Author Topic: "Gloria in excelsis Deo"?  (Read 893 times)

Offline Daniel

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"Gloria in excelsis Deo"?
« on: January 13, 2015, 10:30:08 AM »
At Mass, why is the first line of the Gloria worded as "Gloria in excelsis Deo" and not "Gloria in altissimis Deo" (as it is worded in Luke 2:14)?

And while I'm asking, does anyone know why the Pater Noster uses the word "quotidianum" (taken from Luke 11:3) when the prayer itself is otherwise identical to the prayer found in Matthew 6:9-13 (which uses the word "supersubstantialem" instead)?
Also, why do I occasionally see the word "quotidianum" changed to "cotidianum"?  Is that just to make it easier to sing during the liturgy?
 

Offline Maximilian

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Re: "Gloria in excelsis Deo"?
« Reply #1 on: January 13, 2015, 11:42:01 AM »

At Mass, why is the first line of the Gloria worded as "Gloria in excelsis Deo" and not "Gloria in altissimis Deo" (as it is worded in Luke 2:14)?

And while I'm asking, does anyone know why the Pater Noster uses the word "quotidianum" (taken from Luke 11:3) when the prayer itself is otherwise identical to the prayer found in Matthew 6:9-13 (which uses the word "supersubstantialem" instead)?
Also, why do I occasionally see the word "quotidianum" changed to "cotidianum"?  Is that just to make it easier to sing during the liturgy?

It's explained here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vetus_Latina

The Old Latin text survives in places in the liturgy, such as the following verse well known from Christmas carols, Luke 2:14:

Gloria in excelsis Deo, et in terra pax hominibus bonae voluntatis
   
The Old Latin text means, "Glory [belongs] to God among the high, and peace [belongs] to men of good will on earth". The Vulgate text means "Glory [belongs] to God among the most high and peace among men of good will on earth".

Probably the most well known difference between the Old Latin and the Vulgate is in the Pater Noster, where the phrase from the Vetus Latina, quotidianum panem, "daily bread", becomes supersubstantialem panem, "supersubstantial bread" in the Vulgate.
 

Offline VeraeFidei

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Re: "Gloria in excelsis Deo"?
« Reply #2 on: January 13, 2015, 11:45:32 AM »
At Mass, why is the first line of the Gloria worded as "Gloria in excelsis Deo" and not "Gloria in altissimis Deo" (as it is worded in Luke 2:14)?

And while I'm asking, does anyone know why the Pater Noster uses the word "quotidianum" (taken from Luke 11:3) when the prayer itself is otherwise identical to the prayer found in Matthew 6:9-13 (which uses the word "supersubstantialem" instead)?
Also, why do I occasionally see the word "quotidianum" changed to "cotidianum"?  Is that just to make it easier to sing during the liturgy?
I would surmise that at least the Gloria in excelsis Deo discrepancy comes from an older version of the Scriptures than the Vulgate. That is just a guess, however. If you pray the Office, you notice that sometimes an antiphon from a Psalm does not match exactly the part of the Psalm - because in many cases the Antiphons (although by-and-large only in the pre-1911 Office) are older than the Vulgate, coming from what is collectively referred to as the Old Latin Bible.

With regard to the Pater, the West has always had a much less Eucharistic Pater than the East. Some regard the "supersubstantialem" as a later corruption, and so it is also possible that the liturgical Pater was already set in the West.

As I said, though, both of those are merely semi-educated guesses.


edit: scooped by Maximilian