Author Topic: Lepanto and Islamist persecution of 100s of millions of Christians today.  (Read 305 times)

Offline Xavier

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A recent report showed 215 million Christians are persecuted around the world and the vast majority of it comes from the sect of the apostate Mohammed. We recently celebrated the feast of Our Lady of Lepanto. How is the Christian world going to respond to this nearly universal Islamist persecution of Christians? If Christians were strong and united, we can stop persecution

Sanctions and other pressure should be imposed on Islamist nations that fancy they can keep persecuting Christians. Very serious efforts to evangelize and baptize Muslims and bring them to Christ and His Church should be made. Catholic prophesy suggests Islamism will play a major role in ww3. Some suggest Mohammed is the Biblical false Prophet who prepares the way for Antichrist. What Belloc called "the great and enduring heresy of Mohammed" needs to be crushed under Our Lady's heel.

In the long run, the West has to get its act together quickly, put an end to sin and rebellion against God, and restore the Kingship of Christ and the Queenship of Mary.  https://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/11775/persecuted-christians-open-doors

Jesus and Mary won victory for Christians at Lepanto. Today, we do not deserve such favors and protection because the once-Christian world is neither holy, perfectly faithful to God, nor strongly Christian and united to the Church. We need to do penance and return to God - and one day, we should strive to banish this heresy forever from the face of the earth.

"In short, the overwhelming majority of persecution that these 215 million Christians experience around the world — especially the worst forms, such as rape and murder — occurs at the hands of Muslims.

If time is on the side of Christians living under Communist regimes, it is not on the side of Christians living under Islam. The center of the great Christian Byzantine Empire is now an increasingly intolerant, rapidly Islamizing Turkey. Carthage, once a bastion of Christianity — where one of Christendom's greatest theologians, St. Augustine, was born and where the New Testament canon was confirmed in 397 — is today 99% Muslim-majority Tunisia.

As what began in the seventh century comes closer to fruition and the entire world becomes more Islamic and "infidel" free, as in Iraq, confronting these uncomfortable facts is at least a welcome first step in countering the problem.

"215 million Christians experience high levels of persecution" around the world, according to Open Doors, a human rights organization. On its recently released World Watch List 2018, which ranks the world's 50 worst nations wherein to be Christian, 3,066 Christians were killed, 1,252 abducted, and 1,020 raped or sexually harassed on account of their faith; and 793 churches were attacked or destroyed.

The Islamic world had the lion's share of this persecution; 38 of the 50 worst nations are Muslim-majority. The report further cites "Islamic oppression" behind the "extreme persecution" that prevails in eight of the 10 worst nations. In short, the overwhelming majority of persecution that these 215 million Christians experience around the world — especially the worst forms, such as rape and murder — occurs at the hands of Muslims."
Mary, our Heavenly Mother, implores those who receive Holy Communion Daily, or at least Weekly, to Offer their Lives. TEXT OF THE LIFE OFFERING: "My dear Jesus, before the Holy Trinity, Our Heavenly Mother, and the whole Heavenly Court, united with Your most Precious Blood and Your Sacrifice on Calvary, I hereby Offer my whole Life to the Intention of Your Sacred Heart and to the Immaculate Heart of Mary. Together with my life, I place at Your disposal all Holy Masses, all my Holy Communions, all Rosaries, all acts of consecration, all my good deeds, all my sacrifices, and the suffering of my entire life for the Adoration and Supplication of the Holy Trinity, for Unity in our Holy Mother Church, for the Holy Father and Priests, for good Priestly vocations, and for all souls until the end of the world. O my Jesus, please accept my life Sacrifice and my offerings and give me Your grace that I may persevere obediently until my death." Amen. https://www.avemariamaternostra.com/life-offering-promises.html It is recommended that you make this Life Offering as soon as you feel ready, and to renew it from time to time.

Please read the Blessed Mother's promises in the link: those who make it seriously will face no Purgatory (promise 5) since they would have completed it here, will have all their loved ones released from Purgatory the day they offer their life with intent to persevere (promise 4), and can save the souls of all their family members in due time by their life offering (promise 3). It will benefit all souls who have ever lived until time's end (promise 2) A simple effective way for thousands of us to save millions of souls. Inflamed in Large Letters of Love, you will have your name written in the Hearts of Jesus and Mary forever (promise 1).
 
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Offline Kaesekopf

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Mohammad was christian originally?

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Offline Gardener

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He was a pagan. There is some evidence he had a distant relative or perhaps an acquaintance who was Nestorian and might have influenced his thinking on Christ, though the Islamic understanding is more Arian than Nestorian.

To consider Mohammed an apostate would be a loose understanding, etymologically.

One could also make the argument that he was a syncretic apostate, first going to the Jews as a prophetic fulfillment, thus aligning himself with them, and when rejected, the Christians, who also rejected him. Thus, he loosely, though informally, rejected and stood apart from Christianity. Not a row I would hoe, personally.

However, some of the Fathers definitely considered Islam to be a Christian heresy which was syncretic in its approach. But Mohammed himself was never Baptized nor did he hold any actual affiliation with Christianity.
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Offline Vetus Ordo

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He was a pagan. There is some evidence he had a distant relative or perhaps an acquaintance who was Nestorian and might have influenced his thinking on Christ, though the Islamic understanding is more Arian than Nestorian.

He was an Arian or Nestorian monk called Bahira, in the Arabic and Syriac sources, or Sergius in the Latin sources. According to standard Islamic tradition, the encounter with this monk in Syria is said to have occurred when Muhammad was just 9 or 10 years old. In fact, this encounter is highlighted because Bahira tells Abu Talib, Muhammad's uncle, that the boy was to become a prophet.

Later, Christian writers hypothesized that the meeting in fact occurred much later and that Muhammad's religious views, as an adult, were likely influenced by this monk. The historicity of any such event is disputable, though. In my opinion, it is much more likely that Muhammad, and the first Muslim generation that shaped canonical Islam, received many more religious inputs from Syria than just a monk's opinion.

There was another character, an actual relative of Muhammad's, that was a Christian called Waraka ibn Nawfal. He was one of the first people to believe in Muhammad's prophethood. A known narration from Aisha describes it in detail:

Khadija then accompanied him to her cousin Waraqa bin Naufal bin Asad bin 'Abdul 'Uzza, who, during the Pre-Islamic Period became a Christian and used to write the writing with Hebrew letters. He would write from the Gospel in Hebrew as much as God wished him to write. He was an old man and had lost his eyesight. Khadija said to Waraqa, "Listen to the story of your nephew, O my cousin!" Waraqa asked, "O my nephew! What have you seen?" God's Apostle described whatever he had seen. Waraqa said, "This was the same one who keeps the secrets whom Allah had sent to Moses (angel Gabriel). I wish I were young and could live up to the time when your people would turn you out." God's Apostle asked, "Will they drive me out?" Waraqa replied in the affirmative and said, "Anyone (man) who came with something similar to what you have brought was treated with hostility; and if I should remain alive till the day when you will be turned out then I would support you strongly." But after a few days Waraqa died and the Divine Inspiration was also paused for a while.
ΠΙΣΤΟΣ Ο ΛΟΓΟΣ ΚΑΙ ΠΑΣΗΣ ΑΠΟΔΟΧΗΣ ΑΞΙΟΣ, ΟΤΙ ΧΡΙΣΤΟΣ ΙΗΣΟΥΣ ΗΛΘΕΝ ΕΙΣ ΤΟΝ ΚΟΣΜΟΝ ΑΜΑΡΤΩΛΟΥΣ ΣΩΣΑΙ: ΩΝ ΠΡΩΤΟΣ ΕΙΜΙ ΕΓΩ
 
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Offline Xavier

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The destruction of the death cult of Islamism (not to mention the sex slavery and concubinage and other vile things endorsed by Mohammed - there are horrible, horrible reports of those who were reduced to sex slaves by isis very recently) is of the utmost importance. St. John Damascene wrote an excellent refutation of the heresy of Mohammed here. http://orthodoxinfo.com/general/stjohn_islam.aspx

He points out (1) every true Prophet is known by supernatural signs like miracles and prophesies - he gives the example of Moses, and proves Christ is God from the Prophets of old and, (2) according to their own admission, their false prophet who revived the Arian heresy, never could.

" But when we ask: ‘And who is there to testify that God gave him the book? And which of the prophets foretold that such a prophet would rise up?’—they are at a loss. And we remark that Moses received the Law on Mount Sinai, with God appearing in the sight of all the people in cloud, and fire, and darkness, and storm. And we say that all the Prophets from Moses on down foretold the coming of Christ and how Christ God (and incarnate Son of God) was to come and to be crucified and die and rise again, and how He was to be the judge of the living and dead. Then, when we say: ‘How is it that this prophet of yours did not come in the same way, with others bearing witness to him? And how is it that God did not in your presence present this man with the book to which you refer, even as He gave the Law to Moses, with the people looking on and the mountain smoking, so that you, too, might have certainty?’ ... ‘How is it that when he enjoined us in this book of yours not to do anything or receive anything without witnesses, you did not ask him: “First do you show us by witnesses that you are a prophet and that you have come from God, and show us just what Scriptures there are that testify about you”’—they are ashamed and remain silent." Here, we have the refutation of Islamism. St. Thomas reasons along similar lines in Summa Contra Gentiles. Supernatural signs like the miracles Jesus worked are clear indicators of God's presence. Their manifest absence shows a deception.

Is Mohammed a heretic or an apostate? That's only a technicality, but heretic is usually reserved for those who deny some article of faith after Baptism. Mohammed renounced Baptism itself and so it seems apostate can be fittingly applied to him; then there is St. Thomas, "If anyone were to worship at the tomb of Mohammed, he would be deemed an apostate". The Popes remind Christian kings of their duty to prevent the sect of Mohammed from spreading. Christ calls us to pray and work for the conversion and salvation of our Muslim friends.

I know Muslims who have come to Christ and His Church. In evangelizing Muslims, we can start with Jesus, Whom they believe to be a Prophet but not God. We can show He testified of Himself that He is God, and they themselves know prophets do not lie. Then, they also consider him Christ, i.e. the Messiah, (though some Islamist schools are ambiguous on this and believe in more than one messiah - including a future prophesied figure who will "break the Crosses" - this will likely be the anti-Christ; but average Muslims won't deny Jesus is the Messiah), and we can show from prophesy (e.g. the famous one of King David in Psa 109 - they say they believe King David was a prophet) that the Messiah was to be God. Finally, we can begin with Our Lady, whom they claim to believe was a holy Woman though not Mother of God. Islam denies, hates and fears the Cross and believes someone else was crucified in Jesus' place. But in response, we can tell them, the crucifixion of Christ under Pilate is the best documented fact in history, and His Mother was an eyewitness to it. The more Muslims convert to Christ, the quicker the promised period of peace will come.
Mary, our Heavenly Mother, implores those who receive Holy Communion Daily, or at least Weekly, to Offer their Lives. TEXT OF THE LIFE OFFERING: "My dear Jesus, before the Holy Trinity, Our Heavenly Mother, and the whole Heavenly Court, united with Your most Precious Blood and Your Sacrifice on Calvary, I hereby Offer my whole Life to the Intention of Your Sacred Heart and to the Immaculate Heart of Mary. Together with my life, I place at Your disposal all Holy Masses, all my Holy Communions, all Rosaries, all acts of consecration, all my good deeds, all my sacrifices, and the suffering of my entire life for the Adoration and Supplication of the Holy Trinity, for Unity in our Holy Mother Church, for the Holy Father and Priests, for good Priestly vocations, and for all souls until the end of the world. O my Jesus, please accept my life Sacrifice and my offerings and give me Your grace that I may persevere obediently until my death." Amen. https://www.avemariamaternostra.com/life-offering-promises.html It is recommended that you make this Life Offering as soon as you feel ready, and to renew it from time to time.

Please read the Blessed Mother's promises in the link: those who make it seriously will face no Purgatory (promise 5) since they would have completed it here, will have all their loved ones released from Purgatory the day they offer their life with intent to persevere (promise 4), and can save the souls of all their family members in due time by their life offering (promise 3). It will benefit all souls who have ever lived until time's end (promise 2) A simple effective way for thousands of us to save millions of souls. Inflamed in Large Letters of Love, you will have your name written in the Hearts of Jesus and Mary forever (promise 1).
 

Offline Gardener

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One of the members here... sojourn? was Muslim before he converted. Though he was naqshbandi/sufi, so probably considered a heretic himself by most Muslims prior to his conversion  :cheeseheadbeer:
"And what use are the victories on the battlefield if we are ourselves are defeated in our innermost personal selves?" - St. Maximilian Kolbe
 

Offline Vetus Ordo

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One of the members here... sojourn? was Muslim before he converted. Though he was naqshbandi/sufi, so probably considered a heretic himself by most Muslims prior to his conversion  :cheeseheadbeer:

The naqshbandi tariqa is highly respected. In fact, it is one of the largest and most influential Sufi orders to this very day.

They're not considered heretics, as far I know. While there has been some historical tension between Sufis and Sunnis throughout history, for the most part they have cooperated as brothers in faith.
ΠΙΣΤΟΣ Ο ΛΟΓΟΣ ΚΑΙ ΠΑΣΗΣ ΑΠΟΔΟΧΗΣ ΑΞΙΟΣ, ΟΤΙ ΧΡΙΣΤΟΣ ΙΗΣΟΥΣ ΗΛΘΕΝ ΕΙΣ ΤΟΝ ΚΟΣΜΟΝ ΑΜΑΡΤΩΛΟΥΣ ΣΩΣΑΙ: ΩΝ ΠΡΩΤΟΣ ΕΙΜΙ ΕΓΩ
 

Offline Vetus Ordo

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He points out (1) every true Prophet is known by supernatural signs like miracles and prophesies - he gives the example of Moses, and proves Christ is God from the Prophets of old and, (2) according to their own admission, their false prophet who revived the Arian heresy, never could.

I would add two things:

1. Canonical Islamic tradition ascribes an almost innumerable account of miracles to Muhammad: the splitting of the moon; the miraculous night journey to Jerusalem; several prophecies that were later confirmed (conquest of Constantinople, conquest of Persia, etc.); miraculously quenching the thirst of thousands of his soldiers during the Battle of Tabouk; spitting into Ali's sick eye, during the Battle of Khaybar, to cure it; causing it to rain during a drought in Medina; he did not cast a shadow of his own, etc.

2. Islam's view of Christ is vastly inferior to that of Arianism, so I would point out that it's a mistake to classify it as a revival of the Arian heresy. In Arianism Christ is still the Son of God, begotten in time past (not unbegotten), inferior to the Father, but superior to all creation, not a mere human prophet in the same way Moses, Abraham or Noah were. On the other hand, In Islam Christ is a mere man. Endowed with certain privileges like the virgin birth, being called the spirit of God, etc., but ultimately nothing more than a man like all previous prophets.
ΠΙΣΤΟΣ Ο ΛΟΓΟΣ ΚΑΙ ΠΑΣΗΣ ΑΠΟΔΟΧΗΣ ΑΞΙΟΣ, ΟΤΙ ΧΡΙΣΤΟΣ ΙΗΣΟΥΣ ΗΛΘΕΝ ΕΙΣ ΤΟΝ ΚΟΣΜΟΝ ΑΜΑΡΤΩΛΟΥΣ ΣΩΣΑΙ: ΩΝ ΠΡΩΤΟΣ ΕΙΜΙ ΕΓΩ
 

Offline Prayerful

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Mohammad was christian originally?

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Mohammad appears to have in his head a mash of doctrine from the Church of the East, or Nestorians, together with Judaism, Eastern Orthodoxy, Arabic paganism, perhaps Zoroastrianism, but that Quran was compiles from a vast array of oral sources. Quite the early Islam might have been more of a Christian heresy, which it was to St John Damascene, and when later a canonical Islamic text was complete, there was a greater distancing.
But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach a gospel to you besides that which we have preached to you, let him be anathema.

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Offline Gardener

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One of the members here... sojourn? was Muslim before he converted. Though he was naqshbandi/sufi, so probably considered a heretic himself by most Muslims prior to his conversion  :cheeseheadbeer:

The naqshbandi tariqa is highly respected. In fact, it is one of the largest and most influential Sufi orders to this very day.

They're not considered heretics, as far I know. While there has been some historical tension between Sufis and Sunnis throughout history, for the most part they have cooperated as brothers in faith.

It was my impression that Sufism of any stripe is seen as suspect by a lot of Muslims.
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Offline Vetus Ordo

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Re: Lepanto and Islamist persecution of 100s of millions of Christians today.
« Reply #10 on: October 10, 2018, 09:29:41 PM »
One of the members here... sojourn? was Muslim before he converted. Though he was naqshbandi/sufi, so probably considered a heretic himself by most Muslims prior to his conversion  :cheeseheadbeer:

The naqshbandi tariqa is highly respected. In fact, it is one of the largest and most influential Sufi orders to this very day.

They're not considered heretics, as far I know. While there has been some historical tension between Sufis and Sunnis throughout history, for the most part they have cooperated as brothers in faith.

It was my impression that Sufism of any stripe is seen as suspect by a lot of Muslims.

It is true, depending also on the historical contexts, but not to the point of heresy.

For instance, Sufis were one of the major forces behind Ottoman civilization which was Orthodox Sunni.
ΠΙΣΤΟΣ Ο ΛΟΓΟΣ ΚΑΙ ΠΑΣΗΣ ΑΠΟΔΟΧΗΣ ΑΞΙΟΣ, ΟΤΙ ΧΡΙΣΤΟΣ ΙΗΣΟΥΣ ΗΛΘΕΝ ΕΙΣ ΤΟΝ ΚΟΣΜΟΝ ΑΜΑΡΤΩΛΟΥΣ ΣΩΣΑΙ: ΩΝ ΠΡΩΤΟΣ ΕΙΜΙ ΕΓΩ
 

Offline mikemac

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Re: Lepanto and Islamist persecution of 100s of millions of Christians today.
« Reply #11 on: October 11, 2018, 01:29:38 PM »
Many seem to wrongly believe that Sufism is the peaceful side of Islam, but that is far from the truth according to this report.

Sufism - The Real and Violent History
http://www.kamakotimandali.com/blog/index.php?p=1417&more=1&c=1&tb=1&pb=1
Like John Vennari (RIP) said "Why not just do it?  What would it hurt?"
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"We would be mistaken to think that Fatima’s prophetic mission is complete." Benedict XVI May 13, 2010

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Offline Vetus Ordo

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Re: Lepanto and Islamist persecution of 100s of millions of Christians today.
« Reply #12 on: October 11, 2018, 02:33:25 PM »
Many seem to wrongly believe that Sufism is the peaceful side of Islam, but that is far from the truth according to this report.

Sufism - The Real and Violent History
http://www.kamakotimandali.com/blog/index.php?p=1417&more=1&c=1&tb=1&pb=1

Sufism is merely the mystical side of Islam.

It does not stray from canonical Islam on issues such as war, state administration, conversions, etc.
ΠΙΣΤΟΣ Ο ΛΟΓΟΣ ΚΑΙ ΠΑΣΗΣ ΑΠΟΔΟΧΗΣ ΑΞΙΟΣ, ΟΤΙ ΧΡΙΣΤΟΣ ΙΗΣΟΥΣ ΗΛΘΕΝ ΕΙΣ ΤΟΝ ΚΟΣΜΟΝ ΑΜΑΡΤΩΛΟΥΣ ΣΩΣΑΙ: ΩΝ ΠΡΩΤΟΣ ΕΙΜΙ ΕΓΩ
 

Offline mikemac

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Re: Lepanto and Islamist persecution of 100s of millions of Christians today.
« Reply #13 on: October 11, 2018, 07:19:28 PM »
Yeah, still by the sword according to that article.
Like John Vennari (RIP) said "Why not just do it?  What would it hurt?"
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Offline Vetus Ordo

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Re: Lepanto and Islamist persecution of 100s of millions of Christians today.
« Reply #14 on: October 14, 2018, 10:14:16 PM »
Yeah, still by the sword according to that article.

In a sense, mostly by the sword.

But it would be incorrect to describe Islamic conversions as a mere product of political and social pressure. There has been genuine preaching by word and example as well.
ΠΙΣΤΟΣ Ο ΛΟΓΟΣ ΚΑΙ ΠΑΣΗΣ ΑΠΟΔΟΧΗΣ ΑΞΙΟΣ, ΟΤΙ ΧΡΙΣΤΟΣ ΙΗΣΟΥΣ ΗΛΘΕΝ ΕΙΣ ΤΟΝ ΚΟΣΜΟΝ ΑΜΑΡΤΩΛΟΥΣ ΣΩΣΑΙ: ΩΝ ΠΡΩΤΟΣ ΕΙΜΙ ΕΓΩ