Author Topic: vigano-speaks-again-on-what-is-to-be-done-with-vatican-ii  (Read 540 times)

Offline Elizabeth.2

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Re: vigano-speaks-again-on-what-is-to-be-done-with-vatican-ii
« Reply #15 on: September 27, 2020, 08:48:40 PM »
Thanks for overlooking my typos, Awkwardcustomer.  :cheeseheadbeer:
 

Offline Miriam_M

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Re: vigano-speaks-again-on-what-is-to-be-done-with-vatican-ii
« Reply #16 on: September 27, 2020, 10:52:03 PM »
I am beginning to believe no one bothered to read what Msgr. Vigano said????

I read it.
 
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Offline St.Justin

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Re: vigano-speaks-again-on-what-is-to-be-done-with-vatican-ii
« Reply #17 on: September 30, 2020, 04:09:43 PM »
What I took from from he said was that the council was so full of lies and subterfuge and manipulation and on that basis alone it is not a valid teaching of the Magisterium. Which is at least to my knowledge a novel way of invalidating the Council. If this is true which sounds completely plausible to me proves that VII is not a true act of the Magisterium.
 

Offline Greg

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Re: vigano-speaks-again-on-what-is-to-be-done-with-vatican-ii
« Reply #18 on: September 30, 2020, 05:43:24 PM »
I would have thought that all councils in history had liars and schemes and plots and various bad bishops trying to manipulate them.  That is the nature of groups. What makes the difference is good people at the top.  Much like the SSPX Society.  If the superior in your region is Father Edward Black it is great.  If it is Fr. Joseph Pfeiffer, it is bloody awful.
 

Offline Michael Wilson

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Re: vigano-speaks-again-on-what-is-to-be-done-with-vatican-ii
« Reply #19 on: September 30, 2020, 06:16:50 PM »
To St. Justin and Greg; the difference between a religious congregation such as the SSPX or any other and the Church, is that the Church is protected from teaching error by the infallible promises of Our Lord; there have always been bad men in the Church and Church Councils have never been free of those who would try to subvert them. But it is the presence of Peter that "confirms his brethren in the faith" and prevents the Councils from going off the rails.
"The World Must Conform to Our Lord and not He to it." Rev. Dennis Fahey CSSP

"My brothers, all of you, if you are condemned to see the triumph of evil, never applaud it. Never say to evil: you are good; to decadence: you are progess; to death: you are life. Sanctify yourselves in the times wherein God has placed you; bewail the evils and the disorders which God tolerates; oppose them with the energy of your works and your efforts, your life uncontaminated by error, free from being led astray, in such a way that having lived here below, united with the Spirit of the Lord, you will be admitted to be made but one with Him forever and ever: But he who is joined to the Lord is one in spirit." Cardinal Pie of Potiers
 

Offline St.Justin

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Re: vigano-speaks-again-on-what-is-to-be-done-with-vatican-ii
« Reply #20 on: September 30, 2020, 09:41:22 PM »
I would have thought that all councils in history had liars and schemes and plots and various bad bishops trying to manipulate them.  That is the nature of groups. What makes the difference is good people at the top.  Much like the SSPX Society.  If the superior in your region is Father Edward Black it is great.  If it is Fr. Joseph Pfeiffer, it is bloody awful.

Lets look at the below as an example. I now the topic is apples and oranges but the core of the how and why for seems pretty solid. So in any case of we can invalidate a Papal election sure it can apply to a council???

"From Universi Dominici Gregis, the document with the special procedural rules for conclaves:

“The Cardinal electors shall further abstain from any form of pact, agreement, promise or other commitment of any kind which could oblige them to give or deny their vote to a person or persons. If this were in fact done, even under oath, I decree that such a commitment shall be null and void and that no one shall be bound to observe it; and I hereby impose the penalty of excommunication latae sententiae upon those who violate this prohibition. It is not my intention however to forbid, during the period in which the See is vacant, the exchange of views concerning the election.”