takes a bit more work.

I don't know if it's possible to get away from tribalism completely, especially if you extend the definition to all forms of "us vs them."  Even something as innocent as college sports rivalries can be viewed as a form of tribalism.

I think when people fight, cry or get emotional over sports, as opposed to simply enjoying them as a form of entertainment, then they cannot be viewed as anything but tribalism.

I've always enjoyed watching athletics, soccer and many other sports just for the pleasure of seeing physical excellence.  I really don't care who wins the world cup final as long as it is an entertaining game has great goals and does not end in a penalty shoot out.  Same with the Olympics.

I've never really enjoyed watching team sports, I'll admit.  In the Olympics, I root for individual athletes that I enjoy watching, typically in figure skating and gymnastics.  I typically enjoy skaters and gymnasts with a more Russian style to their movement.

With more typical team sports (baseball, football) I don't watch it, but I'm happy to hear when a team that my family members or friends support wins.

[Jayne]

What is it that was distorted then?  Charity?  Love of family and friends?  What good human trait was warped?

Perhaps love of family and friends.  I also think that team spirit, loyalty and camaraderie are good aspects that are related to tribalism. 

[Kaesekopf]

Because Hell is other people, haha

Sent from my HTC Sensation using Tapatalk

[OCLittleFlower]

What is it that was distorted then?  Charity?  Love of family and friends?  What good human trait was warped?

I think so.

Once you have the concept of an "us," anyone who attacks one of "us" turns into an evil "them."

[mikemac]

What is it that was distorted then?  Charity?  Love of family and friends?  What good human trait was warped?

Yeah that and the lack of communication.  Nimrod the great-grandson of Noah was the character that commissioned the building of the Tower of Babel.

Genesis 11:[1] And the earth was of one tongue, and of the same speech. ... [5] And the Lord came down to see the city and the tower, which the children of Adam were building. ...    [8] And so the Lord scattered them from that place into all lands, and they ceased to build the city. [9] And therefore the name thereof was called Babel, because there the language of the whole earth was confounded: and from thence the Lord scattered them abroad upon the face of all countries.

The Armenian and Hungarian legends of Nimrod are interesting because it confirms that the Lord scattered them.  Armenia used to consist of most of what the country of Turkey looks like now.  Meotis Marsh from the Hungarian legend is on the north east shore of the Black Sea.  Nimrod's people became the Scythians.  So the Armenians and Nimrod's people were divided by the Caucasus Mountains.

Nimrod - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nimrod

"In Armenian legend, the ancestor of the Armenian people, Hayk, defeated Nimrod (sometimes equated with Bel) in a battle near Lake Van."

"The twin sons of King Nimród, Hunor and Magor, each with 100 warriors, followed the White Stag through the Meotis Marsh, where they lost sight of the magnificent animal. Hunor and Magor found the two daughters of King Dul of the Alans, together with their handmaidens, whom they kidnapped. Hungarian legends held Hunor and Magyar (aka Magor) to be ancestors of the Huns and the Magyars (Hungarians), respectively. According to the Miholjanec legend, Stephen V of Hungary had in front of his tent a golden plate with the inscription: "Attila, the son of Bendeuci, grandson of the great Nimrod, born at Engedi: By the Grace of God King of the Huns, Medes, Goths, Dacians, the horrors of the world and the scourge of God."

Scythia later became known as Khazaria, so Nimrod, Attila the Hun and the Khazars were all within the same line.  Nimrod figures in some very early versions of the history of Freemasonry also.  Armenia was the first country to adopt Christianity as the country's religion, even while Christianity was still being persecuted in most of the Roman Empire.  Perhaps tribalism was a way for God to prevent evil from fully corrupting good.

That said, "Where there is neither Gentile nor Jew, circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian nor Scythian, bond nor free. But Christ is all, and in all." (Colossians 3:11)