Author Topic: Contradictions of Modern Satanism  (Read 321 times)

Offline Conclavist

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Contradictions of Modern Satanism
« on: December 29, 2019, 07:57:32 AM »
So I was curious what some of the posters here think of modern Satanist movements, and I will explain why I don't understand the motivations going on with why Satanists say they are Satanist, and I was wondering if anyone had insight on this topic. This was prompted by a new documentary that came out on Satanism I saw promoted online.

What's Satanists' Motivation?

I am assuming that a lot of Satanists are just like kids who grow up in evangelical households and then try to really rebel against their parents as much as they can, so they take on the name of "Satanist". This is about my best guess at what's going on, but I will detail why I find this explanation unsatisfactory.

Atheistic Vs. Theistic Satanism

Firstly, there are "theistic" and "atheistic" Satanists today - some who literally worship Satan as a god, and others who are more just like a kind of independent or libertarian it seems and just want to do whatever they want and not harm others (at least, that's what they say). I think this division may have come about organically as people just disagree with each other and schisms happen, but I have also wondered if this division was created to intentionally muddy the waters about what Satanism is.

How "Intelligent" Are Satanists?

Moving on, one of the outspoken atheistic Satanists, who was spearheading that Baphomet monument in Oklahoma I think, is Lucien Greaves: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucien_Greaves

First "contradiction" I find is that he a Harvard graduate, so he seems "educated". So, some of the Satanist arguments to me seem to be illogical, but here one of their leaders is a Harvard grad, so arguably "intelligent". Arguably being a Harvard grad doesn't necessarily signify too much intelligence as the universities have declined in quality and alternative educational offerings have improved in quality, but bear with me in arguing Mr. Greaves has "reasonable natural intelligence".

Selective Arguments

So from this assumption of "intelligence", we find that Satanists often attack "Christianity" specifically as being "tyrannical", and the Satanists are champions of "religious" freedom in contrast. This is immediately where things start to fall apart to me, because even for the Satanist, how can "religious freedom" mean anything? Does this mean that Satanists believe in the right of people to commit violent crime or abuse children so long as this is done under the banner of "religious freedom"? If not, then there are clearly some limits to "religious expression". But, you might say that I am being unfair to the atheistic Satanists, but who are they to judge what Satanism "really is"? What if there is a theistic Satanist who believes it is his "right" as a Satanist to violate any law, that "do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the law" (this is one Satanist slogan)? So, immediately we find the (atheistic) Satanists getting caught up in traps they have accused others of: they are not for total religious freedom, I assume.

Abortion Contradiction

Also, again, who are they to say what Satanism "truly" is? I remember reading one of their "rules" (who decided what their rules are?) was that they are against harming children, for instance: "In fact, if a Church of Satan member abuses children sexually or otherwise, his membership is automatically terminated without possibility for re-instatement." https://www.churchofsatan.com/faq-fundamental-beliefs/ Ok, but do they realize there are some people who make a secular argument against abortion, that abortion is the violation of rights of the life and freedom of the unborn? So, will there be another schism between pro-abortion and pro-life Satanists? Many of the Satanists I have seen are pro-abortion, but this violates the rights of the individual, which they seem to hold sacred. So, again, who decides what is truly the "party line" in Satanism? They accuse Christians of being "close-minded authoritarians", but aren't they acting like authorities who declare their opinions as fact here as well?

Lack of Consistent Criticism

Another thing that doesn't make sense is the lack of consistency, that many of these Satanists seem to pick a fight with Christianity and ignore other much less tolerant religious groups. Again, I am assuming these Satanists have "reasonable natural intelligence" - aren't they against all religions? So why such a focus on Christians? Also, if you're an atheist of some kind, don't you just want to enjoy life and not think about religion? Why take the name of Satanist - this is basically like "negative advertising" for religion; every time people hear "Satan", they think of God - Satanism in a sense promotes religion. It's almost like if Christians were crafty, they would create Satanist movements to promote Christianity, if that makes any sense? Even non-Christians see Satanic imagery and you see them post online that they usually don't feel religious, but this makes them think there is truly evil in the world and that they should probably start practicing a religion.

Associating With Satan's Bad Reputation As Irrational

Another thing that doesn't really make sense, is that Satan's reputation is pretty bad in many parts of the world, so why would they want to rationally associate with it? Since Satan is considered in league with the worst liars and criminals, why would they be surprised for people to not want to trust their motives or not want to associate with them? Like, if you created a group that was promoting some of the serial killers of today, like a John Wayne Gacy "fan club", would this be expected to be received with open arms? And then expect that people think you have a high moral ground? Again, I don't understand why many Satanists wouldn't just opt for identifying as "humanists", as I definitely don't think all of them are trying to outright be criminals or associate with criminality. I have, however, read some of their reasonings that they think blasphemy helps to "free" them from religion, and rebelling to make them feel free - but, I guess I feel unpersuaded by why they say in light of all the reasons I give here, so I was wondering if anyone had any more thoughts on the topic.

Is Theistic Satanism The Ultimate Contradiction?

Theistic Satanism had me confused from a young age. These people often grow up with some kind of Christian understanding that God is all-powerful and Satan is eternally doomed, but somehow they think they can worship Satan and successfully get away with it. The first question would be if there is some loophole that they really can exploit, to successfully rebel - do they think there is some way to "break away" from God without being punished? As far as I can see, Christianity seems to reject any possibility of a "loophole" existing. But I'm guessing they're calling God's bluff and believe there is actually a loophole, and that Christianity is lying. The other thought that might be accurate, is that maybe Satan is simply selling that deception or lie that such a loophole exists, that they can successfully break away - I assume that's probably closer to the truth. Or, maybe they want to enjoy temporal rebellion, which can actually be "successful", and this blinds their reason about future consequences. Still though, it would seem to me enough of them should be smart enough to put the basic reasoning together of the implications of God's omnipotence for how would-be rebellions would work out.

Countering Satanic Propaganda on Heaven

Another thing I've seen is some Satanist arguments that start creating confusion and muddying waters. A common old one, I don't know if this was in popular classical writings or the pop culture, but the idea was that Satan is a "freedom fighter" and God ends up being this Tyrant who creates people just to enslave them. The portrayal is that heaven is boring, where people are forced to pray to God and work for Him day and night, so Satan is shown as a "hero" who says he will not serve and fights to set up a revolution to establish a kingdom of freedom and prosperity for all. Here is where it seems like belief comes in to the picture, because one would have to look at each side and basically make the decision on who to trust. But in contrast to this distortion of a vision of heaven, the saints have said that the Vision of God is beautiful beyond compare. Having experienced a taste of pure beauty and good things in this world, I could see how heaven could be the exact opposite of how the Satanic picture painted above could be, and of course the Bible says that we haven't experienced what God has prepared for those who love Him. 

Satanic Propaganda on God's Identity

Another Satanist argument I have seen is the argument that the God of the Universe is Satan, and the God of Christianity is a "false god" (like, would be the Devil to them). This can get a bit messy and confusing, as they start to claim that God's violent actions in the Old Testament were that of a regional god unlike how the God of the Universe would act, and they also try to make God out to be capable of good and evil. I forget how or if I found when this argument gained steam or where its best contradiction is, but something that comes to mind is there has been no separate open "Satanic" movement claiming these things since the ancient ages, as far as I'm aware of.

Conclusion

So I basically didn't know what to think of modern Satanism. I think some of its more activist-oriented people must be genuinely confused? I have tried to show a few of the contradictions I found above, and you can find more that I probably forgot to mention. The point is that if you hold them to the same standard they hold others to, they also seem to have problems - and I think they should be smart enough to realize this, so I don't know why they are promoting these ("obvious"?) contradictions.

Ultimately, how do you think Catholics should respond to modern Satanism? Again, the modern atheistic Satanism seems more like "Satanism in name only" as it is more of an image or label they are putting on humanism and atheism. Theistic Satanism or actually worshiping Satan as a god, I don't think is happening much or where it is it is probably done quietly.

I guess I just think that Catholics shouldn't be lured in to protesting these Satanic monuments too much as I think these modern Satanist groups are just trying to offend them (not that we shouldn't try to remove the monuments). And also, I think that we should stick to the issues and can show how Satanism has logical problems, and maybe get Satanists to rethink Satanism if we make mention of those problems.

Thoughts?
 

Offline gsas

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Re: Contradictions of Modern Satanism
« Reply #1 on: December 30, 2019, 04:42:55 PM »
There is a real answer about Satanism, although it is heretic.  A physical fact, heretic or not.  This is how it is.  We all know from the Bible that satan is an imitator.  Any artist can imitate, for example you can simply make a model airplane or doll or digital game or whatever.  That is your creation.  Ultimately it too is God's creation, but immediately it is your creation.  And as you create it, you define what functions you put into it, what the character should be able to do or not to do.  Most people are created by God and it is as simple as that, no complication to the story.  But probably up to 20 % of people are not created by God, they are imitations.  Their souls are created by satan, and they can only do, thing, feel, and reason what satan put into them.  These are the Satanists.  No amount of rehabilitation, nurturing, reasoning, teaching, love, sanctifying grace, or anything Godly will ever stick to them.  And like the saints of Christ, who don't ever stop saving everything, they too will not stop, until they torture and destroy everything that they can access, be it in past or future.  These are the Satanists, and they will exploit everything in God's creation to maximize pain and suffering, by dark magic at minimum, which people who are created by God can't even imagine or invent.  A lot of the Satanist magic trickeries are described in the oral Talmud, which the elect of satan can remember and apply when and as directed by the devil. 
 

Offline Non Nobis

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Re: Contradictions of Modern Satanism
« Reply #2 on: December 31, 2019, 12:37:40 AM »
Satan is a liar,  gsas.  A heresy is a lie. You are believing Satan's lies about his own power.   :pray1: God help you.
[Matthew 8:26]  And Jesus saith to them: Why are you fearful, O ye of little faith? Then rising up he commanded the winds, and the sea, and there came a great calm.

[Job  38:1-5]  Then the Lord answered Job out of a whirlwind, and said: [2] Who is this that wrappeth up sentences in unskillful words? [3] Gird up thy loins like a man: I will ask thee, and answer thou me. [4] Where wast thou when I laid up the foundations of the earth? tell me if thou hast understanding. [5] Who hath laid the measures thereof, if thou knowest? or who hath stretched the line upon it?

Jesus, Mary, I love Thee! Save souls!
 
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Offline Xavier

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Re: Contradictions of Modern Satanism
« Reply #3 on: December 31, 2019, 07:57:55 AM »
GSAS, Satan is a beaten, crushed, defeated, embarrassed foe. He has been beaten by the Cross of Christ, his head has been crushed by the Immaculate foot of Our Lady; exorcists say the Precious Blood, dispensed through the Sacraments especially of Confession and Communion, to be frequently received, are of course extremely powerful in protecting us from all demonic influence and demonic thinking. We ought also to invoke frequently the power of the Precious Blood over ourselves, our family, our loved ones etc in prayer. We recall in Scripture the angel of death had no power over the families consecrated by the blood of the Lamb; when we have received Holy Communion, the door of our beings is marked with that Precious Blood. We can receive the Lord's Blood again and again in Spiritual Communion through prayer, love, ardent and burning desire for union with Him. The greater and greater will be the protection every time.

As for Our Lady, we recall the ancient Promise, "She will crush your head". When St. Dominic and the Faithful all together prayed the Rosary, as families, parishes and communities, the 15,000 devils that had entered the blaspheming heretic all by one and one fully left. We would all do very well to pray 15 decades - the full Rosary; 5 decades, in Church Terminology, is a part of the Rosary. So, when Our Lady asked for the Rosary at Fatima, She was asking, if possible, for 15 decades every day - together with our family every day. Let us also invite the Angels, Saints and Holy Souls in Purgatory to pray for us and pray with us the Rosary. But if not possible, we can begin with 5. We ought also to consecrate ourselves to Our Lady's Immaculate Heart, as Satan loses all power over what is consecrated to Her. And the best visible sign of Consecration to Our Lady is the Scapular. So, let us wear the Scapular, and the Rosary too if possible.

Satan is also terribly defeated whenever we invoke St. Michael the Archangel, of whom he was a terrible and frightful fear. We can repeat often the St. Michael's prayer in time of temptation, or at least "Sancte Michael Archangale, defende nos in praelio." many times. St. Michael the Archangel was the one who remained unwaveringly faithful to God, and to Our Lady's Cause, when the wicked and apostate angels, rebelled against the Most High God, and sought to fight against the Almighty and the holy Angels. Thus, by the Mercy and Grace of God, and the faithfulness and efforts of St. Michael, 2/3rds at least of the Angels remained faithful. Finally, Pope Leo XIII highly commended this devotion to St. Michael's protection, as we know; and it is also foretold in Sacred Scripture that, in these times, St. Michael the Archangel will rise up mightily in defense of the Church and God's People, and bind Satan in a pit. Rev. Father Venerable Bartholomew Holzhauser also mentions that in his commentary on the Apocalypse, just before the Period of Peace.

Finally, among human Saints, after Our Lady; the enemy fears no one so much as St. Joseph, terror of demons, whose power utterly embarasses and humiliates him. All in all, consecrate yourself to the Holy Family. God has asked that the Most Pure Heart of St. Joseph be more venerated and loved, especially on First Wednesdays; the First Day of this New Year 2020 we're going to celebrate is a First Wednesday. Love the triune hearts, and surrender all to their care. And they will take care of everything. It's the devil that wants to depress and worry us. Christians should be marked instead by hope, by peace, by joy, by freedom from unnecessary worry. God is Good and Loves us and is All-Powerful. Satan never has any power over the children of God, who love God, Our Lady and the Saints.

Edit: Pope John XXIII on the Precious Blood of Jesus, "Unlimited is the effectiveness of the God-Man's Blood - just as unlimited as the love that impelled him to pour it out for us, first at his circumcision eight days after birth, and more profusely later on in his agony in the garden, in his scourging and crowning with thorns, in his climb to Calvary and crucifixion, and finally from out of that great wide wound in his side which symbolizes the divine Blood cascading down into all the Church's sacraments. Such surpassing love suggests, nay demands, that everyone reborn in the torrents of that Blood adore it with grateful love." https://www.preciousbloodinternational.com/prayers_01.html
« Last Edit: December 31, 2019, 08:18:14 AM by Xavier »
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