Author Topic: Early education starts from the womb  (Read 560 times)

Offline queen.saints

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Early education starts from the womb
« on: February 07, 2021, 10:33:04 AM »
http://m.koreaherald.com/view.php?ud=20150316000773&ACE_SEARCH=1

Early education starts from the womb?
From ancient royals to modern working moms, Korean women practice traditional prenatal care ‘taegyo’
By Korea Herald Published : Mar 16, 2015 - 19:25
Updated : Apr 30, 2015 - 16:26
 
 
 
 
“What is learned in the cradle is carried to the grave,” says a popular old adage.

While it means that habits acquired in youth tend to be hard to break, Korean people have long embraced a more literal interpretation of the saying.

Since over 600 years ago, expectant mothers in Korea have been practicing taegyo, a series of prenatal routines aimed at nurturing a healthy, virtuous and skilled child. They try to see and hear only the most pleasant things starting from three months of pregnancy.

One program called “Royal Taegyo” allows mothers to experience centuries-old taegyo methods followed by historical Korean queens.



“Participants will bind a taegyo diary in silk and sew traditional ‘jeogori’ costumes for their babies,” said an official of the National Palace Museum of Korea, the organizer of the program. “Sewing enhances dexterity, which is said to boost the fetus’ brain development.”

According to ancient Korean medicine, all stimuli during pregnancy shape the personality of the baby after birth ― which is why mothers, especially those of future princes and kings in the Joseon court, adhered to a rigorous taegyo process so as to bear a fine heir.

A royal mother should not “sleep on her side, sit slanting, stand on one foot, or consume odd-tasting food. She should not see vicious colors or hear obscene sounds; she should recite poetry ... and speak truthfully,” says “Seonghakjipyo,” a Joseon textbook on royal education.

Queens also took poetry and art lessons and meditated every morning on proverbs engraved on boards of jade, which was considered a comforting hue. Court musicians would strum the traditional string instrument “geomungo” in the background for a soothing atmosphere, according to “Annals of the Joseon Dynasty.”

Famous stories of royal taegyo are told to this day.

Lady Hyegyeong, for example, ate only the freshest seasonal food, maintained graceful posture and dwelled on peaceful thoughts during pregnancy, writes Pukyong National University professor Shin Myeong-ho in “The Education of the Joseon Royal Household.”

Incidentally, she gave birth to Jeongjo, Joseon’s 22nd king who is heralded as a visionary and leader of the dynasty’s renaissance.

Then there is the story of Lady Yoon, the second wife of Seongjong, who suffered intense jealousy as the king took to other concubines during her pregnancy. After 9 months of angst, she gave birth to Yeonsangun, who turned out to be the most barbaric tyrant in the history of Joseon.

Anecdotes like these strengthened the belief that a mother’s emotional state during pregnancy could shape the child’s temperament after birth.

“More important are 10 [lunar] months of maternal care inside the womb than 10 years of education after birth,” says a famous quote from “Taegyo shingi,” a guidebook on folk taegyo written by Joseon era scholar Sajudang Lee.

The interest in taegyo persists today. There are all different kinds of programs that incorporate music, exercise, cross-stitching, forest bathing, Pilates, and more ― travel agency Hana Tour even offers a Guam taegyo travel package.

“One reason behind this boom is the decrease in birthrate,” said the Palace Museum official. “Parents are investing more in the few children they have, and that includes education in the womb.”

Prenatal care is not unheard of in the west. Maternity programs like Lamaze and the self-help book “What to Expect When You’re Expecting” are wildly popular among expectant mothers.

However, the distinctive aspect of taegyo is that it is concerned with the psychological development of the fetus in addition to the physiological.

While ultrasound checkups focus on monitoring physical growth, taegyo believes that a fetus is capable of retaining sensations and influences ― an idea which reflects the Confucian belief that an embryo is a fully-fledged human being at the moment of fertilization, said Shin in an interview with The Korea Herald.

“This is the reason why newborns in Korea are considered one year old upon birth,” he said.

Some view the focus on taegyo as another example of the overheated early education in Korea. Its underlying philosophy, however, has more to do with self-examination than social advancement, said the professor.

“Confucian education is not originally driven by greed, but aims to cultivate life and the human potential,” he said. “It aims for a ‘well-rounded human being,’ and taegyo should be seen as the first step in this process.”

By Rumy Doo
I am sorry for the times I have publicly criticized others on this forum, especially traditional Catholic religious, and any other scandalous posts and pray that no one reads or believes these false and ignorant statements.
 
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Offline coffeeandcigarette

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Re: Early education starts from the womb
« Reply #1 on: February 08, 2021, 10:07:10 PM »


“One reason behind this boom is the decrease in birthrate,” said the Palace Museum official. “Parents are investing more in the few children they have, and that includes education in the womb.”

Bam. That is why stuff like this is stupid. The idea that music, art, meditation, rest, fancy food, and calm are helpful for maintaining good mental health is all well and good; but to start acting like it massively effects the child is stupid. Our Lady found out she was pregnant and immediately went to Elizabeth's house to work. Many of John Bosco's most pious boys were conceived and born in a whore house. Plenty of children these days are born from these hippy vegan yoga moms and they are not turning out well at all. This is just the sort of self-indulgent garbage that encourages moms to have a nine month pampered princess spa day until, and after they give birth, and tells poorer, working mothers, with large boisterous families, that they are missing the mark. I am enjoying thinking about the reaction this article would illicit from Pope Pius XII. LOL
 
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Offline queen.saints

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Re: Early education starts from the womb
« Reply #2 on: February 09, 2021, 06:34:22 AM »
The reality is that despite a recent supposed “boom” in Taegyo in Korea, in practice most Korean women are modern, working, and neglectful of their unborn children. Even today, a study on Korean women’s prenatal healthcare in America showed that the women who are still practicing it are doing so because of pressure from their older, more traditional female relatives.

Traditionally there didn’t need to be a resurgence, because it was already almost universally practiced.

And it was universally practiced not just in Korea, but in all of Asia. And not just in Asia, but in the West as well, where you will find constant reference to similar traditions in historical texts, including very strongly among the Celts. To mock these traditional customs is a reflection on one’s own understanding of how the unborn baby is formed, not that of our highly intelligent and morally superior ancestors.

The fact that the mother’s internal state massively affects her unborn child is the very basis for why Mary was chosen as the Mother of God and why she was immaculately conceived. Our Lady’s generosity and evangelical spirit in visiting and helping her cousin and bringing Our Lord to her is, of course, an excellent example of this in action.

As Pope Pius XII says, a large family is the best education one can give a child, starting with generously accepting conception from God. Even in terms of being “pampered”, he wisely points out that the older daughters of large families are a great help to their mothers with the babies.

There is also a saying in Italy, “The poor eat the best,” because all the cheap foods like small fish, bones,  soup, etc. that they eat are actually the most nutritious: for the unborn baby as well.

Pope Pius XI also says that while the father is the head of the family and should have the first place in ruling, the mother is the heart and should have the first place in love. An old French way of telling children where babies come from is to say that they were grown in their mother’s heart, and they considered this to be telling them the truth.
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Offline coffeeandcigarette

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Re: Early education starts from the womb
« Reply #3 on: February 09, 2021, 02:40:39 PM »
The reality is that despite a recent supposed “boom” in Taegyo in Korea, in practice most Korean women are modern, working, and neglectful of their unborn children. Even today, a study on Korean women’s prenatal healthcare in America showed that the women who are still practicing it are doing so because of pressure from their older, more traditional female relatives.

Traditionally there didn’t need to be a resurgence, because it was already almost universally practiced.

And it was universally practiced not just in Korea, but in all of Asia. And not just in Asia, but in the West as well, where you will find constant reference to similar traditions in historical texts, including very strongly among the Celts. To mock these traditional customs is a reflection on one’s own understanding of how the unborn baby is formed, not that of our highly intelligent and morally superior ancestors.

The fact that the mother’s internal state massively affects her unborn child is the very basis for why Mary was chosen as the Mother of God and why she was immaculately conceived. Our Lady’s generosity and evangelical spirit in visiting and helping her cousin and bringing Our Lord to her is, of course, an excellent example of this in action.

As Pope Pius XII says, a large family is the best education one can give a child, starting with generously accepting conception from God. Even in terms of being “pampered”, he wisely points out that the older daughters of large families are a great help to their mothers with the babies.

There is also a saying in Italy, “The poor eat the best,” because all the cheap foods like small fish, bones,  soup, etc. that they eat are actually the most nutritious: for the unborn baby as well.

Pope Pius XI also says that while the father is the head of the family and should have the first place in ruling, the mother is the heart and should have the first place in love. An old French way of telling children where babies come from is to say that they were grown in their mother’s heart, and they considered this to be telling them the truth.


Those are all very sweet little antidotes, but what the heck does that have to do with anything? The mother has the first place in love, the poor eat best, girls help when they are older...? Ok, fine. I didn't say any of that wasn't true. My point was that many children have been born from women who live in loud, difficult places, eat whatever is around, and have zero time for painting. There is also no one playing soft music to them while they lay on a couch, or monitoring all noises and conversations to make sure that no sad news/anger/etc finds its was to the mother's ear.

You say that our ancestors were morally superiors and highly intelligent. What makes you think this? Have the prophets not always been sent among us? Did St.Vincent Ferrar not say most of the world was damned, did Egyptian women not abort their children? Did the Greeks and Romans not sodomize boys? Has rape and incest not always existed since the very earliest times? The only difference between now and then is that the government/media/j#$@/etc have decided that this evil should be encouraged and brought into the mainstream. If our "morally superior" ancestors were dusted off and dropped down into 2021, you would see no difference whatsoever in society as a whole.

Highly intelligent? not really. You certainly had a larger number of grounded normal people in the old days, not given to living in fantasy land/social media land/etc. They were not more intelligent overall though. What makes you think the ratio of brilliance and mediocrity was so different then compared to today?

Just because something is old and has been done for hundreds or thousands of years, do not suppose it is superior to what is done today. That is certainly true in many areas, like the Latin Mass, but not all. I honestly think it is the Old Mass which makes many trads work on the assumption that old=better. I don't suppose you would want leeches instead of penicillin if you got scarlet fever would you?
« Last Edit: February 09, 2021, 09:02:06 PM by coffeeandcigarette »
 

Offline queen.saints

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Re: Early education starts from the womb
« Reply #4 on: February 10, 2021, 08:45:50 AM »
1. The belief that a woman's interior/physical state during pregnancy has an enormous influence on her child is stupid.

This was believed by all people from all known cultures. It's confirmed by modern science. It's taught in every old Catholic mother's manual I've ever read. All these people are not stupid. Here are some pages from "Educating a Child: The Art of Arts" which has a forward highly recommending it from Father Beck.




2. This is only for rich women with small families

Most of these practices are folk wisdom from poor people and are either free or extremely cheap and available to all people of all walks of life.
The main pieces of advice are:


Good thoughts: Free
Avoiding bad thoughts: Free
Singing: Free
Not shouting: Free
Staying calm: Free
Being nice to people: Free
Not speaking ill of others: Free

Seaweed: Free/or extremely cheap depending on location
Beans: Extremely cheap
Small fish: Extremely cheap

Hardly fancy food.

All over the world poor women were not eating "whatever"; they were normally eating incredibly nutrient dense diets, so it's no surprise that they would have healthy children.

Even the other suggestions like knitting etc. are things that would have been the daily activities of most poor women. Poor women have always had plenty of beauty in their lives.

Saint Don Bosco's mother was illiterate, but she had her entire catechism memorized and was extremely knowledgeable about history and the Bible. Educating children is not just for rich women.

3.) This is self-indulgent pampering

Main traditional remedies recommended for common issues:

Morning sickness: Light housework and acceptance
Swelling and blood stagnation: Light outdoor work and walks
Labor preparation: Light housework and patience

Not fighting and shouting, making a happy home environment, being pleasant and cheerful, and controlling ourselves emotionally is not self-indulgent. It's hard work that requires a lot of inner strength.

Having nice, supportive family and friends who don't treat pregnant women badly or expect them to do extremely strenuous work that could bring on miscarriage or negatively affect the child is not pampering; it's the way normal people have always operated.

4.) This won't have a massive impact one way or another

In utero iodine deficiency alone can take 15 IQ points and 10 cm off a child's height.

Seaweed is one of the best sources of iodine.

That's a massive impact right there just on a natural level from not following traditional advice.
I am sorry for the times I have publicly criticized others on this forum, especially traditional Catholic religious, and any other scandalous posts and pray that no one reads or believes these false and ignorant statements.
 
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Offline Maximilian

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Re: Early education starts from the womb
« Reply #5 on: February 10, 2021, 12:06:25 PM »

The fact that the mother’s internal state massively affects her unborn child is the very basis for why Mary was chosen as the Mother of God and why she was immaculately conceived. Our Lady’s generosity and evangelical spirit in visiting and helping her cousin and bringing Our Lord to her is, of course, an excellent example of this in action.

Yes, very good point. I don't see how any Catholic could deny this.
 
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Offline Maximilian

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Re: Early education starts from the womb
« Reply #6 on: February 10, 2021, 12:11:47 PM »

This was believed by all people from all known cultures. It's confirmed by modern science. It's taught in every old Catholic mother's manual I've ever read.

Here are some pages from "Educating a Child: The Art of Arts" which has a forward highly recommending it from Father Beck.





Very beautiful. Thanks for posting these excerpts. I highly recommend that people take the time to click on these images and read the pages.

Also, these Catholic teachings help to correct a potential mis-impression that attention to the pre-natal state of the infant is only something practiced by Asians.
 
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Offline red solo cup

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Offline Angela

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Re: Early education starts from the womb
« Reply #8 on: February 20, 2021, 05:23:16 PM »
I don’t subscribe to this in-the-womb education. Many a saint has come from a mother’s plowing in the field the same as in a monarch’s courts. There certainly wasn’t any Mozart playing for the former, and no rigour in the latter. It all sounds a little too much like the New Age movement for me...
 
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Offline Padraig

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Re: Early education starts from the womb
« Reply #9 on: February 20, 2021, 09:46:40 PM »
You don't think women sang to their babies as they worked in the fields?
 

Offline MaximGun

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Re: Early education starts from the womb
« Reply #10 on: February 21, 2021, 03:01:18 AM »
Women should be stay at home mothers, not korea women.
 

Offline Aulef

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Re: Early education starts from the womb
« Reply #11 on: February 21, 2021, 05:18:46 AM »
Grace perfects any temperament. Life of grace is more important than this over zeal during pregnancy.
« Last Edit: February 21, 2021, 05:27:18 AM by Aulef »
Tota pulchra es, Maria
Et macula originalis non est in Te
 
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Offline Angela

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Re: Early education starts from the womb
« Reply #12 on: February 26, 2021, 10:13:58 PM »
You don't think women sang to their babies as they worked in the fields?

Not in the way (or for the reasons) that the OP is suggesting. Singing to your baby outside the womb, absolutely; in the womb because you think it will provide some life-changing developments? No.
 
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Offline coffeeandcigarette

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Re: Early education starts from the womb
« Reply #13 on: February 28, 2021, 06:56:35 PM »
Quote
1. The belief that a woman's interior/physical state during pregnancy has an enormous influence on her child is stupid.

This was believed by all people from all known cultures. It's confirmed by modern science.

It is confirmed by modern science that women's souls are the raw material from which children's souls are formed? Wow, ok then.

Quote
2. This is only for rich women with small families

Most of these practices are folk wisdom from poor people and are either free or extremely cheap and available to all people of all walks of life.

That is absolutely not true. You ran an article going on and on about privileged white Korean women paying a LOT of many to go to fancy baby classes and bind silk baby books
Quote
The main pieces of advice are:


Good thoughts: Free
Avoiding bad thoughts: Free
Singing: Free
Not shouting: Free
Staying calm: Free
Being nice to people: Free
Not speaking ill of others: Free

The article above said nothing about the mother's own thoughts, words, or sights as rules, only anecdotes. The rule is that she cannot hear anything bad, or see vicious colors. This has everything to do with creating a perfect little world for yourself like a queen. Unsurprising, since the whole article is about royal pregnancies. This is no different than an article about what Kate Middleton ate/wore/read/etc when pregnant and now all the pathetic, weak minded social climbers think if they do the same thing that they too can raise brilliant royal babies and advance their own ego and social standing. It is literally insane and foolish.


Quote
Seaweed: Free/or extremely cheap depending on location
Beans: Extremely cheap
Small fish: Extremely cheap

Hardly fancy food.

All over the world poor women were not eating "whatever"; they were normally eating incredibly nutrient dense diets, so it's no surprise that they would have healthy children.

 Firstly, the idea that children in the old days were so robust and healthy is totally false. Children died as youngsters all the time, and not just from measles. The diets were better in terms quality of food due to the lack of processing and cellular manipulation, but the assumption of nutrient dense diets completely depends on where in the world we are talking about.
When I said "whatever", I meant whatever was available. They were not curating special diets for themselves based on potential baby brilliance or things "tasting odd."

Quote
Saint Don Bosco's mother was illiterate, but she had her entire catechism memorized and was extremely knowledgeable about history and the Bible. Educating children is not just for rich women.

I am fully aware of that. I could easily educate all my children with dirt, a stick, and my brain until at least 7th grade. Higher level science gets tricky...
Neither this article, nor your own interesting ideas, have anything to do with a child's education. They have everything to do trying to rig the game in utero and give a baby a leg up in life by strumming harp music and going to your happy place. A child's "education" begins after they are born. Everything before that is biological advantage.

3.) This is self-indulgent pampering

Quote
Main traditional remedies recommended for common issues:

Morning sickness: Light housework and acceptance
Swelling and blood stagnation: Light outdoor work and walks
Labor preparation: Light housework and patience

Not fighting and shouting, making a happy home environment, being pleasant and cheerful, and controlling ourselves emotionally is not self-indulgent. It's hard work that requires a lot of inner strength.

Having nice, supportive family and friends who don't treat pregnant women badly or expect them to do extremely strenuous work that could bring on miscarriage or negatively affect the child is not pampering; it's the way normal people have always operated.

Totally fine, there is nothing wrong with any of this. What you are doing here is a very common thing for you. You post one thing with one set of rules/ideas/whatever. People argue with you or point out failures in the argument and you leap back into the conversation with a ten pounds bag-of-tricks and start trotting out stuff that has nothing to do with the OP. You cannot argue against my dislike of this Korean clap-trap by bringing up completely difference sources with pregnancy advise. That has no weight here.

Quote
4.) This won't have a massive impact one way or another

In utero iodine deficiency alone can take 15 IQ points and 10 cm off a child's height.

Seaweed is one of the best sources of iodine.

That's a massive impact right there just on a natural level from not following traditional advice.

So now we are going to cure an iron deficiency by strumming soothing music and painting? What if seaweed tastes odd, the mother isn't supposed to taste anything odd remember. Now what?
 
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Offline GiftOfGod

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Re: Early education starts from the womb
« Reply #14 on: February 28, 2021, 07:10:10 PM »
I knew a New Age guy who said that he and his New Age wife abstained from sex during her pregnancy because it could "negatively affect the fetus". Since they only had one kid I guess it wasn't too big of a sacrifice. They also put headphones on the pregnant belly so the fetus could hear music.