Author Topic: Xavier's M.O.  (Read 2884 times)

Offline Quaremerepulisti

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Re: Xavier's M.O.
« Reply #15 on: September 02, 2018, 09:55:57 PM »
Far from it.  It's simply that you have your own definition of indefectibility, which is faulty -- i.e., not the Catholic orthodox understanding of it.  You begin with a fallacy.

Not so.  I understand it quite well, thank you.  Facts and logic aren't any more on your side than the scientific evidence is for the YECs.  But feel free to contribute on the thread I started on this topic.

 

Offline dellery

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Re: Xavier's M.O.
« Reply #16 on: September 02, 2018, 09:59:31 PM »
Whatever one's opinion on Xavier's MO is, if he was able to provoke Quare into making this embarrassing bitch-post he's doing something right. lol
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Offline Michael Wilson

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Re: Xavier's M.O.
« Reply #17 on: September 02, 2018, 10:19:02 PM »
Quare stated:
Quote
That's a contradiction, if Scotus is right.  If Christ would've been made incarnate even without a Fall, then you can't say His purpose (absolutely and simply) was to redeem us; otherwise He would not have come, as the Thomists say.
St. Thomas does concede that the Incarnation could have happened without the fall; only that because of the fall, the purpose of the Incarnation was for the purpose of the redemption. I also agree with Scotus.
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Offline John Lamb

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Re: Xavier's M.O.
« Reply #18 on: September 03, 2018, 04:53:50 AM »
The main point I'd make to Catholic ("theistic") evolutionists is that they ought to step back from the scientific question for a moment, and try to take in the sheer Satanic darkness of billions of souls, made in the image of God, believing that they are spirit-less beasts, and that God's creation is actually a crudely and wastefully formed accident. It's so sick and twisted for a human soul to imagine that it's just a beast, that you have to seriously consider whether a theory which has led many into this gross error can be trusted. As my sister once said to me, "I don't believe in God, I believe in the Big Bang and Evolution," i.e. she believes life and the entire order of the cosmos are accidental effects of particle interactions, that there is no (spiritual) substance to our lives.

The lack of suspicion towards the theory of evolution on the part of Catholics shows that they have been swept up in the Enlightenment project and the momentum of human progress, and that they are embarrassed about or afraid of the Church seeming to be against this project or lagging behind its progress. At the very least, evolution should be regarded with suspicion: a theory that started with the ancient Hindus, was modified by the ancient Greeks, and was picked up again in the era of anti-Catholic revolution to cement the greatest apostasy in Church history. Do you not suspect the devil's involvement at all?

If the evolutionary account of creation is true, I cannot see why God wouldn't have put it into the book of Genesis. I find the idea that "the ancient Hebrews were ignorant, and it was written in a way adapted to their understanding" insulting. The ancient Hindus were "intelligent enough" to come up with the idea of evolution all by themselves, apparently, so why couldn't God have told the Hebrews, "I made the earth slowly over many eons"? What's difficult to understand about that? If God created the world and sent the prophets to tell us about it, why couldn't He have made his prophets tell the truth, and spare us the calamity thousands of years later of the scientists apparently discovering that the biblical cosmology is a hoax? It doesn't make sense. This is why I share with the fundamentalist Protestants the principle that the Bible should be our first text or "interpretative lens" for understanding the world and its history, and that human science ought to follow it and not the other way around. At the end of the day I trust God and His prophets more than these modern scientists, who want me to believe I'm a hairless ape and that I'm a "homophobic" bigot for thinking there's a divine & natural law.

In reality, evolution is a Hindu theory through & through. It only makes sense with a Hindu theology which posits that there are three principles in God: a creator (Brahma), a preserver (Vishnu), and a destroyer (Shiva). The universe takes billions of years to evolve because these principles are "battling" and unfolding themselves gradually in the world. The Hindus worship death and destruction under the aspect of Shiva because they deem these principles as equally divine as life and creation. This is the proper theological conclusion to evolutionism: a cult which deifies death. Modern thinkers like Hegel and Teilhard de Chardin have revived it. It's not acceptable to a Christian.
« Last Edit: September 03, 2018, 04:57:11 AM by John Lamb »
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Offline Xavier

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Re: Xavier's M.O.
« Reply #19 on: September 03, 2018, 08:36:10 AM »
Laughable. This from the man who said Y-chromosomal Adam could have been an ape! You people assume evolution to prove evolution.

And Heinrich, you are immeasurably more scientifically literate than is GloriaPatri. Despite his grandiose claims and petulant attempts at poor insults, everyone can see for themselves on this thread, where there was a productive, engaging, interesting discussion by many posters, GloriaPatri did not even attempt to respond to simple questions asked of him that posed problems to his evolutionary assumptions, after saying he would do so. https://www.suscipedomine.com/forum/index.php?topic=20429.15

And some of this is really funny! On the Noah thread, some of you are presupposing your own views that God was this poor, passive spectator that really is prevented from taking any action to protect the one He has chosen. That's not even remotely accurate. Even if it was one of us, we would have assisted Noah in ways we could to survive and complete the trip. How much more would God have provided for Noah before and after the journey. The real question there was this - did the Himalayas form after or before the marine fossils buried there? Till recently, evolutionists used to claim the Himalayas formed 70 million years ago, if that is true, the fossils they date to 50 million and 30 million years were buried there after the flood. I don't know the answer to each and every question, that's what science is for, and that will take time to research, which I'm open to. But there are many creation science models that have attempted reasonable answers for these things. Evolutionists need to tell us a date range first and not change their story every few years. The flood happened 5000 years ago and its record has remained constant for at least 3500 years since the Prophet Moses.



And here's the thing. Like John Lamb, if someone firmly believes in Intelligent Design and Creation across some period of time, I won't argue with him. But I can't help but notice some people to whom defense of evolution became more important than belief in Christianity gradually lost faith in Christ along the way. That's what evolution frequently does, it acts like a slow poison that turns man against God. The Church tolerates theistic evolution, Pope Pius XII said this, but he also told those who work in the sacred and natural sciences not to proceed as if revelation says nothing on the subject, and always to be ready to retract one's opinion and submit to the Church's judgment in the case of a future dogmatic definition. That is enough.

A young man growing into a man. That is development. An ape becoming a man or a particle becoming a person, that is evolution and it is false. Evolution is an essentially modernistic doctrine and evolution inevitably makes the mind incapable of adhering immutably to unchangeable truth. That's why evolution of doctrine itself is part of modernism and anyone who speaks of sacred doctrine being "empirically falsified" (as if the testimony of God, Who is Truth Himself, could ever be falsified) has already swallowed the modernist pill.

But at the end of the day, it's up to you. We can only warn you that the Faith is the most precious thing you have and you needlessly put it in danger when you uncritically accept evolutionary absurdities. We can try to help you to a point, but if you insist on denying God itself if necessary to support evolution, then you place your own soul in danger of eternal loss. What do we gain if you believe in creation or not? If you know and believe God created you and is your Father, you will love Him, and be filled with humility and gratitude toward Him; if you think you are the product more or less of a random unguided process over "millions of years", chances are, and experience shows, souls grow cold toward God and sometimes hate or speak temerariously against Infinite Goodness. That's why evolution is dangerous.

Prov 9:12 "If thou be wise, thou shalt be so to thyself: and if a scorner, thou alone shalt bear the evil."

A Creation Science textbook warned long ago: "So baneful has been the effect of teaching evolution as a proven hypothesis, that multitudes have been led into infidelity and atheism. Prof. James H. Leuba, of Bryn Mawr College, Pa. sent a questionnaire to 1000 of the most prominent scientists teaching sciences relating to evolution. The replies indicate that more than one-half do not believe in a personal God, nor the immortality of the soul--beliefs almost universal even in the heathen world ... A doctrine so abhorrent to the conscience, so contrary to the well nigh universal belief, and so fruitful of evil, certainly can not be true. Small wonder is it that students are fast becoming infidels and atheists, and we shudder as we think of the coming generation ... Note the steady and rapid growth of infidelity and atheism as a result of this pernicious theory ... Can a theory that is consistent with false theories, like chance and atheism be true? Truth is consistent with truth, but not with falsehood. We can judge a theory by the company it keeps. Evolution naturally affiliates with false theories rather than with the truth. It favors infidelity and atheism. A theory in perfect harmony with manifest error, raises a presumption against its truth. Evolution seems to have a natural attraction for erroneous hypotheses and manifests the closest kinship with impossible theories. This is not a mark of a true theory."
« Last Edit: September 03, 2018, 08:44:35 AM by Xavier »
Please listen to the frequent messages and take heed of the directions given from Our Living Lord and Our Loving Lady from around the world here: https://maryrefugeofholylove.com/ Great things are at stake. Please consecrate your life to the Blessed Mother so that the Kingdom of God may come, "Ad Sanctam Trinitatem per Mariam, Ut adveniat Regnum Deum, adveniat Regnum Mariae, ergo TOTUS TUUS ego sum, MARIA" See http://www.maria-domina-animarum.net/en/flowers/1-250

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Please read the Blessed Mother's amazing promises in the link: A simple effective way for thousands of us to save millions of souls. The Doctors and Apostles say if we save even just one other soul through prayer and sacrifice, we also ensure the salvation of our own! Let us Offer our Lives in Sacrifice to Jesus and Mary to Save All Souls everywhere.
 
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Offline Xavier

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Re: Xavier's M.O.
« Reply #20 on: September 03, 2018, 08:43:36 AM »
See https://sixdays.org/Fossils-Confirm-the-Biblical-Creation-and-the-Genesis-Flood and http://www.icr.org/article/did-noahs-flood-cover-himalayan-mountains/ for two possible models of the flood. Those interested can study it further. Creation Scientists have very good answers to these things. But to the modernists, this is all a game. Create sufficient doubt in simple minds for long periods of time (their fraud of Piltdown man destroyed the Faith of millions for 40 years before they admitted it was a fraud!) and after that a late meaningless admission that these things were errors by which time much of the world has already lost the Faith. The right way is to stand on the Biblical narrative, read the works of creation scientists, and know that science will fully confirm the Biblical narrative in time.

Quote
Most fossils formed because of: Rapidly burial (to preserve it).
Burial in mud or other sediment (for mineral replacement).
Fossil Rapid Burial


The worldwide flood rapidly buried millions of plants and animals, creating the right conditions for fossils to form. Typically when an animal dies, it decomposes or is scattered by scavengers over time. However, the fossils found in sedimentary layers were buried instantly. Fossils such as fish eating or giving birth appear to have been frozen in time without warning. Fossilized jellyfish must have been rapidly buried because their soft bodies float and decay within hours of death. The top mile of the Earth's surface is covered with sedimentary layers full of fossils that could not have formed by a slow and gradual process.

Jellyfish FossilJellyfish fossil from Wisconsin.
Diplomystus Dentatus with Knightia in its MouthFossil Diplomystus dentatus with Knightia fish in its mouth.
Ichthyosaur Giving BirthFossil Ichthyosaur that was buried while giving birth.

Geologic Column

Textbook Sedimentary Layers Geologic ColumnGeologic layers showing sorted fossils.

The worldwide flood would have buried plants and animals based on their habitat and sorted them based on density and mobility. The reason clams and trilobites are at the bottom is because they live at the bottom. The reason humans and birds are on the top is because they live on the top and are mobile enough to seek higher ground. Many times the evolutionary “ancestor” is found in higher strata. The “fossil record” in reality does not “record” any information on the age of a fossil, but it is evidence that there was a large amount of water.

Mountain Top Sea Fossils

Himalayan Fossil Ammonite from Langza Spiti ValleyHimalayan fossil ammonite from Spiti Valley. Image: Seemant Saxena

Genesis 7:20 says that during the flood, all the mountains were covered with water. Clams, ammonites, and other marine fossils are found in almost all sedimentary layers, including on top of the Himalayas, Andes, Rockies, and most other mountain ranges. At the end of the flood, crust movement folded the mountains, pushing the fossil layers up to 2 miles above sea level. The catastrophic flood is the reason why the majority of marine fossil layers are found on the continents, and not in the ocean basins.

Fossil Stasis


Fossils Stasis - Bat, Crayfish, Turtle, Dragonfly, Coelacanth, Horseshoe CrabBats, crayfish, turtles, dragonflies, coelacanth, horseshoe crabs and many other fossils have been found showing no signs of evolution.

Almost all fossils, including those in the lowest layers, appear abruptly and fully formed, showing no sign of evolution. These fossils have no transitional forms, and many of them have survived almost unchanged until today. This evidence is consistent with the Bible's account of special creation and does not support the idea that one animal changes to another over long periods of time.

Polystrate Fossils


Polystrate fossil tree. Top has been petrified, bottom has been turned to coal. Polystrate fossil tree. Top has been petrified, bottom has been turned to coal.

Trees sinking into sediment forming polystrate fossils. Trees sinking into sediment forming polystrate fossils.

Many places around the world contain polystrate tree fossils that extend through multiple layers. These layers must have formed rapidly because it is not possible for trees to remain vertical for thousands of years while layers form around them. After the eruption at Mt. Saint Helens blew down large forests, scientists observed floating logs that become water-saturated and sink in the vertical position. Large deposits of polystrate tree fossils without branches or roots are evidence that floating trees were rapidly deposited in a large flood.
Please listen to the frequent messages and take heed of the directions given from Our Living Lord and Our Loving Lady from around the world here: https://maryrefugeofholylove.com/ Great things are at stake. Please consecrate your life to the Blessed Mother so that the Kingdom of God may come, "Ad Sanctam Trinitatem per Mariam, Ut adveniat Regnum Deum, adveniat Regnum Mariae, ergo TOTUS TUUS ego sum, MARIA" See http://www.maria-domina-animarum.net/en/flowers/1-250

Mary, our Heavenly Mother, implores those who receive Holy Communion Daily, or at least Weekly, to Offer their Lives. TEXT OF THE LIFE OFFERING, adapted and pluralized: Dear Lord Jesus, before the Holy Trinity, Our Heavenly Mother, and the whole Heavenly Court, united with Your most Precious Blood and Your Sacrifice on Calvary, We hereby Offer our whole Lives to the Intention of Your Sacred Heart and to the Immaculate Heart of Mary. Together with our life, we place at Your disposal all Holy Masses, all our Holy Communions, all Rosaries, all acts of consecration, all our good deeds, all our sacrifices, and the suffering of our entire life for the Adoration and Supplication of the Holy Trinity, for Unity in our Holy Mother Church, for the Holy Father, Pope Francis the First; and for His Holiness Pope Benedict XVI. For all the Cardinals of the Holy Roman Church, for all Bishops of the Universal Church that they may be true Apostles and Shepherds; and for Priests, Nuns and Monks, for good Priestly and Religious Vocations, and for All Souls until the end of the world. O my Jesus, please accept our life Sacrifice and our offerings and give us Your grace that we may all persevere obediently until death. Amen." https://marianapostolate.com/life-offering/ It is recommended that you make this Life Offering as soon as you feel ready, and to renew it from time to time.

Please read the Blessed Mother's amazing promises in the link: A simple effective way for thousands of us to save millions of souls. The Doctors and Apostles say if we save even just one other soul through prayer and sacrifice, we also ensure the salvation of our own! Let us Offer our Lives in Sacrifice to Jesus and Mary to Save All Souls everywhere.
 

Offline Pon de Replay

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Re: Xavier's M.O.
« Reply #21 on: September 03, 2018, 08:54:27 AM »
This is observably a messed-up world.  It’s that way for one of two reasons.  It’s either the result of the Fall, or God is remote and no one’s in charge.

And that's a false dichotomy.  How is it that many of our human vices are also seen in animals?  Sure, you can say they aren't vices in the strict sense because those animals aren't rational.  Still, you see barbaric cruelty, brutish lusts and sexual practices, even animals devouring their own children.  Sure, I know Protestants will say that that, too, is the result of the Fall, but c'mon.
 

You are correct; it's a false dichotomy.  Obviously there's not just a choice between the Christian narrative and agnosticism.  There are thousands of available narratives, from Islam to the Vedas to Raëlism to countless others.  I was merely using shorthand to get to the point.  But you seem to be denying the Fall here (and correct me if I'm wrong).  In that case, it would still be Eden right now, and we are currently living in paradise, in this world with all its suffering.  The absurdity of that claim is self-evident.  You would be going way beyond poor Duns Scotus and into something far more theologically perverse.  It is, I suppose, conceivable to have Christianity without original sin.  After all, liberal Christianity in all its guises seems to be nothing more than a demonstration of how many doctrines one can deny while still calling one's self a Christian.  But in the end it's a meaningless pose.

I was going to say that you can't be Catholic without believing in original sin—but then again, perhaps you can.  The final arbiter there would be Pope Francis, and he might be generous enough to consider you still within the fold.  Yet surely you can't be a traditional Catholic and reject original sin.  Can you?  That would be a bridge too far.  There, too, though, the intuition is wrong.  There are traditional Catholics who deny infallibility, and there are traditional Catholics who hold opposing views on Extra Ecclesiam nulla salus, only one of which can be orthodox; the other of which must necessarily be heretical (and this is not something open for debate.  The doctrine has been defined).  The bottom line is that the only qualifications for being a traditional Catholic seem to be: liking the Latin Mass and calling one's self a traditional Catholic.  Beyond that, belief is à la carte, orthodoxy is solipsistic, and "heretic" is a label to put on somebody else (frequently the hierarchs).  Everyone becomes their own pope—and their own Inquisitor as well.  It would not surprise me if this fact is what you, QMR, either unintentionally or in your own clever slice of internet performance art, are trying to prove.


« Last Edit: September 03, 2018, 09:06:58 AM by Pon de Replay »
 
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Offline John Lamb

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Re: Xavier's M.O.
« Reply #22 on: September 03, 2018, 09:13:21 AM »
And that's a false dichotomy.  How is it that many of our human vices are also seen in animals?  Sure, you can say they aren't vices in the strict sense because those animals aren't rational.  Still, you see barbaric cruelty, brutish lusts and sexual practices, even animals devouring their own children.  Sure, I know Protestants will say that that, too, is the result of the Fall, but c'mon.

You're correct to point out that they aren't vices strictly speaking because animals are not rational animals.

A (fellow Catholic) friend asked me about this. He brought up the example of a wasp which injects its eggs into a caterpillar, which then hatch to eat the caterpillar alive. My response was that this, indeed, is a result of the Fall. In what way?

"For the creature was made subject to vanity, not willingly, but by reason of him that made it subject, in hope: Because the creature also itself shall be delivered from the servitude of corruption, into the liberty of the glory of the children of God. For we know that every creature groaneth and travaileth in pain, even till now. And not only it, but ourselves also, who have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption of the sons of God, the redemption of our body."

That's St. Paul. I also came across a while back an ancient Chinese saying about the earth (in general) being "cursed" so that it would not bring forth its grain properly in abundance. The point is that the Fall had an effect upon all creation. So the way I explained it to my friend was that (as the ancient Chinese saying had it) the crops / plants themselves have been cursed and made less fruitful, so this wasp which injects its eggs into caterpillars originally would have injected them into a fig or some other fruit or nut that would have provided its offspring with sustenance; however, since the Fall, the plants no longer provide enough sustenance (e.g. protein), so the wasp turns to the caterpillar instead. Similarly, lions (and other carnivores) would have eaten plants that provided more than sufficient protein and so on, but since the Fall they've been forced to turn to hunting other animals instead. This is where I disagree with St. Thomas about lions or tigers being carnivorous by nature; no, by nature, they need a certain amount of protein, which since the Fall they've only been able to get from other animals (St. Thomas didn't know of the modern science of nutrition). There are cases in zoos where lions are brought up herbivorously, but obviously this is not the ideal today. If the animals could get their sustenance from the fruits of plants, there would be no need for them to turn against each other, and they would be docile. It's hunger that sets them in opposition. As for unnatural sexual practices, I think the consensus among those that study these things is that the animals do this to assert power/dominance over each other. This would also be a result of the Fall, seeing as the scarcity of resources has set the animals in relative competition with each other, such that they feel the need to maintain hierarchies of dominance where they are most likely to survive. Of course, evolutionists consider this competition to be pristinely natural, almost the very essence of the natural world.
« Last Edit: September 03, 2018, 09:21:27 AM by John Lamb »
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Offline Greg

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Re: Xavier's M.O.
« Reply #23 on: September 03, 2018, 09:40:54 AM »
Whatever one thinks about Xavier’s m.o., he is quite correct in his recognition that evolution is the hill to die on.  If evolution is true, then you have to face it: game over.  More than many other Catholics, Xavier sees this fact plainly for what it’s worth.  Getting him to answer questions can sometimes be like pulling teeth, but I like him.

If evolution is true, why die for a lie?

That is stupid.

Xavier argues like a complete mong.  I am on his side of the argument, but he is totally blinkered to facts and hard realities.  He is a total clown, much like fake 'dr' Sungenis.  Frankly if he ever makes it to become a priest we will just have another clerical cretin like Fr. Joseph Pfeiffer, who will do more harm than good with his moronic blatherings.

Knowing when to shut-the-hell-up is part of being an adult.

I wouldn't debate most of you on firearms or how to hunt for the good reason that I know next to nothing about them.
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Offline Pon de Replay

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Re: Xavier's M.O.
« Reply #24 on: September 03, 2018, 09:58:22 AM »
If evolution is true, why die for a lie?

That is stupid.

Well, I guess for the simple fact that for a true believer like Xavier, evolution can never be true and the faith cannot possibly be a lie, no matter what the evidence.  Even if the entire rest of humanity to a person were to accept evolution, he would simply declare himself a mysticalist pope and the last living Catholic on earth, and he would say, "après moi, la fin du monde."  For the same reason do Muslims blow themselves up in the service of Allah and the promise of a harem and banqueting in the afterlife.  Whether or not these things are true, they are nevertheless believed and died for.  Faith is not taken on demonstrable proof.  For you that might be the case, but if faith is something rationally arrived at, then it wouldn't be called faith, it would simply be called fact, and there would be no such thing as grace.
 

Offline Greg

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Re: Xavier's M.O.
« Reply #25 on: September 03, 2018, 10:02:39 AM »
If evolution is true, why die for a lie?

That is stupid.

Well, I guess for the simple fact that for a true believer like Xavier, evolution can never be true and the faith cannot possibly be a lie, no matter what the evidence.

Then he is in a cult.  Not a religion.

Facts matter.
« Last Edit: September 03, 2018, 10:04:18 AM by Greg »
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Offline Pon de Replay

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Re: Xavier's M.O.
« Reply #26 on: September 03, 2018, 10:16:59 AM »
At that point, it becomes an endless debate over the nature of truth.  Both evolutionists and young earth creationists claim the facts are on their own side, and that the opposition is peddling either pseudo-science or scientism.  (To creationists, the scientific community is a part of a Hebraic- / Freemasonic- / Illuminati-type cabal, and evolution is an instrument of Satan to lead souls to perdition.  To evolutionists, biblical literalism is deemed the height of willful ignorance and unthinking cult-like devotion to a patently wrong text).  It's almost impossible to make headway in these discussions because of how fiercely people cling to their assumptions and biases.  "Facts" become all but subjective.
 

Offline Pon de Replay

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Re: Xavier's M.O.
« Reply #27 on: September 03, 2018, 10:24:59 AM »
You're right, though, Greg, that the way one argues things is important.  I was recently reading about the Bill Nye-Ken Ham debate, which I intend to watch.  I liked this bit of review:

Quote
Daily Beast writer Michael Schulson used the Seahawks-Broncos analogy to declare Ham the resounding victor.  Although Schulson agreed with Nye's underlying scientific message, and allowed that Nye "had his moments," he wrote that "it was easy to pick out the smarter man on the stage. Oddly, it was the same man who was arguing that the earth is 6,000 years old."

 :laugh:
 

Offline Pon de Replay

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Re: Xavier's M.O.
« Reply #28 on: September 03, 2018, 10:39:41 AM »
Wouldn't it be a kind of heresy for a person to hold the position that, even though they presently hold the Catholic faith as true, they admit the possibility of the faith, or certain doctrines of the faith, being demonstrated false?  The faith, in such a circumstance, would be provisional; ergo you would be saying truth is provisional.  Surely there's something cited in the Syllabus of Errors that condemns this position.  So Xavier's theoretical adherence to the faith, come whatever may in terms of evidence to the contrary, would be orthodox.
 

Offline Greg

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Re: Xavier's M.O.
« Reply #29 on: September 03, 2018, 11:01:49 AM »
It would be a heresy if one was required to believe that faith and reason can conflict, and when that happens, one has to ignore facts.

But the teaching is that faith and reason don't conflict.

So when they do, (geocentrism) I go with the observable and common sense.  Planets (with less mass) orbit stars with much greater mass.  Solar systems orbit the more massive galatic centre.

FACT - Pope Francis is a Peronist, apostate and a massive two-faced wanker who kept his faggot kiddy raping friends in positions of power whilst bemoaning the rot and shit in the Church.  He had blocked the flush!!!  Therefore, I am morally entitled to ignore everything he says and commands.  If he is the legitemate Vicar of Christ then my human reason tells me that Christ must be out to lunch.

Excusing Pope Francis or saying the entire universe revolves around a fixed earth both fly in the face of reason.

Everyone has an mental anchor.  For some people it is their emotional love for a random man in a white soutan who they form a virtual relationship with ,  oooohhh he is so humble.

For others it is just being a crazy conspiratorial outsider and following Pope Michael.

For me it is judging what I cannot see, touch, taste, smell or measure by the thing I can.

If that ain't good enough then send me to Hell.  Because I think this is the best way to live an honest life and not get my children raped.
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