Author Topic: Is this Portuguese?  (Read 769 times)

Offline red solo cup

  • John 6:56
  • St. Joseph's Workbench
  • Hauptmann
  • ****
  • Posts: 5213
  • Thanked: 2005 times
  • Religion: Fair weather Catholic
Is this Portuguese?
« on: August 20, 2018, 06:44:03 AM »
"It's so lonely 'round the fields of Athenry"
 

Offline Fleur-de-Lys

  • Mary Garden
  • Wachtmeister
  • ***
  • Posts: 976
  • Thanked: 1268 times
Re: Is this Portuguese?
« Reply #1 on: August 20, 2018, 11:10:32 AM »
No, that is Spanish.  :lol:
 
The following users thanked this post: red solo cup, Christe Eleison

Offline Vetus Ordo

  • Hopeful Fatalist
  • St. Joseph's Workbench
  • Wachtmeister
  • ***
  • Posts: 1362
  • Thanked: 929 times
  • Religion: Old Christian
Re: Is this Portuguese?
« Reply #2 on: August 20, 2018, 11:36:04 PM »
No, that is Spanish.  :lol:

Yes, Castilian to be more precise.

And the baptism is invalid. The priest just said "I baptize you in the name of the Father..." and then proceeded to chat with the parents.
ΠΙΣΤΟΣ Ο ΛΟΓΟΣ ΚΑΙ ΠΑΣΗΣ ΑΠΟΔΟΧΗΣ ΑΞΙΟΣ, ΟΤΙ ΧΡΙΣΤΟΣ ΙΗΣΟΥΣ ΗΛΘΕΝ ΕΙΣ ΤΟΝ ΚΟΣΜΟΝ ΑΜΑΡΤΩΛΟΥΣ ΣΩΣΑΙ: ΩΝ ΠΡΩΤΟΣ ΕΙΜΙ ΕΓΩ
 
The following users thanked this post: Christe Eleison

Offline Michael Wilson

  • St. Joseph's Workbench
  • Hauptmann
  • ****
  • Posts: 5920
  • Thanked: 3353 times
  • Religion: Catholic
Re: Is this Portuguese?
« Reply #3 on: August 22, 2018, 05:35:36 PM »
"Spanish" is correct; those are not Spaniards but Latin Americans and "Spanish" is the modern international language that developed out of "Castillian", a medieval regional dialect spoken in the central part of Spain.
"The World Must Conform to Our Lord and not He to it." Rev. Dennis Fahey CSSP
 
The following users thanked this post: Fleur-de-Lys

Offline Gardener

  • Drink the poison yourself.
  • St. Joseph's Workbench
  • Hauptmann
  • ****
  • Posts: 7532
  • Thanked: 4620 times
  • Religion: Catholic
Re: Is this Portuguese?
« Reply #4 on: August 22, 2018, 08:05:01 PM »
No, that is Spanish.  :lol:

Yes, Castilian to be more precise.

And the baptism is invalid. The priest just said "I baptize you in the name of the Father..." and then proceeded to chat with the parents.

But was the chatting pastoral?

"And what use are the victories on the battlefield if we are ourselves are defeated in our innermost personal selves?" - St. Maximilian Kolbe
 
The following users thanked this post: Vetus Ordo, Christe Eleison

Offline Vetus Ordo

  • Hopeful Fatalist
  • St. Joseph's Workbench
  • Wachtmeister
  • ***
  • Posts: 1362
  • Thanked: 929 times
  • Religion: Old Christian
Re: Is this Portuguese?
« Reply #5 on: August 22, 2018, 10:01:18 PM »
"Spanish" is the modern international language that developed out of "Castillian", a medieval regional dialect spoken in the central part of Spain.

"Spanish" and "Castilian" are synonyms.

The use of one over the other depends on preference and context. There are quite a few Latin American countries today, like Colombia, Peru, Venezuela, etc., that designate their national language as "Castilian" in their constitutions.

When I said to Fleur-de-Lys "Castilian to be more precise," I wasn't correcting her use of "Spanish." Both terms are acceptable. It was tongue-in-cheek since all Latin Iberian languages, including Catalan and Portuguese, are "Spanish" in a deeper historical sense.
ΠΙΣΤΟΣ Ο ΛΟΓΟΣ ΚΑΙ ΠΑΣΗΣ ΑΠΟΔΟΧΗΣ ΑΞΙΟΣ, ΟΤΙ ΧΡΙΣΤΟΣ ΙΗΣΟΥΣ ΗΛΘΕΝ ΕΙΣ ΤΟΝ ΚΟΣΜΟΝ ΑΜΑΡΤΩΛΟΥΣ ΣΩΣΑΙ: ΩΝ ΠΡΩΤΟΣ ΕΙΜΙ ΕΓΩ
 
The following users thanked this post: Michael Wilson, Christe Eleison

Offline Michael Wilson

  • St. Joseph's Workbench
  • Hauptmann
  • ****
  • Posts: 5920
  • Thanked: 3353 times
  • Religion: Catholic
Re: Is this Portuguese?
« Reply #6 on: August 23, 2018, 07:58:20 AM »
Thanks. When I was living in Spain, I saw an editorial in a conservative newspaper that stated that the use of the word "Castillian" to designate Spanish (by the separatist) was an anachronism, as the two were no longer synonymous.
"The World Must Conform to Our Lord and not He to it." Rev. Dennis Fahey CSSP
 

Offline Vetus Ordo

  • Hopeful Fatalist
  • St. Joseph's Workbench
  • Wachtmeister
  • ***
  • Posts: 1362
  • Thanked: 929 times
  • Religion: Old Christian
Re: Is this Portuguese?
« Reply #7 on: August 23, 2018, 01:45:39 PM »
Thanks. When I was living in Spain, I saw an editorial in a conservative newspaper that stated that the use of the word "Castillian" to designate Spanish (by the separatist) was an anachronism, as the two were no longer synonymous.

However, that statement is just plainly wrong.
ΠΙΣΤΟΣ Ο ΛΟΓΟΣ ΚΑΙ ΠΑΣΗΣ ΑΠΟΔΟΧΗΣ ΑΞΙΟΣ, ΟΤΙ ΧΡΙΣΤΟΣ ΙΗΣΟΥΣ ΗΛΘΕΝ ΕΙΣ ΤΟΝ ΚΟΣΜΟΝ ΑΜΑΡΤΩΛΟΥΣ ΣΩΣΑΙ: ΩΝ ΠΡΩΤΟΣ ΕΙΜΙ ΕΓΩ
 

Offline GloriaPatri

  • Feldwebel
  • ***
  • Posts: 2438
  • Thanked: 469 times
  • Religion: Platonic Realist
Re: Is this Portuguese?
« Reply #8 on: August 23, 2018, 04:42:35 PM »
Thanks. When I was living in Spain, I saw an editorial in a conservative newspaper that stated that the use of the word "Castillian" to designate Spanish (by the separatist) was an anachronism, as the two were no longer synonymous.

However, that statement is just plainly wrong.

I have to agree. It's like saying that American or British English are not synonymous with English. Castilian is a "regional" variety of Spanish at most, not a distinct language.
 

Offline Gardener

  • Drink the poison yourself.
  • St. Joseph's Workbench
  • Hauptmann
  • ****
  • Posts: 7532
  • Thanked: 4620 times
  • Religion: Catholic
Re: Is this Portuguese?
« Reply #9 on: August 23, 2018, 04:55:53 PM »
Here's what I don't understand about Spanish:

Why is it that I can understand a Spanish speaker mangling English like, "es'cue me, pero but you do know where is the booger king?" (excuse me, but do you know where Burger King is?"

But if I don't perfectly roll my r or n on a word in a simple sentence, they act like I spoke to them in Vietnamese.

"And what use are the victories on the battlefield if we are ourselves are defeated in our innermost personal selves?" - St. Maximilian Kolbe
 

Offline Michael Wilson

  • St. Joseph's Workbench
  • Hauptmann
  • ****
  • Posts: 5920
  • Thanked: 3353 times
  • Religion: Catholic
Re: Is this Portuguese?
« Reply #10 on: August 23, 2018, 08:07:20 PM »
Here is an article I found on the Internet
Quote

Español o castellano: ¿es lo mismo?
Nosotros nos referimos a nuestro idioma como español. ¿Tú?

13 de julio de 2018. Estandarte.com

Qué: Español o castellano: ¿es lo mismo?

¿Español o castellano? ¿Cuál es la forma correcta de nombrar nuestro idioma? La respuesta es simple, ambas son correctas, aunque la RAE (y nosotros también) recomienda usar “español”. Pero no por ello evita que se sucedan las polémicas y discusiones…

Veamos en primer lugar qué dice el Diccionario panhispánico de dudas:

español. Para designar la lengua común de España y de muchas naciones de América, y que también se habla como propia en otras partes del mundo, son válidos los términos castellano y español. La polémica sobre cuál de estas denominaciones resulta más apropiada está hoy superada. El término español resulta más recomendable por carecer de ambigüedad, ya que se refiere de modo unívoco a la lengua que hablan hoy cerca de cuatrocientos millones de personas. Asimismo, es la denominación que se utiliza internacionalmente (Spanish, espagnol, Spanisch, spagnolo, etc.). Aun siendo también sinónimo de español, resulta preferible reservar el término castellano para referirse al dialecto románico nacido en el Reino de Castilla durante la Edad Media, o al dialecto del español que se habla actualmente en esta región. En España, se usa asimismo el nombre castellano cuando se alude a la lengua común del Estado en relación con las otras lenguas cooficiales en sus respectivos territorios autónomos, como el catalán, el gallego o el vasco.

Es decir, diremos siempre español, excepto cuando nos refiramos al dialecto medieval o al que se habla actualmente en Castilla, o cuando queramos diferenciarlo de las demás lenguas cooficiales de España (catalán, gallego y vasco). El principal problema surge por algunas sensibilidades nacionalistas, que optan por hablar de “castellano” mejor que “español”, al sentirse ajenas a España como país. Si bien nos puede parecer lícito el sentimiento nacionalista, no creemos que deba desembocar en crear confusión o dotar de connotaciones falsas a una palabra. La polémica confunde aún más a los hablantes por el hecho de que otros sectores nacionalistas catalanes, vascos y gallegos hayan optado por hablar de español frente a sus respectivos idiomas para remarcar la no pertenencia a España de sus territorios. El rizo se riza y da la vuelta… Y nos liamos aún más.

En Estandarte, cuando decimos que hablamos español no estamos despreciando la existencia de otras lenguas cooficiales ni nada que se le parezca: simplemente, nos referimos a la lengua que hablamos como la nombran la inmensa mayoría de los millones de hablantes que este idioma tiene, más allá de nuestro pequeño territorio, España. A no ser que nos encontremos en una conversación en la que se hable en concreto de las diferentes lenguas que se hablan en España, nos referiremos a lo que hablamos como español, no castellano.

Sabemos que éste es uno de esos temas que no dejan del todo contentos a nadie, que invitan a la discusión e, incluso, al enfado… Pero no podíamos dejarlo pasar. Nos han preguntado en ocasiones la diferencia entre español y castellano y por qué hablábamos casi siempre de español. He aquí nuestra respuesta. ¿Cuál es la tuya?
It clearly states that V.O. Is dead wrong!!! Just kidding. Yes, he is right; what it states is that while the two terms are synonymous, its clearer and less ambiguous to use the term "Spanish" when referring to the language spoken by 400 million people and to reserve the term "Castillan" to the dialect spoken during the middle ages in the kingdom of Castille and to the dialect still spoken in this region.
So to quote the angry T.V. Viewer (Gilda Radner) from S.N.L. "Never Mind". 
Ps. Yes, the priest only says: "In the name of the Father" and then keeps pouring water on the baby's head. Clearly invalid.
« Last Edit: August 23, 2018, 08:09:11 PM by Michael Wilson »
"The World Must Conform to Our Lord and not He to it." Rev. Dennis Fahey CSSP
 

Offline Gardener

  • Drink the poison yourself.
  • St. Joseph's Workbench
  • Hauptmann
  • ****
  • Posts: 7532
  • Thanked: 4620 times
  • Religion: Catholic
Re: Is this Portuguese?
« Reply #11 on: August 23, 2018, 08:24:46 PM »
Any idea where this is?

Possible to write the Bishop (in Spanish) and include the video and ask that the Baptism be redone, and all baptisms of this priest be investigated?
"And what use are the victories on the battlefield if we are ourselves are defeated in our innermost personal selves?" - St. Maximilian Kolbe
 
The following users thanked this post: Christe Eleison

Offline Michael Wilson

  • St. Joseph's Workbench
  • Hauptmann
  • ****
  • Posts: 5920
  • Thanked: 3353 times
  • Religion: Catholic
Re: Is this Portuguese?
« Reply #12 on: August 25, 2018, 05:19:41 PM »
Here's what I don't understand about Spanish:

Why is it that I can understand a Spanish speaker mangling English like, "es'cue me, pero but you do know where is the booger king?" (excuse me, but do you know where Burger King is?"

But if I don't perfectly roll my r or n on a word in a simple sentence, they act like I spoke to them in Vietnamese.
I got that a lot in Miami; but that might be that the native English speakers were so hostile to the Spanish speakers that the Spanish speakers automatically assumed that if one looked like a Gringo (like I do), then one was speaking English to them, no matter what came out of one's mouth. I've had the experience of speaking Spanish to a Spanish speaker in Miami (my Spanish is very good), and having the man respond: "I am sorry I no speekee Inglish". !!
"The World Must Conform to Our Lord and not He to it." Rev. Dennis Fahey CSSP