Goodbye

[Vox Clara]

After some prayer and reflection I've decided that I cannot in good conscience continue to post here. This thread was the final straw. Give not that which is holy to dogs; neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest perhaps they trample them under their feet, and turning upon you, they tear you.

Over the past year I've come to think of many of you as friends. I will miss you.

Goodbye and God bless.

[The Curt Jester]

Hm.

One person (quite typical on forums, really) calls into question an apparition and that turns the rest into swine, eh?

Quaint.

[drummerboy]

Well I appreciated your posts about liturgical feasts and customs.  God bless

[Instaurare omnia]

 

[Michael Wilson]

I think you should continue; just put that poster on "ignore"; the rest of us disagree with his opinion on Our Lady of Guadalupe. I am also very edified by your postings on the different feastdays of the saints.

[diaduit]

I'll miss your posts Vox, I hope you reconsider.

[Julio]

I think you should continue; just put that poster on "ignore"; the rest of us disagree with his opinion on Our Lady of Guadalupe. I am also very edified by your postings on the different feastdays of the saints.

I echo this. Seeking for your change of heart. Whatever shall be your final decision, God bless.

[Bonaventure]

I'm sad to see you go. I wouldn't let these things get to you. Once, an outspoken "feminist" (married with children) told me that perhaps it was a good thing that my wife miscarried. On this very forum.

We cannot let these types of things get to us.

[Miriam_M]

I didn't really understand the back-and-forth on the thread that was linked by the OP, so I'm not in a position to argue particular points.  I will just say that even private revelation that enjoys a level of approval by the Church is nevertheless personal and individualistic.  There have been a couple of members who have objected to even the rosary, although the Church uses it as public prayer, Herself.

Sometimes it's merely how someone reacts to what for them is associated with a devotion, rather than the devotion itself.  IOW, there are indeed Catholics who seem to get carried away with one or all devotions and begin to substitute private devotions for general feast days and more universally celebrated events.

An example from my own recent past was a routine Fatima celebration with procession that was celebrated on the 13th of every month.  I love Fatima and certainly the rosary and Marian feasts in general.  However, there was a woman in the procession with an absolute fetish about devotions, if I'm allowed to put it that way.  People who treat feast days superstitiously really turn me off; they have missed the whole point of why the CHURCH recommends these devotions.  Had I not already a love for Fatima and Marian feasts, I'm pretty sure that someone who treated the devotion like some magic charm would have ensured that I lose interest entirely.

The bottom line is that negative reactions are not really reflective of the value of a feast or devotion.  It's really our job as individual Catholics to carve out a spirituality that works for us -- sometimes with the help of a director -- and to have the integrity to respond to the urgings of the Holy Spirit, regardless of how many or how few people share those same urgings, or whether some people seem unable to distinguish a devotion from a cult.

[Michael Wilson]

The poster denied that the apparition of Our Lady and the Picture where legitimate.

[Miriam_M]

Oh, I see.
Well, many Catholics deny Faustina and Divine Mercy, even though I believe the Church is okay with it. I'm also okay with it, even though I would never choose to substitute it for the rosary, and certainly not regularly. I was once given the Chaplet as a penance after Confession. I had to look up how to say it since it's not my go-to devotion.

The point is, it's not worth getting exercised about when another Catholic doesn't share our devotional preferences. Even when approved, they're preferences and opinions, not mandates either positive or negative on the Church's part. When it comes to devotions, we should just go where the Third Person leads us and be at peace with our convictions.

[Polymath]

Given some of the recent threads I've seen, I'm near there myself.  If I wanted to deal with liberal trolls, I'd be in a mainstream "Catholic" group.

[diaduit]

I hope you don't leave Poly, you're one of the few new accounts that doesn't seem to want to cause trouble.

[Polymath]

I hope you don't leave Poly, you're one of the few new accounts that doesn't seem to want to cause trouble.

Thanks.  Sometimes I just get a bit frustrated with those who do want to cause trouble...

[Goldfinch]

One person (quite typical on forums, really) calls into question an apparition and that turns the rest into swine, eh?

That is a complete misreading of my wife's point. She's concerned and upset about the treatment of holy things on the forum. It has become a banality to see them questioned and trampled underfoot by trolls or confused converts who quickly burn out. They keep popping up left and right around here, often unchallenged. We've had many attacks over the past months, including a vile attack on the holy rosary that lasted for three full days until the scandal was so overwhelming that something was finally done about it. I second Polymath's feelings. If we wanted to deal with liberal trolls, we'd be on a mainstream Novus Ordo forum where everything that is sacred in our faith, from dogmas to simple devotions, is questioned under the pretense of intellectual inquiry. Faith is not a mere intellectual exercise, it's a living experience that forms our character, our sensibilities and our attitudes. Our Catholic ethos is in danger when we tolerate and grow accustomed to an attitude of irreverence towards holy things, no matter how small they might be.

The point is, it's not worth getting exercised about when another Catholic doesn't share our devotional preferences. Even when approved, they're preferences and opinions, not mandates either positive or negative on the Church's part. When it comes to devotions, we should just go where the Third Person leads us and be at peace with our convictions.

Walking Wounded stated that the Guadalupian devotion, that stretches back 500 years and has had the full approval of the Church, has brought forth sour, heretical fruit. This is not someone who might have genuine doubts over some aspect of a devotion, or someone who is simply not attached to it. No, it's a Satanic attack against the Church and Catholic piety. Walking Wounded felt so emboldened as to state that Catholic Hispanic culture is altogether pagan. Eventually, when this sort of thing becomes so widespread and common as it has here, it will drive people away. We are already swimming against the tide in the real world, and some of us in our own parishes, we don't need that garbage here.

Whenever I read people like Walking Wounded pridefully boast that "some of us know the difference between the levels of the hierarchy of Truth," I already know what's coming. And so did Vox Clara. It's not pretty, it's dark and troublesome. But while Walking Wounded might not last long here (or in the Church for that matter), there are still good Catholics at SD who are passively witnessing the hijacking of this space, which should be a safe haven for traditional piety, devotion and faith, by enemies of Our Lord. It's sad.