Author Topic: Why the thread "Last movie you saw?" if filled with mortal sins  (Read 22443 times)

Offline Jerome

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Why the thread "Last movie you saw?" if filled with mortal sins
« on: October 14, 2016, 07:32:35 AM »
The following examples below is a good demonstration of why the majority of people who obstinately watch the media (as demonstrated in the "Last movie you saw?" thread) are in mortal sin (even if they don't think they are) since they refuse to avoid the occasion of sinning. (And I only went through one page of this horrific thread).

Consider that I only make mention of the explicit sexual content, without taking into consideration all other evil things, such as occultism, ungodliness, profanity, blasphemy and immodest dress (which is not considered in "Sex and Nudity" category, unless the likes of bikini.

To you who read this: I tell you frankly, you will go to Hell if you don't stop watching media and putting yourself in the occasion of sinning, since the Church teaches that those who do this cannot be absolved and hence cannot be saved:

Pope Innocent XI, Various Errors on Moral Matters #61, March 4, 1679: “He can sometimes be absolved, who remains in a proximate occasion of sinning, which he can and does not wish to omit, but rather directly and professedly seeks or enters into.” – Condemned statement by Pope Innocent XI.

Get this through your obstinate head. Perhaps if I tell it more forcefully, it will get through to some...


Going to see "Snowden" tonight. Bill Still said it was riveting.

Can't recommend snowden. Pornographic scene.

Last night on TCM I watched Reds with Warren Beatty and Diane Keaton.  Over three hours, but it didn't feel like it dragged except in just a few spots.  Beatty and Keaton are excellent in their roles and the witnesses are very interesting.  Not the first time I've seen the movie, but it was the first time I've seen it all the way through.

Sex & Nudity [Reds]
Some sexual dialogue, occasionally profane, tasteful nude photographs, characters in open relationships

10 Cloverfield Lane. The last 15 minutes was NOT what I expected.

Sex & Nudity [10 Cloverfield Lane]
A woman is shown lying on a bed in her underwear for a few minutes, before she dresses. Nothing sexual.

A woman wears a tight white tank top with a black bra beneath it and shows some cleavage.

We see a photo of a woman in a bikini in a magazine.

Quote
That one must avoid the proximate occasion of sin in order to be Saved and receive Forgiveness of one’s sins from God is a certain fact of the Natural and Divine law that has always been taught by the Church and Her Saints. For instance, Blessed Pope Innocent XI during his papacy, condemned three propositions that denied this truth:

Pope Innocent XI, Various Errors on Moral Matters #61, March 4, 1679: “He can sometimes be absolved, who remains in a proximate occasion of sinning, which he can and does not wish to omit, but rather directly and professedly seeks or enters into.” – Condemned statement by Pope Innocent XI.

Pope Innocent XI, Various Errors on Moral Matters #62, March 4, 1679: “The proximate occasion for sinning is not to be shunned when some useful and honorable cause for not shunning it occurs.” – Condemned statement by Pope Innocent XI.

Pope Innocent XI, Various Errors on Moral Matters #63, March 4, 1679: “It is permitted to seek directly the proximate occasion for sinning for a spiritual or temporal good of our own or of a neighbor.” – Condemned statement by Pope Innocent XI.

Here we see that the Church confirms that the opinion that “It is permitted to seek directly the proximate occasion for sinning for a spiritual or temporal good of our own or of a neighbor” is directly condemned. And this condemnation is about those who “seek directly the proximate occasion for sinning” for a good cause, rather than for a selfish cause. But most people in this world do not even watch or listen to evil and ungodly media for a good cause but rather for the sake of pleasure or for other unnecessary reasons, and it is certainly not necessary “for a spiritual or temporal good of our own or of a neighbor.” This shows us that the Church and the Natural Law absolutely abhors and condemns the opinion that one can watch or listen to media that can tempt a person to sin. Indeed, not only the occasions of sin, like evil, worldly and ungodly media, but also the “the proximate occasion for sinning for a spiritual or temporal good of our own or of a neighbor” must be totally rejected and shunned if one wants to attain salvation.

People who reject this advice and continue to put themselves in a proximate or near occasion of sin will undoubtedly lose their souls, since God will allow the devil to fool them in some way since they rejected the Word of God, and chose to put themselves in the way of temptation. Many there are, indeed, who presumptuously claim that they won’t get tempted by watching or listening to worldly media, or that they will be able to control it, but here we see in the condemnations of Blessed Pope Innocent XI that one may not even put oneself in “the proximate occasion for sinning for a spiritual or temporal good of our own or of a neighbor”. God will undoubtedly leave a person who is presumptuous and prideful, and the Church and Her Saints have always condemned such individuals that trusts in their own strength.

As a matter of fact, one can even understand from the light of natural reason that one is not allowed to put oneself in the occasion of sin, so those who do this act will have no excuse whatsoever on the day of judgment. In addition, a person who watches bad, worldly or ungodly media, tempts his fellow man to watch these evil things also, and thus, by his bad example, puts both himself and others in the way of damnation by his selfishness and presumption. So in addition to damning himself if he obstinately continues in such a course of life, such a person also actually tries to damn others by his bad example, trying to drag others with him into the eternal darkness and fire of hell. This is a kind of evil that is breathtaking to behold! It is thus a fact “that when men avoid the occasions of sin, God preserves them; but when they expose themselves to danger, they are justly abandoned by the Lord, and easily fall into some grievous transgressions.” (St. Alphonsus Liguori, The True Spouse of Jesus Christ, Mortification of the Eyes, p. 221)

The pitiful and unreasonable addiction to media by so many “Catholics” or “Christians” today is something new, and almost no one before the 20th century was so miserably addicted to it as the weak and bad willed population of our own times! The amount of pitiful and pathetic excuses that we have had to hear from bad willed people who try to excuse their act of putting themselves in the proximate or near occasion of sin is, simply said, almost endless. Even though they understand that they are not allowed to endanger their souls, they just couldn’t care since they are hooked on the media, just like a drug addict, who need his daily “fix” to endure the day. For about a hundred years ago, almost no media existed as compared to today, and people thrived and the crime rates was as nothing when compared to today. So the unreasonable addiction to media cannot be excused, for man does not need media at all to survive, and putting oneself in the near or “the proximate occasion for sinning for a spiritual or temporal good of our own or of a neighbor” is directly condemned by the Church.

If the priests as well as the laypeople that lived in a more virtuous time when the Catholic Church’s Law was followed by people in Europe would have seen any of the things we human today see through either media or even walking outside and seeing billboards or lasciviously clothed men or women walking in the street, they would have been outraged and would have fled from every such thing, for their conscience had not been perverted through the media so that their sense of modesty was totally crushed as is the case with us modern humans. God’s standard of modesty never changes, and the Church’s teaching that “the proximate occasion for sinning for a spiritual or temporal good of our own or of a neighbor” must always be avoided is not allowed to be flouted in the 21st century however much modern man thinks that God allows their novelties and abominations.

Read more: http://www.catholic-saints.net/spiritual/#How-to-control-your-eyes

You don't care? Are care almost nothing? St. Vianny has the perfect words for you:

“There is not a commandment of God which dancing [or media] does not cause men to break! Mothers may indeed say: ‘Oh, I keep an eye on their dress [or what they watch (you cannot know all content!)]; [but] you cannot keep guard over their heart.’ Go, you wicked parents, go down to Hell where the wrath of God awaits you, because of your conduct when you gave free scope to your children; GO! It will not be long before they join you, seeing that you have shown them the way so well! Then you will see whether your pastor was right in forbidding those Hellish amusements.” (The Curé D’Ars, St. Jean-Marie-Baptiste Vianney, p. 146)

St. Alphonsus tells us in On Avoiding the Occasion of Sin: “Now, no one can receive absolution unless he purpose firmly to avoid the occasion of sin; because to expose himself to such occasions, though sometimes he should not fall into sin, is for him a grievous sin.” Indeed, “The catechist must explain that those who do not abstain from voluntary proximate occasions of grievous sin are guilty of a mortal sin, even though they have the intention of not committing the bad act, to the danger of which they expose themselves”. St Augustine’s Confessions reiterates this point: “I resist seductions of the eyes, lest my feet with which I advance on Your way be entangled; and I raise my invisible eyes to You, that You would be pleased to pluck my feet out of the net.”

Offline Chestertonian

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Re: Why the thread "Last movie you saw?" if filled with mortal sins
« Reply #1 on: October 14, 2016, 07:41:26 AM »
You should begin a post like that with "THIS IS YPUR CONSCIENCE SPEAKING "
"I am not much of a Crusader, that is for sure, but at least I am not a Mohamedist!"
 
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Offline Jerome

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Re: Why the thread "Last movie you saw?" if filled with mortal sins
« Reply #2 on: October 14, 2016, 07:45:31 AM »
You should begin a post like that with "THIS IS YPUR CONSCIENCE SPEAKING "

What exactly is your point? (So I don't misunderstand you.)

I presented the Church's teaching which condemns putting oneself in the occasion of sinning. Jesus Christ also testified to the fact that few are saved! Readers, think about that carefully, in addition to what he warned about the last days.

“Know also this, that, in the last days, shall come dangerous times. Men shall be lovers of themselves, covetous, haughty, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, ungrateful, wicked, without affection, without peace, slanderers, incontinent, unmerciful, without kindness, Traitors, stubborn, puffed up, and lovers of pleasures more than of God: Having an appearance indeed of godliness, but denying the power thereof. Now these avoid.” (2 Timothy 3:1-5)

And if you would object that what is pointed out in this thread is not a problem to you, the following answer till be given:

If people claim they do not get disturbed by seeing immoral material, there is an explanation for that too (and it is not a good one, in almost all cases).

Also, not only to put oneself in the direct occasion of sinning is forbidden, but even to put oneself in the "proximate occasion of sinning," is forbidden. This means that even if some might argue that such things are not an occasion of falling for them, yet knowing what the content is, the occasion is still "proximate", since they are not angels, but men.

Unless a person have been graced with the grace of perfect chastity, I would say that only someone who want to deny the truth and deceive themselves would say that he does not get affected by nuduty, or graphic and strong sensual, suggestive images (such as described in this thread), for unless the lust of the flesh is completely dead in him—which is not to be expected by most people—he will obviously get affected and, if he continue to expose himself, will harden his heart and commit sin and offend God, however much he want to deny this truth.

According to one such example found in the Life of the Holy Fathers, it is explained how people who are already conquered by the devil in other ways and/or being despised by him as being completely devoid of virtues, may not even be tempted much by him with sexual temptations or imaginations so that they may continue living their bad life and so dragging their selves and others along with them down into Hell.
Also, according to the same text, “those who are freed from [impure] thoughts are those who have moved into [sinful] deeds”. But if this is true with only thoughts, how much more true when actually viewing impure images, or putting oneself in constant occasion of sinning? Hence if such people were more troubled with sexual temptations, one should think that they would be more on their guard and be more careful about themselves and of falling and exposing themselves (and others) into this sin. But since the devil don’t want bad people to be on their guard, and since he want that they should continue giving others a bad example, he sometimes leaves off tempting them.

Quote
Life of the Holy Fathers, Book 5, On Sexual Temptation: “There was a certain brother who was most zealous in ordering his life. And when he was grievously troubled by the demon of sex he went to a certain old man and told him his thoughts. When this “expert” heard, he was indignant and called the brother a miserable wretch unworthy of the monk's habit to entertain such thoughts. The brother, hearing this, despaired of himself, left his cell and began to go back to the world. But by the mercy of God, abba Apollo met him, and seeing that he was upset and unhappy he asked him, "Brother, why so sad?" In great confusion of mind he was at first unwilling to answer, but in the face of much questioning by the old man as to what the matter was he at last confessed, saying, "I am bothered by thoughts of sex, and I confessed to that old man and according to him there is no hope of salvation for me, so in despair I'm going back to the world." When father Apollo heard this he talked and reasoned with him like a wise physician, saying, "Don't be too dumbfounded, or despairing of yourself. Even at my age and state of life I can be greatly troubled by thoughts such as these[/u]. Don't collapse in this time of testing; it can be cured not so much by human advice as by the mercy of God. But just for today grant me one request: go back to your cell." This the brother did. Abba Apollo however hastened to the cell of that old man who had sown despair and standing outside prayed the Lord, "Lord, who allows us to be tempted for our good, [temptations often leads us to avoid putting ourselves in the proximate danger of falling] turn the battle which this brother has suffered against this old man, that in his old age he may learn from experience what he didn't learn long since[/b], that you must have compassion on those who are troubled by this sort of temptation."
Having completed his prayer he saw an Ethiopian standing by the cell casting arrows against this old man, who, severely wounded, began to stagger about here and there as if drunk with wine. Unable to bear it any longer he rushed out of the cell and began to return to the world by the same road as the young brother had taken. But abba Apollo, knowing what was happening, met him, and running up to him asked, "Where are you going? And what is the reason for the agitated state you are in?" But he, sensing that the holy man knew all about what was happening, could say nothing for very shame. "Go back to your cell," said abba Apollo, "and acknowledge your own weakness, recognise it as part of yourself. For either you have been overlooked by the devil up till now, or else despised as being so lacking in virtue as to be unworthy of striving against him. Did I say 'strife'? You weren't even able to put up with his attacks for a single day! But all this happened to you because when that young man was attacked by our common adversary, instead of giving him helpful advice against the devil as you ought, you drove him into despair, forgetful of that wise precept by which we are bidden to save those on a pathway towards death and neglect not to redeem the condemned (Proverbs 14). Nor have you heeded the sayings of our Saviour, 'A bruised reed he shall not break, and a smoking flax he shall not quench' (Matthew 12.20). No one can withstand the attacks of the enemy, or quench and contain the fire of rebellious nature, unless the grace of God comes to the aid of our natural infirmity, which in all our prayer we beg God in his mercy to heal in us, and that he may turn away from us the attacks launched against us, for it is of him that we are cast down and again restored to the way of salvation, it is he who strikes and then heals us with his hands, he humbles and exalts, he kills and makes alive, he leads us down to the depths and raises us up again" (1 Kings 2).
“Having said this he prayed, and at once the old man was freed from that battle. And abba Apollo urged him to seek from the Lord a tongue of discretion, so that he might know when the time was right for giving a sermon.
“V.v.5. Syrus Alexandrinus, when asked about sexual thoughts replied thus, "If you didn't have thoughts you would be a hopeless case, since those who are freed from thoughts are those who have moved into deeds, that is, those who have sinned in the body are the ones who have not fought against thoughts of sin, or turned them down. The one who sins in the body has gone beyond being troubled by thoughts." ”

The lesson to draw out from this is the following: If you live a bad life by putting yourself in the occasion of sinning (which is not lawful for you to do) and yet claim that you are not effected (or only affected little) by being bombarded with lascivious material (which is probably a lie in itself), then it means that -- being already in mortal sin and in league with the devil -- he sometimes leaves of tempting you so that you will not get a remorse of conscience and hence make a change of your bad life, which is leading you to Hell.

Offline Chestertonian

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Re: Why the thread "Last movie you saw?" if filled with mortal sins
« Reply #3 on: October 14, 2016, 07:54:41 AM »
I just find it interesting that you come in here with only 21 posts but you already know the state of our souls.
"I am not much of a Crusader, that is for sure, but at least I am not a Mohamedist!"
 
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Offline Greg

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Re: Why the thread "Last movie you saw?" if filled with mortal sins
« Reply #4 on: October 14, 2016, 07:59:03 AM »
Thanks Jerome.  Though, I download all my movies illegally from the internet so I am already going to hell for piracy.
My preferred pronoun is "he he"
 

Offline Jerome

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Re: Why the thread "Last movie you saw?" if filled with mortal sins
« Reply #5 on: October 14, 2016, 08:15:22 AM »
I just find it interesting that you come in here with only 21 posts but you already know the state of our souls.

First of, what I present in this thread is based on the teaching of the Church and the saints, and the natural law and reason, and is true (whether you like it or not), but the problem is (and always has been) that sinful people don't want to change their life -- hence that most are damned (Mt. 7:13).

Quote
Pope Innocent XI, Various Errors on Moral Matters #61, March 4, 1679: “He can sometimes be absolved, who remains in a proximate occasion of sinning, which he can and does not wish to omit, but rather directly and professedly seeks or enters into.” – Condemned statement by Pope Innocent XI.
Pope Innocent XI, Various Errors on Moral Matters #62, March 4, 1679: “The proximate occasion for sinning is not to be shunned when some useful and honorable cause for not shunning it occurs.” – Condemned statement by Pope Innocent XI.
Pope Innocent XI, Various Errors on Moral Matters #63, March 4, 1679: “It is permitted to seek directly the proximate occasion for sinning for a spiritual or temporal good of our own or of a neighbor.” – Condemned statement by Pope Innocent XI.

Second, the inner state of peoples' souls are reveled by their manifest actions. A manifest known action is the like such as putting oneself in the occasion of sinning. This is a knowable fact.

Fact: According to Church teaching, people in state of grace don't put themselves in the occasion of sinning.

Fact: According to Church teaching, people who willfully put themselves in the occasion of sinning are in a state of damnation.

Fact: How many people that are addicted to media and occasions of sinning will ever stop doing what they are doing and that are leading them to Hell think you - before they actually fall down to it - even though they have been told about it and even severely rebuked?

The problem is bad will.

Conclusion: Catholics must understand that few are saved. Our Lord Jesus Christ revealed that the road to Heaven is straight and narrow and few find it, while the road to Hell is wide and taken by most (Mt. 7:13).

Matthew 7:13 “Enter ye in at the narrow gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way that leadeth to destruction, and many there are who go in thereat. How narrow is the gate, and strait is the way that leadeth to life, and few there are that find it![/u]”

Luke 13:24 “Strive to enter by the narrow gate; for many, I say to you, shall seek to enter, and shall not be able.”

Scripture also teaches that almost the entire world lies in darkness, so much so that Satan is even called the “prince” (John 12:31) and “god” (2 Cor. 4:3) of this world. “We know that we are of God, and the whole world is seated in wickedness.” (1 John 5:19)

Nowadays, however, the fear of Hell has vanished completely, and that is why no one cares anything about avoiding the occasion of sin. But the time will come when they shall lift up their voices in lamentation and weeping and curse themselves for refusing to avoid the occasion of sin, but then, it is sadly too late for them. “And the smoke of their torments shall ascend up for ever and ever: neither have they rest day nor night...” (Apocalypse 14:11)

St. Leonard of Port Maurice (A.D. 1676-1751), when speaking on the fewness of the saved, shows us how the Church and Her Fathers and Saints is unanimous in teaching this biblical doctrine: “After consulting all the theologians and making a diligent study of the matter, he [Suarez] wrote, ‘The most common sentiment which is held is that, among Christians [Catholics], there are more damned souls than predestined souls[/u].’ Add the authority of the Greek and Latin Fathers to that of the theologians, and you will find that almost all of them say the same thing. This is the sentiment of Saint Theodore, Saint Basil, Saint Ephrem, Saint John Chrysostom. What is more, according to Baronius it was a common opinion among the Greek Fathers that this truth was expressly revealed to Saint Simeon Stylites and that after this revelation, it was to secure his salvation that he decided to live standing on top of a pillar for forty years, exposed to the weather, a model of penance and holiness for everyone. Now let us consult the Latin Fathers. You will hear Saint Gregory saying clearly, ‘Many attain to faith, but few to the heavenly kingdom.’ Saint Anselm declares, ‘There are few who are saved.’ Saint Augustine states even more clearly, ‘Therefore, few are saved in comparison to those who are damned.’ The most terrifying, however, is Saint Jerome. At the end of his life, in the presence of his disciples, he spoke these dreadful words: ‘Out of one hundred thousand people whose lives have always been bad, you will find barely one who is worthy of indulgence.’ (On The Little Number of Those Who Are Saved, by St. Leonard of Port Maurice)

What would not the billions of suffering souls in Hell do, who fell into the most horrifying torments imaginable for the sake of carnal impurities and temptations of the flesh, if they had a second chance to escape their eternal torment? In truth, they would gladly walk on the surface of the Sun, which is millions of degrees hot for a billion times billion years if God enabled them to do so. To choose a single second of sinful pleasure (which is how short this life is compared to eternity) for an infinite time of excruciating torments and tortures in hell is unfathomable, and yet, literally the whole world consents to this devilish trap!

Take heed that you, the reader, do not reject this admonishment, for it might be the last time you will hear such words before death suddenly strikes you and the Devil takes you and devours you for all eternity to come! “… Take all states, both sexes, every condition: husbands, wives, widows, young women, young men, soldiers, merchants, craftsmen, rich and poor, noble and plebian. What are we to say about all these people who are living so badly? The following narrative from Saint Vincent Ferrer will show you what you may think about it. He relates that an archdeacon in Lyons gave up his charge and retreated into a desert place to do penance, and that he died the same day and hour as Saint Bernard. After his death, he appeared to his bishop and said to him, ‘Know, Monsignor, that at the very hour I passed away, thirty-three thousand people also died. Out of this number, Bernard and myself went up to Heaven without delay, three went to purgatory, and all the others fell into Hell.’ Our chronicles relate an even more dreadful happening. One of our brothers, well-known for his doctrine and holiness, was preaching in Germany. He represented the ugliness of the sin of impurity so forceful that a woman fell dead of sorrow in front of everyone. Then, coming back to life, she said, ‘When I was presented before the Tribunal of God, sixty thousand people arrived at the same time from all parts of the world; out of that number, three were saved by going to Purgatory, and all the rest were damned.’ O abyss of the judgments of God! Out of thirty thousand, only five were saved! And out of sixty thousand, only three went to Heaven! You sinners who are listening to me, in what category will you be numbered?... What do you say?... What do you think?[/b]...” (On The Little Number of Those Who Are Saved, by St. Leonard of Port Maurice)

Fr. Martin Von Cochem’s masterpiece book “The Four Last Things” (that deals specifically with the topics of Hell, the fear of God, death and judgment), explains the frightful truth of Our Lord’s words in the Gospel of how few people there actually are on this earth that even find the path to Heaven even once while living on this earth, and much less persevere on it until their death:

Quote
“Let me ask thee, O reader, what proportion thinkest thou of all who live upon this earth will be saved? Half? or a third part? or perhaps a quarter? Alas, I fear, and not without good reason, that the number will not be nearly so large. Jesus Christ, who is eternal Truth, His holy apostles, and the Fathers of the Church, all tell us that so it will be.

“What does Christ say about the number of the elect? His words are these: "Many are called, but few are chosen." He repeats these words when He speaks of the guest who had not on a wedding garment: "Bind his hands and his feet, and cast him into the exterior darkness. For many are called, but few chosen." Were nothing more to be found to this intent in the whole of the Scriptures, this passage could not fail to alarm us. But there are many other similar ones, of which I will quote one or two. In the Gospel of St. Matthew we read that Our Lord said: "Enter ye in at the narrow gate, for wide is the gate and broad is the way that leadeth unto destruction, and many there are that go in thereat. How narrow is the gate and strait is the way that leadeth unto life, and few there are that find it." (Matt. 7:13) Are not these words calculated to inspire us with anxiety and apprehension? May not we be amongst those who go in at the wide gate, who walk on the broad road that ends in everlasting perdition? In order that thou mayst better appreciate the meaning of Our Lord’s words, and perceive more clearly how few are the elect, observe that Christ did not say that those were few in number who walked in the path to heaven, but that there were but few who found that narrow way. "How strait is the gate that leadeth unto life, and few there are that find it." It is as if the Savior intended to say: The path leading to heaven is so narrow and so rough, it is so overgrown, so dark and difficult to discern, that there are many who, their whole life long, never find it. And those who do find it are exposed constantly to the danger of deviating from it, of mistaking their way and unwittingly wandering away from it, because it is so irregular and overgrown. This St. Jerome says, in his commentary on the passage in question. Again, there are some who when they are on the right road, hasten to leave it, because it is so steep and toilsome. There are also many who are enticed to leave the narrow way by the wiles and deceits of the devil, and thus, almost imperceptibly to themselves, are led downwards to hell.” (Fr. Martin Von Cochem, The Four Last Things, pp. 212-213)

If people could only open their fleshly eyes and start seeing with their spiritual eyes how short this life and the lust of the flesh is, everyone would immediately start avoiding the occasions of sin, but no one today wants to contemplate or meditate on the end of all flesh, which is death and decay in the grave. They behave as mentally ill people who willfully forgets that they must die and be judged by our Lord Jesus Christ. The thought of death is indeed powerful to conquer every sin and sinful occasion, but while people know that they must die, they willfully choose to forget this fact, since the very thought of death and change is repugnant to their fleshly beings, and directly associated with the thought of being judged by God for their sins. And so, they choose to forget that they must die and be judged by God in order to not have to feel any distress, fear or remorse from their evil conscience every time they sin.

But the time will come when they – standing in shame and ignominy in front of the whole world at the day of judgment – will be forced against their will to remember and confess every single sinful and lustful act that they have ever committed from the moment they reached the age of reason to their very last breath, and then, after their just condemnation, their eternal punishment will begin. Their soul shall be separated from their sinful and fleshly rotting body for the sake of their vile and shameful affections and lusts and be cast into the eternal fire “in the pool burning with fire and brimstone, which is the second death.” (Apocalypse 21:8

Offline Chestertonian

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Re: Why the thread "Last movie you saw?" if filled with mortal sins
« Reply #6 on: October 14, 2016, 08:16:56 AM »
TL,DR
"I am not much of a Crusader, that is for sure, but at least I am not a Mohamedist!"
 
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Re: Why the thread "Last movie you saw?" if filled with mortal sins
« Reply #7 on: October 14, 2016, 08:36:38 AM »
are in mortal sin (even if they don't think they are)

...and I stopped reading right here. Review the conditions of mortal sin to apply, friend.
If thou wilt receive profit, read with humility, simplicity, and faith, and seek not at any time the fame of being learned.

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Offline dymphna17

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Re: Why the thread "Last movie you saw?" if filled with mortal sins
« Reply #8 on: October 14, 2016, 08:48:33 AM »
Quote
Conclusion: Catholics must understand that few are saved. Our Lord Jesus Christ revealed that the road to Heaven is straight and narrow and few find it, while the road to Hell is wide and taken by most (Mt. 7:13).

Um, 2 things here, Jerome, is it?  Yes, Jerome.  OK, 2 things Jerome.  In the above quote, you say "Conclusion" even though it is clearly not the conclusion of your statements or your posts.  Therefore, you are a liar.  When you deal with other people's souls, being a liar can be most grievous.  I suggest you get to confession asap.  You can't be in judgement of other people's souls with a sin like that on your own soul.  Your credibility is shot.

The second thing is, you are not a Priest.  Unless you are lying about that too.  See how that works?  Anyway, you do not have the right to usurp a Priest's role in guiding his sheep.  Nor do you have the right to sit in judgement of anyone else's intentions or the state of their souls.  Plain and simple.  If you find that thread objectionable, don't go there.  Please avoid extremism at all costs.  Perhaps you didn't realize how extreme you are coming across.  The only person affected by it, is you.  You will not get a good response coming across that way.  Just as an FYI for you.  Do with it what you will.   :pray1:
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Re: Why the thread "Last movie you saw?" if filled with mortal sins
« Reply #9 on: October 14, 2016, 09:10:24 AM »
are in mortal sin (even if they don't think they are)

...and I stopped reading right here. Review the conditions of mortal sin to apply, friend.

Claiming ignorance of the natural law won't excuse people from mortal sin. Some sins are sinful even though people don't think (or "know") they are: such as rape, murder, pedophilia, abortion, masturbation, and putting oneself in the occasion of sinning - which is what this thread is about:

Quote
Pope Innocent XI, Various Errors on Moral Matters #61, March 4, 1679: “He can sometimes be absolved, who remains in a proximate occasion of sinning, which he can and does not wish to omit, but rather directly and professedly seeks or enters into.” – Condemned statement by Pope Innocent XI.
Pope Innocent XI, Various Errors on Moral Matters #62, March 4, 1679: “The proximate occasion for sinning is not to be shunned when some useful and honorable cause for not shunning it occurs.” – Condemned statement by Pope Innocent XI.
Pope Innocent XI, Various Errors on Moral Matters #63, March 4, 1679: “It is permitted to seek directly the proximate occasion for sinning for a spiritual or temporal good of our own or of a neighbor.” – Condemned statement by Pope Innocent XI.

As the Haydock Bible and Commentary correctly explains about The Natural Law and Romans 2:14-16: “these men are a law to themselves, and have it written in their hearts, as to the existence of a God, and their reason tells them, that many sins are unlawful...”

So while thinking you know what you are talking about, you are showing yourself to be profoundly ignorant.

Perhaps the thread will be helpful to you. Is is adviced that you read it.

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Re: Why the thread "Last movie you saw?" if filled with mortal sins
« Reply #10 on: October 14, 2016, 09:29:07 AM »
having trouble hearing you down herebecause your horse is so high
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Re: Why the thread "Last movie you saw?" if filled with mortal sins
« Reply #11 on: October 14, 2016, 09:33:35 AM »
having trouble hearing you down herebecause your horse is so high

 :laugh:
In conclusion, I can leave you with no better advice than that given after every sermon by Msgr Vincent Giammarino, who was pastor of St Michael’s Church in Atlantic City in the 1950s:

    “My dear good people: Do what you have to do, When you’re supposed to do it, The best way you can do it,   For the Love of God. Amen.”
 

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Re: Why the thread "Last movie you saw?" if filled with mortal sins
« Reply #12 on: October 14, 2016, 09:42:03 AM »
Um, 2 things here, Jerome, is it?  Yes, Jerome.  OK, 2 things Jerome.  In the above quote, you say "Conclusion" even though it is clearly not the conclusion of your statements or your posts.  Therefore, you are a liar.  When you deal with other people's souls, being a liar can be most grievous.  I suggest you get to confession asap.  You can't be in judgement of other people's souls with a sin like that on your own soul.  Your credibility is shot.

The conclusion was already self evident from my facts and points previously (and I am more after making points than following some kind of writings rules as you seems to think I must follow under pain of mortal sin). The Church teaches that putting oneself in the occasion of sinning is a mortal sin. That's a fact. Yet you accuse me of committing mortal sin for stating this fact, even though I demonstrably proved my point and that people do so.

If people don't want to accept the truth of the necessity of avoiding the occasion of sinning, just as the Church teaches, then they will have to deal with the eternal consequences afterwards, and take it up with Jesus Christ in judgment.

Jesus accurately described bad willed people that resists the truth with all their heart in the following words: "Give not that which is holy to dogs; neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest perhaps they trample them under their feet, and turning upon you, they tear you." (Matthew 7:6)


The second thing is, you are not a Priest.  Unless you are lying about that too.  See how that works?  Anyway, you do not have the right to usurp a Priest's role in guiding his sheep.

I have never said I am a priest. You should think before you write (and accuse people). Slander is a mortal sin, yet many people sadly don't even seem to think before they write or speak, in order to see that it is all according to truth.

And you are profoundly mistaken if you think only priests can admonish and instruct souls. (And again, when there is silence on many issues, someone else has to speak about them. This is so obvious that one can only marvel, but people will just object with anything)

If the real priests did their job here, I would not need to make this thread or write about it. The fact of the matter is that many priests themselves may be slaves to media and occasions of sinning, sadly.

And if you think it is "safe" to just follow any priests, think again. When the blind lead the blind they both fall into the pit. People who put themselves in the occasion of sinning know that they are committing a sin. It is written on their hearts. They don’t need a priest to tell them that it’s wrong. Yes, the priests who obstinately tells people they can do this crime are also guilty, but this does not take away the responsibility of the people who follow their bad advice.

For example, Pope Pius XI teaches there are no exceptions and no excuses. No excuses, even if your priest or bishop said it can be used.

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Pope Pius XI, Casti Connubii (# 57), Dec. 31, 1930: “We admonish, therefore, priests who hear confessions and others who have the care of souls, in virtue of Our Supreme authority and in Our solicitude for the salvation of souls, not to allow the faithful entrusted to them to err regarding this most grave law of God; much more, that they keep themselves immune from such false opinions, in no way conniving in them. If any confessor or pastor of souls, which may God forbid, lead the faithful entrusted to him into these errors, or should at least confirm them by approval or by guilty silence, let him be mindful of the fact that he must render a strict account to God, the Supreme Judge, for the betrayal of his sacred trust, and let him take to himself the words of Christ: ‘They are blind and leaders of the blind: and if the blind lead the blind, both fall into the pit.’”

So here we have Pope Pius XI warning about bad priests that are leading souls to Hell "by guilty silence", or "at least confirm them [the sin] by approval" before Vatican II.


Nor do you have the right to sit in judgement of anyone else's intentions or the state of their souls.  Plain and simple.  If you find that thread objectionable, don't go there.  Please avoid extremism at all costs.  Perhaps you didn't realize how extreme you are coming across.  The only person affected by it, is you.  You will not get a good response coming across that way.  Just as an FYI for you.  Do with it what you will.   :pray1:

According to the Church's teaching, people who put themselves in totally unnecessary occasions of sinning (media have absolutely no real necessity) are in mortal sin. Since the Church and the saints teaches this, I have all the right to teach this. If you can't see it, then it is because you are blind.

And yes, my point was to be extreme, since I did try a soft approach, but fear it won't help most. So now I will just tell it as it is.

P.S.

Compare what you wrote with what Chrysostom writes about remaining silent when no one else it speaking about it:

"Do you find it an oppressive burden to denounce those who commit these sins? It is an oppressive burden to remain silent. For this silence makes you an enemy to God and brings destruction both to you who conceal such sinners and to those whose sins go unrevealed. How much better it is to become hateful to our fellow servants for saving them to provoke God's anger against yourselves. Even if your fellow servant be vexed with you now, he will not be able to harm you but will be grateful later on for his cure. But if you seek to win your fellow servant's favor, if you remain silent and hurt him by concealing his sin, God will exact from you the ultimate penalty." -- St. John Chrysostom

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Re: Why the thread "Last movie you saw?" if filled with mortal sins
« Reply #13 on: October 14, 2016, 09:43:43 AM »
are in mortal sin (even if they don't think they are)

...and I stopped reading right here. Review the conditions of mortal sin to apply, friend.

Claiming ignorance of the natural law won't excuse people from mortal sin. Some sins are sinful even though people don't think (or "know") they are: such as rape, murder, pedophilia, abortion, masturbation, and putting oneself in the occasion of sinning - which is what this thread is about:

Quote
Pope Innocent XI, Various Errors on Moral Matters #61, March 4, 1679: “He can sometimes be absolved, who remains in a proximate occasion of sinning, which he can and does not wish to omit, but rather directly and professedly seeks or enters into.” – Condemned statement by Pope Innocent XI.
Pope Innocent XI, Various Errors on Moral Matters #62, March 4, 1679: “The proximate occasion for sinning is not to be shunned when some useful and honorable cause for not shunning it occurs.” – Condemned statement by Pope Innocent XI.
Pope Innocent XI, Various Errors on Moral Matters #63, March 4, 1679: “It is permitted to seek directly the proximate occasion for sinning for a spiritual or temporal good of our own or of a neighbor.” – Condemned statement by Pope Innocent XI.

As the Haydock Bible and Commentary correctly explains about The Natural Law and Romans 2:14-16: “these men are a law to themselves, and have it written in their hearts, as to the existence of a God, and their reason tells them, that many sins are unlawful...”

So while thinking you know what you are talking about, you are showing yourself to be profoundly ignorant.

Perhaps the thread will be helpful to you. Is is adviced that you read it.

Well, you sure have to read, research, and study an awful lot to get a hold of the "natural law", eh? Makes sense.
If thou wilt receive profit, read with humility, simplicity, and faith, and seek not at any time the fame of being learned.

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Offline Jerome

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Re: Why the thread "Last movie you saw?" if filled with mortal sins
« Reply #14 on: October 14, 2016, 09:57:12 AM »
are in mortal sin (even if they don't think they are)

...and I stopped reading right here. Review the conditions of mortal sin to apply, friend.

Claiming ignorance of the natural law won't excuse people from mortal sin. Some sins are sinful even though people don't think (or "know") they are: such as rape, murder, pedophilia, abortion, masturbation, and putting oneself in the occasion of sinning - which is what this thread is about:

Quote
Pope Innocent XI, Various Errors on Moral Matters #61, March 4, 1679: “He can sometimes be absolved, who remains in a proximate occasion of sinning, which he can and does not wish to omit, but rather directly and professedly seeks or enters into.” – Condemned statement by Pope Innocent XI.
Pope Innocent XI, Various Errors on Moral Matters #62, March 4, 1679: “The proximate occasion for sinning is not to be shunned when some useful and honorable cause for not shunning it occurs.” – Condemned statement by Pope Innocent XI.
Pope Innocent XI, Various Errors on Moral Matters #63, March 4, 1679: “It is permitted to seek directly the proximate occasion for sinning for a spiritual or temporal good of our own or of a neighbor.” – Condemned statement by Pope Innocent XI.

As the Haydock Bible and Commentary correctly explains about The Natural Law and Romans 2:14-16: “these men are a law to themselves, and have it written in their hearts, as to the existence of a God, and their reason tells them, that many sins are unlawful...”

So while thinking you know what you are talking about, you are showing yourself to be profoundly ignorant.

Perhaps the thread will be helpful to you. Is is adviced that you read it.

Well, you sure have to read, research, and study an awful lot to get a hold of the "natural law", eh? Makes sense.

No, that's the point. One don't have to read or study anything to "understand" the natural law written by God in everyones heart.

You don't have to study to know that murder, theft or rape is wrong. Therefore, there is no excuse for committing these sins even if people "claim" they did not know.

It is the same with the sin of masturbation, which is a mortal sin against nature. People can't claim "ignorance" of this sin, but will always be guilty of mortal sin if they commit it. If they claim they don't know it is sinful, it is because they are evil and because they have smothered their conscience. What smothers peoples conscience? Lust, sensuality, gluttony, and putting oneself in the occasions of sinning!

If people would only keep the Natural Law, the devil would never be able to conquer. However, of all the seven mortal sins, lust is especially powerful in inducing a man to fall into blindness of mind. A great reason why people become “hardened” according to St. Thomas, is because sensual pleasures actually “gives rise to blindness of mind, which excludes almost entirely the knowledge of spiritual things, while dulness of sense arises from gluttony, which makes a man weak in regard to the same [spiritual] intelligible things.” (St. Thomas Aquinas, Summa Theologica, II:II, Q. 15, Art. 3) Indeed, this “blindness of mind” and “dulness of sense” in regards to “the knowledge of spiritual things” that St. Thomas describes is undoubtedly the main reason why many people, however much evidence is provided, refuse to convert (such as heretics) or do the right thing (such as Catholics refusing to avoid the occasions of sinning or neglecting to teach their children to do the same). It is therefore true to say that “The perverse are hard to be corrected, and the number of fools [and damned people] is infinite” (Ecclesiastes 1:15) and that this is the reason for why “few are saved” (Matthew 7:13).

St. Thomas explains that masturbation is an unnatural sin just like homosexuality and bestiality is:

Quote
St. Thomas Aquinas, Summa Theologica, Second Part of the Second Part, Q. 154, Art. 12: “Whether the unnatural vice is the greatest sin among the species of lust? I answer that, In every genus, worst of all is the corruption of the principle on which the rest depend. Now the principles of reason are those things that are according to nature, because reason presupposes things as determined by nature, before disposing of other things according as it is fitting. … Therefore, since by the unnatural vices [masturbation, homosexuality, sodomy, bestiality, etc.] man transgresses that [purpose] which has been determined by nature [for the procreation of children] with regard to the use of venereal actions, it follows that in this matter [species of lust] this sin [the unnatural vice] is gravest of all.”