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The Parish Hall => The History Subforum => Topic started by: Vetus Ordo on September 04, 2019, 07:52:22 PM

Title: When Joseph Stalin’s Daughter Became Catholic
Post by: Vetus Ordo on September 04, 2019, 07:52:22 PM
When Joseph Stalin’s Daughter Became Catholic

“The Eucharist has given me life,” she said — and “my father would have shot me for what I have done.”

In National Catholic Register (http://www.ncregister.com/blog/matthew-archbold/the-stalin-who-converted-to-catholicism).

(http://www.ncregister.com/images/uploads/Archbold-STALIN.jpg)

Joseph Stalin with his daughter Svetlana in 1935 (Wikimedia Commons)

Svetlana Stalin, the daughter of the murderous dictator Joseph Stalin, renounced materialism and converted to Catholicism. Joseph would not have approved. In fact, Svetlana once reportedly told an editor of National Review that “my father would have shot me for what I have done.”

Joseph Stalin himself was raised in the Orthodox Church. His parents actually wanted him to be a priest. Unfortunately, his father abused the young Joseph mercilessly. Stalin once described his childhood as having been “raised in a poor priest-ridden household.” He came to renounce Christianity altogether, reportedly saying, "You know, they are fooling us, there is no God… all this talk about God is sheer nonsense." While in power, Stalin did everything he could to crush Christianity, closing down thousands of churches and violently torturing, killing, and imprisoning Christians. This is the man who was reputed to have said, "One death is a tragedy; one million is a statistic" so you can imagine the merciless persecution he mounted against Christianity. Here is a photo of the demolition of the Cathedral of Christ the Saviour in Moscow on the orders of Stalin, just before Christmas 1931:

(https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-wYD5ywXyZ6g/XU1akbd3DeI/AAAAAAAAFYU/I6IIIHHW0KcNcHLkMJG80IOhmloieXW-ACLcBGAs/s320/Christ_saviour_explosion.jpg)

But it was all for the Marxist cause. In fact, his daughter Svetlana once wrote of her father, “Many people today find it easier to think of [Stalin] as a coarse physical monster. Actually, he was a moral and spiritual monster. This is far more terrifying. But it’s the truth.”

She was right. It is more terrifying.

Stalin established as the goal of the 'five-year plans of atheism' directed by the League of the Militant Godless eliminating all religious expression in the country. Reportedly, during just the purges of 1937 and 1938, well over 168,300 Russian Orthodox clergy were arrested, a majority of whom were shot. And that was just during two years. But as the great singer Sting once pointed out, “The Russians love their children too,” and this was true of Stalin. Well, one of them anyway. Stalin adored Svetlana and was playful and affectionate with her. And she reciprocated. As a child she looked up to her father as a wise hero. When she was born in 1926 her father was already General Secretary of Central Committee of the Communist Party and anyone she came into contact with spoke of her father in strictly laudatory tones. She later came to understand that few dared to even whisper criticisms.

(https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-36C2cBEOcDg/XVByEcBrhxI/AAAAAAAAFYg/cuzGS0JCGAIYUbkvXRh_uB33K0wprukuwCLcBGAs/s320/SvetlanaStalin-582846.jpg)

By comparison, Svetlana found her mother, Nadezhda Alliluyeva (“Nadya”) cold. Svetlana reportedly said that she couldn't remember her mother ever hugging her or even complimenting her.  Then in 1932, when Svetlana was only six years old her mother killed herself. But her relationship with her father remained strong, at least for a while.

Doubts about her father would soon begin. In school, Svetlana would sometimes be handed notes by classmates whose mother or father had been “disappeared” by the state. They were begging her to pass them on to her father. It was an odd thing about the USSR that while so much pain and violence was inflicted on the people by the government many persisted in believing that Stalin was blameless and that if he knew about the abuses going on he surely would have stopped them. These children sending notes to Stalin through his daughter simply wanted to know where their loved ones were. The dictator coldly instructed his daughter not to act as a “post-office box.”

Later, Svetlana noticed that sometimes even her own relatives disappeared. Even then, Svetlana attributed it, as did so many Russians, as things which Stalin was either unaware of or unable to fix. But years later, her father would flatly tell his daughter that her relatives had been killed simply because “they knew too much. They babbled a lot,” he said, and it “played into the hands of our enemies.” You see, the official party line had been that Nadya had died of a burst appendix, not at her own hand.

When Svetlana found her first boyfriend her father considered him unacceptable and condemned him to a Gulag. Later, she attended Moscow University and received a marriage proposal from a young Jewish man. When she told her father about the proposal he coldly said, “To hell with you. Do as you like.” He told her that she could marry him but only on the condition that her husband never set foot in his house. The two had a son but their marriage broke up after a few short years. Shortly after, she married the son of a man who had been high up in the Kremlin. Joseph approved of this marriage but it too ended rather quickly.

In March 1953, Stalin died. “My father died a difficult and terrible death,” wrote Svetlana. She was there at his bedside for days, as doctors applied leeches.

Reportedly, he died raising his fist in anger. “The death agony was terrible. He literally choked to death as we watched,” Svetlana wrote. “At what seemed the very last moment he suddenly opened his eyes and cast a glance over everyone in the room. It was a terrible glance, insane or perhaps angry and full of fear of death. Then he suddenly lifted his left hand. The gesture was incomprehensible and full of menace.”

A few years after her father's death, Svetlana changed her name to her mother’s maiden name. She said the name Stalin “lacerated” her ears. She was now Svetlana Alliluyeva. Joseph Stalin had changed his last name to make it sound strong. “Stalin” means steel. The name “Alliluyeva” was a form of “Allelujah” which fit Svetlana better at that time because in 1962, she was baptized in the Orthodox Church. Svetlana rejected the materialism and violence of her father. Of her decision, she wrote, “The sacrament of baptism consists in rejecting evil, the lie. I believed in ‘Thou shalt not kill,’ I believed in truth without violence and bloodshed. I believed that the Supreme Mind, not vain man, governed the world. I believed that the Spirit of Truth was stronger than material values. And when all of this had entered my heart, the shreds of Marxism-Leninism taught me since childhood vanished like smoke.”

Svetlana was officially out of favor with the Kremlin. In fact, when she applied to the state for a marriage license to a man named Brajesh Singh she was promptly denied. Svetlana and Brajesh lived together for three years before he died in 1966. His wish had been to have his ashes spread on the Ganges. So she applied to the Kremlin for permission to travel to India. Much to her surprise, she was given permission to temporarily leave the USSR to go to India for one month.

While there, Svetlana stunned the world when on her trip she walked into the U.S. embassy and requested asylum. A stunned American on duty reportedly said to her, “So you say your father was Stalin? The Stalin?”

From there, she was flown to Rome and then on to Switzerland. She liked Switzerland but was told that could only remain there on the condition that she never speak publicly about politics. She would not agree to that. She could not. “To remain silent for another 40 years could have been achieved just as well in the U.S.S.R.,” she wrote.

In April of 1967, Svetlana Alliluyeva landed at Kennedy Airport in New York carrying a manuscript that never would have been published in the USSR. It was titled "Twenty Letters to a Friend" which was about her life in the Soviet Union. It was a huge success and a bestseller. And then, just two years later, she wrote another bestseller about her life since defecting titled “Only One Year.” She was famous but her personal life was still a wreck. Switching from religion to religion and once again marrying, having a child, divorcing, and moving often, she found herself disenchanted with America and wanting to return home. In fact, she did return to the Soviet Union but almost instantly regretted it.

When she returned to America after over a year in the USSR she said, “I had to leave for a while to realize, ‘Oh, my God, how wonderful it is.’”

I don't know the exact year that Svetlana met Father Giovanni Garbolino, who lived in the United States but had done missionary work in Russia, but their relationship would change her life. Svetlana received a letter from Fr. Garbolino inviting her to make a pilgrimage to Fátima. Then later, he visited her in Princeton, New Jersey. The two were in frequent contact. Fr. Garbolino also gave Svetlana a cross that had been given to him by a Russian student whom he met during his missionary travels. Later, Fr. Garbolino had given that same cross to Col. Edwin "Buzz" Aldrin for him to take to the moon with him.

Svetlana, with the guidance of Fr. Garbolino, read books by Catholic authors and on Dec. 13, 1982, she converted to the Catholic faith. Svetlana wrote about her conversion: “Only now I understand the wonderful grace that the Sacraments of Penance and the Holy Eucharist produce, no matter what day of the year, and even on a daily basis. Before, I was unwilling to forgive and repent, and I was never able to love my enemies. But I feel very different from before, since I attend Mass every day.” She added, “The Eucharist has given me life. The Sacrament of Penance with God whom… we abandon and betray each day, the sense of guilt and sadness that invades us then, all this makes it necessary to receive it frequently.”

This woman, who grew up essentially motherless, wrote, “I was taken into the arms of the Blessed Virgin Mary... Who else could be my advocate but the Mother of Jesus? She suddenly drew me close to her.”

She traveled to Europe and back to America often and then moved to be near one of her daughters in Oregon. In the end, she did not die raising her first in anger at the world as her father had done but peacefully in a Wisconsin nursing home in 2011 where she had enjoyed sewing and reading and surely praying.
Title: Re: When Joseph Stalin’s Daughter Became Catholic
Post by: mikemac on September 04, 2019, 11:39:58 PM
Cool
Title: Re: When Joseph Stalin’s Daughter Became Catholic
Post by: Lynne on September 05, 2019, 04:26:12 AM
What a life!
Title: Re: When Joseph Stalin’s Daughter Became Catholic
Post by: clau clau on September 05, 2019, 06:54:57 AM
Reportedly, he died raising his fist in anger. “The death agony was terrible. He literally choked to death as we watched,” Svetlana wrote. “At what seemed the very last moment he suddenly opened his eyes and cast a glance over everyone in the room. It was a terrible glance, insane or perhaps angry and full of fear of death. Then he suddenly lifted his left hand. The gesture was incomprehensible and full of menace.”

- vengeance is mine, sayeth the Lord.  I will repay!

It was an odd thing about the USSR that while so much pain and violence was inflicted on the people by the government many persisted in believing that Stalin was blameless and that if he knew about the abuses going on he surely would have stopped them.

It's funny, this paragraph brought to mind the situation with the Bishops, Cardinals and the Pope when abuses were brought to their attention. I guess the Bishops, Cardinals and Pope knew about the abuses ... and they did nothing!
Title: Re: When Joseph Stalin’s Daughter Became Catholic
Post by: gsas on September 05, 2019, 11:56:41 AM
Stalin's behavior, especially around his death, would be typical if we assumed that he was deeply involved with the dark powers of the occult.

"Joseph Stalin himself was raised in the Orthodox Church. His parents actually wanted him to be a priest. Unfortunately, his father abused the young Joseph mercilessly. Stalin once described his childhood as having been “raised in a poor priest-ridden household.” "

The devil is also a liar, I believe the anecdotal stories more, that stalin grew up as a jew, then converted briefly to Christianity, before he dedicated himself to communism and to the occult.

Title: Re: When Joseph Stalin’s Daughter Became Catholic
Post by: martin88nyc on September 05, 2019, 04:36:36 PM
Stalin died because he was denied a doctor because everybody wanted him dead. He also might've been poisoned.
Title: Re: When Joseph Stalin’s Daughter Became Catholic
Post by: gsas on September 05, 2019, 08:36:11 PM
The op says that his wife committed suicide.  Does that mean that his wife is in hell now as a result?  If yes, then Stalin put her there?
Title: Re: When Joseph Stalin’s Daughter Became Catholic
Post by: Vetus Ordo on September 05, 2019, 11:21:18 PM
Does that mean that his wife is in hell now as a result?

Traditionally speaking, yes.

If yes, then Stalin put her there?

No, God put her there.
Title: Re: When Joseph Stalin’s Daughter Became Catholic
Post by: Chestertonian on September 06, 2019, 07:39:49 AM
interesting that Stalin was abused by his father.  so was Margaret sanger.  imagine what the world would be like if they both had strong and kind fathers
Title: Re: When Joseph Stalin’s Daughter Became Catholic
Post by: martin88nyc on September 06, 2019, 01:09:00 PM
Does that mean that his wife is in hell now as a result?

Traditionally speaking, yes.

If yes, then Stalin put her there?

No, God put her there.
Nooo. SHE put herself there.
Title: Re: When Joseph Stalin’s Daughter Became Catholic
Post by: gsas on September 06, 2019, 02:51:12 PM
interesting that Stalin was abused by his father.  so was Margaret sanger.  imagine what the world would be like if they both had strong and kind fathers

Having Satanist fathers sucks.
Title: Re: When Joseph Stalin’s Daughter Became Catholic
Post by: gsas on September 06, 2019, 02:54:57 PM
Does that mean that his wife is in hell now as a result?

Traditionally speaking, yes.

If yes, then Stalin put her there?

No, God put her there.
Nooo. SHE put herself there.

But the evil stalin drove her mad, which is why she committed suicide.  And if you kill yourself in a moment of madness, then eternity of torture in hell is rather harsh.  Especially if everyone knows who made you mad.  Are you sure that she is in hell?  What is God thinking?  I think this would be an excellent question about 1 Corinthians destroying of God's temple.  I can imagine how that wife suffered.  Hmmm.
Title: Re: When Joseph Stalin’s Daughter Became Catholic
Post by: martin88nyc on September 06, 2019, 06:45:40 PM
Does that mean that his wife is in hell now as a result?

Traditionally speaking, yes.

If yes, then Stalin put her there?

No, God put her there.
Nooo. SHE put herself there.

But the evil stalin drove her mad, which is why she committed suicide.  And if you kill yourself in a moment of madness, then eternity of torture in hell is rather harsh.  Especially if everyone knows who made you mad.  Are you sure that she is in hell?  What is God thinking?  I think this would be an excellent question about 1 Corinthians destroying of God's temple.  I can imagine how that wife suffered.  Hmmm.
I don't know where she is de facto but commiting a suicide is considered a grave sin. Anyhow I wasn't trying to be smart ass. I only wanted to underline that God never sends us anywhere. We ourselves do so by rejecting Him and His laws.
Title: Re: When Joseph Stalin’s Daughter Became Catholic
Post by: gsas on September 06, 2019, 11:26:13 PM
Maybe another interesting point is Stalin's upbringing.  The purpose of child abuse is usually the invitation of the devil into the child.  Hence, if Stalin prayed against the beatings that he received, his father would have beaten him more, until he gets convinced that prayer is useless.  This is most likely how Stalin got convinced that there is no God.
Title: Re: When Joseph Stalin’s Daughter Became Catholic
Post by: TheReturnofLive on September 07, 2019, 04:08:00 PM
Stalin died because he was denied a doctor because everybody wanted him dead. He also might've been poisoned.

Title: Re: When Joseph Stalin’s Daughter Became Catholic
Post by: diaduit on September 10, 2019, 03:04:46 AM
Maybe another interesting point is Stalin's upbringing.  The purpose of child abuse is usually the invitation of the devil into the child.  Hence, if Stalin prayed against the beatings that he received, his father would have beaten him more, until he gets convinced that prayer is useless.  This is most likely how Stalin got convinced that there is no God.

I read before that Stalin was actually disobedient to his father to the point he humiliated him and he had an overbearing adoring mother who let his bad behavior pass. So to did Mao tse Tung ....spot the problem.
Title: Re: When Joseph Stalin’s Daughter Became Catholic
Post by: gsas on September 10, 2019, 10:24:35 AM
Maybe another interesting point is Stalin's upbringing.  The purpose of child abuse is usually the invitation of the devil into the child.  Hence, if Stalin prayed against the beatings that he received, his father would have beaten him more, until he gets convinced that prayer is useless.  This is most likely how Stalin got convinced that there is no God.

I read before that Stalin was actually disobedient to his father to the point he humiliated him and he had an overbearing adoring mother who let his bad behavior pass. So to did Mao tse Tung ....spot the problem.

Thanks, this is very interesting.  So Stalin may be one of those imitation souls, in contrast to usual human souls.
Title: Re: When Joseph Stalin’s Daughter Became Catholic
Post by: GloriaPatri on September 10, 2019, 11:21:32 AM
Maybe another interesting point is Stalin's upbringing.  The purpose of child abuse is usually the invitation of the devil into the child.  Hence, if Stalin prayed against the beatings that he received, his father would have beaten him more, until he gets convinced that prayer is useless.  This is most likely how Stalin got convinced that there is no God.

I read before that Stalin was actually disobedient to his father to the point he humiliated him and he had an overbearing adoring mother who let his bad behavior pass. So to did Mao tse Tung ....spot the problem.

Thanks, this is very interesting.  So Stalin may be one of those imitation souls, in contrast to usual human souls.

There is no such thing as an "imitation soul" vs a "usual human soul." Stalin was a fallen human being like the rest of us.
Title: Re: When Joseph Stalin’s Daughter Became Catholic
Post by: gsas on September 10, 2019, 03:09:22 PM
Maybe another interesting point is Stalin's upbringing.  The purpose of child abuse is usually the invitation of the devil into the child.  Hence, if Stalin prayed against the beatings that he received, his father would have beaten him more, until he gets convinced that prayer is useless.  This is most likely how Stalin got convinced that there is no God.

I read before that Stalin was actually disobedient to his father to the point he humiliated him and he had an overbearing adoring mother who let his bad behavior pass. So to did Mao tse Tung ....spot the problem.

Thanks, this is very interesting.  So Stalin may be one of those imitation souls, in contrast to usual human souls.

There is no such thing as an "imitation soul" vs a "usual human soul." Stalin was a fallen human being like the rest of us.

I would like to disagree based on Vatican texts also quoted by a few other posters at this forum. 

These texts declare regarding such individuals who are completely "theologically ignorant" to the Word, that is no amount of explaining of the simplest first thing about the Word makes ever any sense to them. 

In contrast to the statements in the Gospels, especially in the Gospel of St John, where it is written that everybody and everything on Earth has been given and has received the Word, the existence of such people is puzzling. 

Even animals, and even plants, and even dirt, seem to behave in some kind of correlation with the Word that they received as per St John. 

The only logical conclusion is to question the origin of such people. 

Many of them are harmless.  But many of them are predators, finding the same pleasure in torture, intimidation, and other evil acts, as the pleasure we find in working with the Lord Jesus Christ. Many of the abusers and predators are from their ranks.

They appear human, but they are not human, only their physical biological appearance is human.

Title: Re: When Joseph Stalin’s Daughter Became Catholic
Post by: Pon de Replay on September 10, 2019, 03:25:04 PM
They appear human, but they are not human, only their physical biological appearance is human.

Perhaps they're Reptilians (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Icke#Reptoid_hypothesis).
Title: Re: When Joseph Stalin’s Daughter Became Catholic
Post by: MundaCorMeum on September 10, 2019, 06:55:19 PM
They appear human, but they are not human, only their physical biological appearance is human.

Perhaps they're Reptilians (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Icke#Reptoid_hypothesis).

Now Pon, let's not encourage him, please.
Title: Re: When Joseph Stalin’s Daughter Became Catholic
Post by: Vetus Ordo on September 10, 2019, 08:31:35 PM
They appear human, but they are not human, only their physical biological appearance is human.

Perhaps they're Reptilians (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Icke#Reptoid_hypothesis).

Now Pon, let's not encourage him, please.

I'm actually curious as to which "Vatican texts" gsas is referring to. Are there documents in Rome that teach of these non-human humans?
Title: Re: When Joseph Stalin’s Daughter Became Catholic
Post by: gsas on September 11, 2019, 12:10:35 AM
They appear human, but they are not human, only their physical biological appearance is human.

Perhaps they're Reptilians (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Icke#Reptoid_hypothesis).

Now Pon, let's not encourage him, please.

I'm actually curious as to which "Vatican texts" gsas is referring to. Are there documents in Rome that teach of these non-human humans?

The Vatican texts are only declaring "theological ignorance".  The question of origin of their soul comes in as a result of comparing that to the Gospel of St John.
Title: Re: When Joseph Stalin’s Daughter Became Catholic
Post by: Non Nobis on September 11, 2019, 02:31:30 AM
Maybe another interesting point is Stalin's upbringing.  The purpose of child abuse is usually the invitation of the devil into the child.  Hence, if Stalin prayed against the beatings that he received, his father would have beaten him more, until he gets convinced that prayer is useless.  This is most likely how Stalin got convinced that there is no God.

I read before that Stalin was actually disobedient to his father to the point he humiliated him and he had an overbearing adoring mother who let his bad behavior pass. So to did Mao tse Tung ....spot the problem.

Thanks, this is very interesting.  So Stalin may be one of those imitation souls, in contrast to usual human souls.

There is no such thing as an "imitation soul" vs a "usual human soul." Stalin was a fallen human being like the rest of us.

I would like to disagree based on Vatican texts also quoted by a few other posters at this forum. 

These texts declare regarding such individuals who are completely "theologically ignorant" to the Word, that is no amount of explaining of the simplest first thing about the Word makes ever any sense to them. 

In contrast to the statements in the Gospels, especially in the Gospel of St John, where it is written that everybody and everything on Earth has been given and has received the Word, the existence of such people is puzzling. 

Even animals, and even plants, and even dirt, seem to behave in some kind of correlation with the Word that they received as per St John. 

The only logical conclusion is to question the origin of such people. 

Many of them are harmless.  But many of them are predators, finding the same pleasure in torture, intimidation, and other evil acts, as the pleasure we find in working with the Lord Jesus Christ. Many of the abusers and predators are from their ranks.

They appear human, but they are not human, only their physical biological appearance is human.

Could you provide the actual Vatican texts and verses from St. John's Gospel (complete quotes) that you think are saying (or imply) such things? Your private interpretation is pretty bizarre.
Title: Re: When Joseph Stalin’s Daughter Became Catholic
Post by: gsas on September 11, 2019, 09:23:23 AM
Maybe another interesting point is Stalin's upbringing.  The purpose of child abuse is usually the invitation of the devil into the child.  Hence, if Stalin prayed against the beatings that he received, his father would have beaten him more, until he gets convinced that prayer is useless.  This is most likely how Stalin got convinced that there is no God.

I read before that Stalin was actually disobedient to his father to the point he humiliated him and he had an overbearing adoring mother who let his bad behavior pass. So to did Mao tse Tung ....spot the problem.

Thanks, this is very interesting.  So Stalin may be one of those imitation souls, in contrast to usual human souls.

There is no such thing as an "imitation soul" vs a "usual human soul." Stalin was a fallen human being like the rest of us.

I would like to disagree based on Vatican texts also quoted by a few other posters at this forum. 

These texts declare regarding such individuals who are completely "theologically ignorant" to the Word, that is no amount of explaining of the simplest first thing about the Word makes ever any sense to them. 

In contrast to the statements in the Gospels, especially in the Gospel of St John, where it is written that everybody and everything on Earth has been given and has received the Word, the existence of such people is puzzling. 

Even animals, and even plants, and even dirt, seem to behave in some kind of correlation with the Word that they received as per St John. 

The only logical conclusion is to question the origin of such people. 

Many of them are harmless.  But many of them are predators, finding the same pleasure in torture, intimidation, and other evil acts, as the pleasure we find in working with the Lord Jesus Christ. Many of the abusers and predators are from their ranks.

They appear human, but they are not human, only their physical biological appearance is human.

Could you provide the actual Vatican texts and verses from St. John's Gospel (complete quotes) that you think are saying (or imply) such things? Your private interpretation is pretty bizarre.

Sorry it is not St John, it is Romans 1:20:

New International Version
For since the creation of the world God's invisible qualities--his eternal power and divine nature--have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that people are without excuse.

For the theological ignorance thesis of the Vatican, someone on this forum quoted it, I have now trouble finding the post, but I am trying.

Is there an on-line Cathecism that is searchable?  Would be a much better reference.
Title: Re: When Joseph Stalin’s Daughter Became Catholic
Post by: gsas on September 11, 2019, 12:44:33 PM
They appear human, but they are not human, only their physical biological appearance is human.

Perhaps they're Reptilians (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Icke#Reptoid_hypothesis).

Now Pon, let's not encourage him, please.

I'm actually curious as to which "Vatican texts" gsas is referring to. Are there documents in Rome that teach of these non-human humans?

I wish I could find the Vatican quotation, it is in somebody's post at this forum, I somehow can't find it now.  The Vatican text says that we need to pay special regards to the phenomenon of "theological ignorance". 

They are not called non-human humans, but the Church's inquisitors took them very seriously for 100's of years in the medieval ages.  Back then, investigative tools were very primitive and the inquisitors made many mistakes.  Today, investigation is easy, and the inquisition would work with much better accuracy, but today access is limited.  This is because many powers not related to the Church write all kinds of laws, and thus the imitation souls get protected the same was as regular people.  Big mistake.
Title: Re: When Joseph Stalin’s Daughter Became Catholic
Post by: GloriaPatri on September 11, 2019, 01:05:13 PM
There is no theological support for the idea of humans, born of human parents, that lack human souls. The very idea of yours, gsas, reeks of heresy.
Title: Re: When Joseph Stalin’s Daughter Became Catholic
Post by: gsas on September 11, 2019, 02:02:27 PM
There is no theological support for the idea of humans, born of human parents, that lack human souls. The very idea of yours, gsas, reeks of heresy.

So all the good works of 100's of years of inquisitions by the Catholic Church were for nothing?
Title: Re: When Joseph Stalin’s Daughter Became Catholic
Post by: GloriaPatri on September 11, 2019, 02:11:04 PM
There is no theological support for the idea of humans, born of human parents, that lack human souls. The very idea of yours, gsas, reeks of heresy.

So all the good works of 100's of years of inquisitions by the Catholic Church were for nothing?

Quote me one inquisitor who stated that there were humans that lacked human souls. Just one. I'll wait.
Title: Re: When Joseph Stalin’s Daughter Became Catholic
Post by: martin88nyc on September 11, 2019, 02:20:59 PM
There is no theological support for the idea of humans, born of human parents, that lack human souls. The very idea of yours, gsas, reeks of heresy.
Bayside "apparitions" promote these and similar ideas.
Title: Re: When Joseph Stalin’s Daughter Became Catholic
Post by: gsas on September 11, 2019, 02:48:09 PM
There is no theological support for the idea of humans, born of human parents, that lack human souls. The very idea of yours, gsas, reeks of heresy.

So all the good works of 100's of years of inquisitions by the Catholic Church were for nothing?

Quote me one inquisitor who stated that there were humans that lacked human souls. Just one. I'll wait.

Inquisition was not exorcism.  You can't exorcise the devil out of itself.  So all those who ended up in front of the Inquisition have already been proven by exorcists, that there is no human soul present, but only an imitation one.
Title: Re: When Joseph Stalin’s Daughter Became Catholic
Post by: GloriaPatri on September 11, 2019, 02:55:50 PM
There is no theological support for the idea of humans, born of human parents, that lack human souls. The very idea of yours, gsas, reeks of heresy.

So all the good works of 100's of years of inquisitions by the Catholic Church were for nothing?

Quote me one inquisitor who stated that there were humans that lacked human souls. Just one. I'll wait.

Inquisition was not exorcism.  You can't exorcise the devil out of itself.  So all those who ended up in front of the Inquisition have already been proven by exorcists, that there is no human soul present, but only an imitation one.

Inquisitors sought to establish whether one accused of heresy was, in fact, a heretic. It has nothing to do with your made up concept of "imitation souls."

Furthermore, those who ended up before the inquisitors did not have to go before exorcists before hand. That's something you made up.
Title: Re: When Joseph Stalin’s Daughter Became Catholic
Post by: TheReturnofLive on September 11, 2019, 03:40:06 PM
They appear human, but they are not human, only their physical biological appearance is human.

Perhaps they're Reptilians (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Icke#Reptoid_hypothesis).

People are idiots. The truth of the matter is that the Reptiles who control the world’s governments are able to change colors, so they switch to different colors of reflected light which humans aren’t able to see, thus they are completely invisible to us.

They also have similarly colored mind control headsets that people of weak will are able to bend to, which is why there are normies everywhere who watch Jimmy Kimmel and agree with him like he’s some kind of comedic genius.
Title: Re: When Joseph Stalin’s Daughter Became Catholic
Post by: Vetus Ordo on September 11, 2019, 05:31:57 PM
So all those who ended up in front of the Inquisition have already been proven by exorcists, that there is no human soul present, but only an imitation one.

A fascinating take on history and theology, I grant you that.