Author Topic: Fr Chad Ripperger quote: I'd like some help understanding it  (Read 657 times)

Offline Lyle Bright

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Fr Chad Ripperger quote: I'd like some help understanding it
« on: October 11, 2020, 08:09:58 AM »
That quote is:

"Traditionalists are some of the worst modernists on the planet"

I would like to know if someone has a link that clarifies if indeed Fr Ripperger actually said that. I Googled it as such and could find no source (but I did not try very hard).

This is my first post to this forum and I am starting in an area that is crucial form me. The knowledge and the self-understanding that I myself am, indeed, a modernist in the sense of Paschendi (which I have read though it would not be unwise to focus on it more (and I also found these video talks quite good:

 

There are 13 or so of these videos that comprise a discussion between two individuals. (And I need to listen again, and think).

I think that understanding Our Modern Condition and our modern situation is exceedingly difficult, demanding and fraught. In the course of my own independent studies, over many years now, I see how far we as moderns have fallen, and I see what the consequences are (my life and upbringing in highly liberal and modern California is a perfect example of what I now must 'combat against' and 'reform'). My processes in all this (excuse the cliché term) have been very intense, very interesting, and yet I am a product of the Modernism that Pius X wrote of in Pascendi.

But what I mean is our entire culture, indeed the *structure of our perception* and in many ways our *perceptual metaphysics* are modernist in the sense Pius X warned.

How does one turn this around? I am thinking now of Richard Weaver's Ideas Have Consequences (a philosophical and metaphysical neo-Platonism that could tend to Catholicism).

Well, there you have it! I just blurted out some material that I literally struggle with every day. It is agonizing in an inner, spiritual sense, but it is not strictly *my own*. That is, this is a shared condition. It is where we are in so many senses. Perhaps not *you-singular* of course.

Note: I use *** as you see more or less as emphasis. I suppose I could underline. I also use ' ' in much the same way. Perhaps I should reform my punctuation! 😂

Thanks you for reading though and please tell me your thoughts. Vitally interested.
 
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Offline Maximilian

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Re: Fr Chad Ripperger quote: I'd like some help understanding it
« Reply #1 on: October 11, 2020, 11:57:15 AM »
"Traditionalists are some of the worst modernists on the planet"

I would like to know if someone has a link that clarifies if indeed Fr Ripperger actually said that.

Yes, Fr. Ripperger says this a lot in many of his videos. You would have to watch his videos, rather than trying to find the text through google.

I have watched most of his videos, and he presents a lot of good material when he sticks with his strong points of explaining what he has learned through his ministry of expelling demons, but he has a bee in his bonnet on the topic of "traditionalists," which is just his personal opinion, and I believe is misinformed.
 
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Offline Daniel

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Re: Fr Chad Ripperger quote: I'd like some help understanding it
« Reply #2 on: October 11, 2020, 12:12:53 PM »
Is he himself not a traditionalist (at least loosely speaking)? Without context, I'm not sure why he would hold such a view.
« Last Edit: October 11, 2020, 12:19:27 PM by Daniel »
 

Offline Maximilian

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Re: Fr Chad Ripperger quote: I'd like some help understanding it
« Reply #3 on: October 11, 2020, 12:56:37 PM »
Is he himself not a traditionalist (at least loosely speaking)?

He was originally a priest with the Fraternity of St. Peter before he left in order to found his own order of exorcists.

Without context, I'm not sure why he would hold such a view.

To present his argument in its best light, he says that traditionalists reject rightful authority like the pope and bishops. Based on his experience with exorcisms, he is very big on authority. He has a lot of good things to say on the subject of authority in general, but I think his judgment on traditionalists is at a minimum too sweeping.
 
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Offline Elizabeth.2

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Re: Fr Chad Ripperger quote: I'd like some help understanding it
« Reply #4 on: October 11, 2020, 01:20:00 PM »
He rags on Millennials and dwarves and Trads.   :cheeseheadbeer:  He's checked out the forums, most likely cath-info and who cares?
Overall, he loves us and has a very impressive record of doing something about it.  He fights demons and trains others in this ministry to effective spiritual warfare.  I know I am parody material for traddy trads, scars and all.  He can make fun of me all he likes!! I thank God for him.
 
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Offline Jayne

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Re: Fr Chad Ripperger quote: I'd like some help understanding it
« Reply #5 on: October 11, 2020, 02:02:05 PM »
There are 13 or so of these videos that comprise a discussion between two individuals. (And I need to listen again, and think).

I thought the video you posted was excellent. If the rest of the series is of similar quality, then I should listen to all of them.

I think that understanding Our Modern Condition and our modern situation is exceedingly difficult, demanding and fraught. In the course of my own independent studies, over many years now, I see how far we as moderns have fallen, and I see what the consequences are (my life and upbringing in highly liberal and modern California is a perfect example of what I now must 'combat against' and 'reform'). My processes in all this (excuse the cliché term) have been very intense, very interesting, and yet I am a product of the Modernism that Pius X wrote of in Pascendi.

But what I mean is our entire culture, indeed the *structure of our perception* and in many ways our *perceptual metaphysics* are modernist in the sense Pius X warned.

Exactly.  When something has always surrounded us and we have known nothing else, we are not aware of it.  We absorb its assumptions without any conscious examination.

How does one turn this around? I am thinking now of Richard Weaver's Ideas Have Consequences (a philosophical and metaphysical neo-Platonism that could tend to Catholicism).

Well, there you have it! I just blurted out some material that I literally struggle with every day. It is agonizing in an inner, spiritual sense, but it is not strictly *my own*. That is, this is a shared condition. It is where we are in so many senses. Perhaps not *you-singular* of course.

Note: I use *** as you see more or less as emphasis. I suppose I could underline. I also use ' ' in much the same way. Perhaps I should reform my punctuation! 😂

Thanks you for reading though and please tell me your thoughts. Vitally interested.

As for turning it around, be patient with yourself.  It is a process and it requires time.  You need to expose yourself to ideas that will contrast with your unconscious assumptions and so bring them to light.  The podcast you posted and the encyclical it is based on are good examples, so you have already made a good start.

And you need to strengthen yourself spiritually in order to take on this intellectual work.  If you have access to the traditional Mass and other Sacraments, these, along with prayer, would be the ideal source of strength.

It would also be helpful to have a community of like-minded people with whom you can discuss these matters.  I hope that this forum could serve such a purpose for you.
Jesus, meek and humble of heart, make my heart like unto Thine.
 
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Offline Lyle Bright

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Re: Fr Chad Ripperger quote: I'd like some help understanding it
« Reply #6 on: October 11, 2020, 03:00:41 PM »
Yes, Fr. Ripperger says this a lot in many of his videos. You would have to watch his videos, rather than trying to find the text through google.

I have watched most of his videos, and he presents a lot of good material when he sticks with his strong points of explaining what he has learned through his ministry of expelling demons, but he has a bee in his bonnet on the topic of "traditionalists," which is just his personal opinion, and I believe is misinformed.

I too have watched many of his videos, and I do remember him saying some things about traditionalists. There is another Catholic site (Fish Eaters) that proposes a whole list of possible toxic traits of some traditionalists. It is likely you are aware of that site. But it is different to be a 'toxic trad' than to be essential infused with Modernism in the sense of Pius X.

It seems to me that if one could pay full attention to Pascendi and the meaning there, what it implies as necessary, that one would have little choice but to turn back to traditionalism. But this involves of course the assessment that 'something is amiss in the Church' at the present time. Myself, I began my researches in this area when I read The Destruction of the Christian Tradition by Rama Coomaraswami. That was my starting point to understand the ramifications of the metaphysical shifts of Vatican ll.

It is important that I point out that I am not -- yet -- a Catholic. I live in Colombia but I have not had an easy time at all finding people with whom to communicate. My entire philosophical background and cultural background in extremely different from that of Latin America. Note that there is a Latin Mass community in Bogotá. But I am not in Bogotá. I do not find the normal masses to be at all inspiring.

Catholic Traditionalism at this point in time, based on my reading and observation (a good amount of YouTube video-talks) hinges into many many different political and social concerns and conflicts. For example the advocacy of Church Militant points up the strangeness and dangerousness of the time we are in.

There are currents of confusion and misinformation that are startling.
 
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Offline Lyle Bright

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Re: Fr Chad Ripperger quote: I'd like some help understanding it
« Reply #7 on: October 11, 2020, 03:02:43 PM »
I thought the video you posted was excellent. If the rest of the series is of similar quality, then I should listen to all of them.

I thought so too and felt lucky to have found them. I would also benefit from listing to them again, and rereading Pascendi.
 

Offline Lyle Bright

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Re: Fr Chad Ripperger quote: I'd like some help understanding it
« Reply #8 on: October 11, 2020, 03:10:35 PM »
To present his argument in its best light, he says that traditionalists reject rightful authority like the pope and bishops. Based on his experience with exorcisms, he is very big on authority. He has a lot of good things to say on the subject of authority in general, but I think his judgment on traditionalists is at a minimum too sweeping.

This confuses me a great deal (I mean the entire problem). If an authority becomes corrupt, one is not duty-bound to follow the directives of that authority. My understanding is that one is duty-bound to disobey -- that is if by following a command or order one would sin.

Well, I can make a reference to a very controversial book "The Sword of Christ" by Giles Corey (a pseudonym obviouly as Giles Corey is a figure of American history). I read a wide range of books because the focus of my interest is 'the Culture Wars'. "The Sword of Christ" is an intense and polemical work. And there are many Catholic traditionalists who are venturing into what I can only call *radical territories* of understanding of the meaning of the present.

It is really quite heavy and as I say difficult and fraught. I am vitally interested in any thoughts you-plural have.
 

Offline Lyle Bright

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Re: Fr Chad Ripperger quote: I'd like some help understanding it
« Reply #9 on: October 11, 2020, 03:21:05 PM »
Religion: Unconfirmed in any religion because of unusual upbringing, 'Spiritually' Catholic.

I think I signed up here some years back. I wonder if that is how I put it myself? (It shows to the left of my posts). But this is a good assessment! Though I have been really making efforts to read and understand the fundamentals of Catholic doctrine and fundamentally want to align myself to *it* -- I do not know where *it* is.

I have had the most bizarre experiences here with Catholic priests I approached for help who were so modernist and so opposed to traditional forms (one referred to the traditionalism of the traditional priests still in the Colombian Church as 'tradicionalismo enfermizo' -- sickly traditionalism -- with a gesture of such acute disdain that I was in shock for a number of days.
 
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Offline james03

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Re: Fr Chad Ripperger quote: I'd like some help understanding it
« Reply #10 on: October 11, 2020, 04:28:34 PM »
Quote
To present his argument in its best light, he says that traditionalists reject rightful authority like the pope and bishops.

The irony is that a new bishop came to Tulsa and expelled his order, which was forced to relocate to Denver, I believe.

All in all Fr. Ripperger has done a lot of good.  His talks are excellent and of course he's battling the demonic.  I like the priest, but agree that that remark was too sweeping.  We live in an age of diabolical disorientation.   When a host of bishops and Pope St. John Paul II, The Great, Witchdoctor of the Church and Patron of Islam are covering up for pedophiles, or with a number of bishops, are themselves actual sodomite pedophiles, it's not modernism to question those in authority.
"But he that doth not believe, is already judged: because he believeth not in the name of the only begotten Son of God (Jn 3:18)."

"All sorrow leads to the foot of the Cross.  Weep for your sins."

"Although He should kill me, I will trust in Him"
 
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Offline james03

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Re: Fr Chad Ripperger quote: I'd like some help understanding it
« Reply #11 on: October 11, 2020, 04:30:53 PM »
Quote
How does one turn this around?

A word of caution: find the virtuous mean.  Many a Trad swings too far the other way to compensate for the craziness.  Understandable, but wrong.
"But he that doth not believe, is already judged: because he believeth not in the name of the only begotten Son of God (Jn 3:18)."

"All sorrow leads to the foot of the Cross.  Weep for your sins."

"Although He should kill me, I will trust in Him"
 

Offline james03

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Re: Fr Chad Ripperger quote: I'd like some help understanding it
« Reply #12 on: October 11, 2020, 04:39:43 PM »
Quote
I read a wide range of books because the focus of my interest is 'the Culture Wars'.

If you want to understand the cultural wars, watch the videos with Yuri Bezemenov.  One video is where he is interviewed, and the other is where he gives a lecture.  Start with the interview.

After that, watch videos on the Frankfurt School.  Another book written by a former-leftist jew is entitled "Politics of Bad Faith" by David Horowitz.  There is also "Witness" by Whitaker Chambers and "School of Darkness" by Bella Dodd.
"But he that doth not believe, is already judged: because he believeth not in the name of the only begotten Son of God (Jn 3:18)."

"All sorrow leads to the foot of the Cross.  Weep for your sins."

"Although He should kill me, I will trust in Him"
 

Offline Jayne

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Re: Fr Chad Ripperger quote: I'd like some help understanding it
« Reply #13 on: October 11, 2020, 06:03:11 PM »
To present his argument in its best light, he says that traditionalists reject rightful authority like the pope and bishops. Based on his experience with exorcisms, he is very big on authority. He has a lot of good things to say on the subject of authority in general, but I think his judgment on traditionalists is at a minimum too sweeping.

This confuses me a great deal (I mean the entire problem). If an authority becomes corrupt, one is not duty-bound to follow the directives of that authority. My understanding is that one is duty-bound to disobey -- that is if by following a command or order one would sin.

That does not sound quite right, but perhaps I am not understanding you correctly.  Here is the section of the Summa on obedience: https://www.newadvent.org/summa/3104.htm#article1 Try reading this to see if it brings more clarity to the problem.

Quote from: Lyle Bright
Well, I can make a reference to a very controversial book "The Sword of Christ" by Giles Corey (a pseudonym obviouly as Giles Corey is a figure of American history). I read a wide range of books because the focus of my interest is 'the Culture Wars'. "The Sword of Christ" is an intense and polemical work. And there are many Catholic traditionalists who are venturing into what I can only call *radical territories* of understanding of the meaning of the present.

It is really quite heavy and as I say difficult and fraught. I am vitally interested in any thoughts you-plural have.

I have not read this book, but I found the preface online: https://www.theoccidentalobserver.net/2020/08/11/kevin-macdonalds-preface-to-giles-coreys-the-sword-of-christ/  From this, I have the impression the book deals with themes similar to E. Michael Jones Jewish Revolutionary Spirit.  Are you familiar with this?

Unfortunately, it is often difficult to have a thoughtful discussion of these sorts of issues without it being derailed by accusations of anti-semitism.  You have a better chance of finding a rational discussion on the topic here than most places.  You might want to start a new thread for it, since it seems rather far from where you started with this one.
Jesus, meek and humble of heart, make my heart like unto Thine.
 

Offline Lyle Bright

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Re: Fr Chad Ripperger quote: I'd like some help understanding it
« Reply #14 on: October 11, 2020, 06:10:14 PM »
If you want to understand the cultural wars, watch the videos with Yuri Bezemenov.  One video is where he is interviewed, and the other is where he gives a lecture.  Start with the interview.

Yes, I have of course watched his presentations as well as many other related ones on the topic.

I would say that he has a tremendous, and specific, insight, but I also think his view is reductionist. It implies a 'Russian Op'. But that is far too simple. There is of course a great deal more that could be said on this topic.

I have actually gone a bit further and have read Horkheimer and Adorno and to a lesser extent Antonio Gramsci.

'The Frankfurt School' -- and what this laden term actually means, is complex indeed.
« Last Edit: October 11, 2020, 06:13:10 PM by Lyle Bright »