Pope Francis calls for Unity with the Orthodox Churches.

[Xavier]

On the feast of St. Andrew the Apostle, who is considered the patron of the See of Constantinople, the Holy Father greeted Patriarch Bartholomew and spoke about the prospects of Catholic-Orthodox unity. Although the modern Church does not pursue the path of unity in the perfect doctrinal way that the Council of Lyons II and of Florence did, still there is some chance the Orthodox Churches, over the course of the next decades, will think better of remaining separate and return to Catholic unity. Orthodox basically have to accept and profess mainly 3 de fide dogmas to be received into the communion of the Catholic Church.

(1) the Immaculate Conception (2) the Filioque and (3) Purgatory, beside the Petrine primacy of jurisdiction exercised by the Pope.

"The Pope expressed his desire to work for full communion between the Catholic and Orthodox churches

On the feast of St. Andrew the Apostle, Pope Francis told the Ecumenical Patriarch of Constantinople that while the Holy Spirit has in recent years prompted a "fraternal dialogue" between the Catholic and Orthodox Churches, both Churches should work to achieve full communion with one another ..."

https://catholicherald.co.uk/news/2018/12/01/pope-francis-calls-for-unity-with-orthodox-churches/

Thoughts?

[Sempronius]

What are the their demands for unity?

[Michael Wilson]

First before we get the Orthodox to convert, we have to get the Pope and the people at the Vatican to convert to Catholicism.

[Xavier]

Ha! Yes, but officially newChurch still teaches (e.g. in the new Catechism), the dogmas of, for e.g., the Immaculate Conception, Filioque, Purgatory etc that the Orthodox deny.

"247 The affirmation of the filioque does not appear in the Creed confessed in 381 at Constantinople. But Pope St. Leo I, following an ancient Latin and Alexandrian tradition, had already confessed it dogmatically in 447,76 even before Rome, in 451 at the Council of Chalcedon, came to recognize and receive the Symbol of 381. The use of this formula in the Creed was gradually admitted into the Latin liturgy (between the eighth and eleventh centuries). The introduction of the filioque into the Niceno-Constantinopolitan Creed by the Latin liturgy constitutes moreover, even today, a point of disagreement with the Orthodox Churches.
248 At the outset the Eastern tradition expresses the Father's character as first origin of the Spirit. By confessing the Spirit as he "who proceeds from the Father", it affirms that he comes from the Father through the Son.77 The Western tradition expresses first the consubstantial communion between Father and Son, by saying that the Spirit proceeds from the Father and the Son (filioque). It says this, "legitimately and with good reason",78 for the eternal order of the divine persons in their consubstantial communion implies that the Father, as "the principle without principle",79 is the first origin of the Spirit, but also that as Father of the only Son, he is, with the Son, the single principle from which the Holy Spirit proceeds.80 This legitimate complementarity, provided it does not become rigid, does not affect the identity of faith in the reality of the same mystery confessed.

71. Nicene Creed; cf. DS 150.
72 Council of Toledo VI (638): DS 490.
73 Council of Toledo XI (675): DS 527.
74 Nicene Creed; cf. DS 150.
75 Council of Florence (1439): DS 1300-1301.
76 Cf. Leo I, Quam laudabiliter (447): DS 284.
77 Jn 15:26; cf. AG 2.
78 Council of Florence (1439): DS 1302.
79 Council of Florence (1442): DS 1331.
80. Council of Lyons II (1274): DS 850."

These things were more clearly taught in Florence. Some Eastern Churches accepted it eventually (e.g. at the Union of Brest) and became Catholic, while others including most of the Greek Church remained in schism as we know. Lyons II and Florence were the major re-union attempts. There is a prophesied Ecumenical Council at which "The Greeks will return to the obedience of the Roman Church." Probably after some kind of purification.

Their demands, Sempronius? I dunno that they have ever given an official list. But Patriarch Bartholomew has said, for e.g., that Orthodoxy disagrees with the Immaculate Conception.

https://www.johnsanidopoulos.com/2010/06/patriarch-bartholomew-on-immaculate.html?m=1

When Russia is consecrated to the Immaculate Heart by the Pope and the Bishops, our Orthodox brethren will recognize their mistake on this point, return home to Rome, and become Catholic.

[Guapo]

Patriarch Bartholomew is a NWO tool who is eyeing up to 20 Church properties in Ukraine and
undermining the peace agreement viz a viz Minsk agreement and above all Ukrainian Orthodox
Church will not be given the autonomy it wanted in the first place. Ukraine always ends up with
the worst end of the stick.

[Guapo]

Should be filed under Desperation.

Founder of Uki Schism is jailed so much for unity.

Vikenty Chekalin who stood at the origins of the current Church schism in Ukraine was sentenced for four years and three months in prison in Australia.

Southport District Court in Queensland sentenced 67-year-old Vincent Berg (alias Vikenty Chekalin) for repeated fraud and forgery, according to the Romfea Greek church news agency.

Chekalin, who moved from Russia in the early 1990s, presented to the Australian authorities a fake doctor's diploma, which allowed him to get a job as a psychiatrist.

In 1990, Chekalin ordained "bishops" of the self-proclaimed Ukrainian Autocephalous Orthodox Church, being deprived of dignity in the canonical Ukrainian Church for immoral acts. Before that, in 1987, he was sentenced to three years in prison for molesting minors, but in 1988 he was released early.

In 1991, the Greek Catholic Metropolitan of Lvov Vladimir Sternyuk took Chekalin to the jurisdiction of the UGCC and appointed him to the post of head of the so-called "Russian Orthodox Catholic Church". Soon after that, Chekalin emigrated to Australia where he changed his name and became a pastor of one of the Protestant churches.

[Gardener]

If, and when, this were to occur, the Orthodox owe it to their flock to explain either:
{
1) Why they and so many of the men they revere in spiritual matters were wrong

OR

2) How to understand why there was a misunderstanding and miscommunication and how to understand it
}

Explain the true understanding in language which makes sense to their faithful.

If they go making autonomous declarations without doing this, they're essentially putting their "children" through a spiritual divorce process and will lose many to the inevitable hardliner schism which would come.

This process should take a minimum of 3 years, perhaps 5. In turn, the RCC should unilaterally recognize them in the interim.

[Philip G.]

The orthodox will have to repent of their approval of contraceptive use, and accept catholic church teaching.  They will have to repent of their divorce approval, and accept catholic church teaching.  They probably have other skeletons in their matrimonial closet that will need to be cleaned out, but at the moment this is all I can think of. 

[The Curt Jester]

I was thinking that maybe Francis should begin with NOT promoting disunity among those who are already Catholic before he attempts anything like this.

[james03]

They will have to repent of their divorce approval, and accept catholic church teaching.

Dude, you are so 1950's, get with the program.  Peter has spoken, Jesus lied, divorce is perfectly fine.  That IS the catholic position.

So this makes logical sense.  Divorce was probably the main impediment, since you can't paper around it with theological language.  Now that the catholic Church has accepted the Orthodox position, unification is the next logical step.

[Sempronius]

They will have to repent of their divorce approval, and accept catholic church teaching.

Dude, you are so 1950's, get with the program.  Peter has spoken, Jesus lied, divorce is perfectly fine.  That IS the catholic position.

So this makes logical sense.  Divorce was probably the main impediment, since you can't paper around it with theological language.  Now that the catholic Church has accepted the Orthodox position, unification is the next logical step.

A Catholic priest can still confidently preach from the pulpit that divorce is wrong. Once the Church officially declares divorce is tolerated "in some extreme cases", then we'll have big problems.

[Quaremerepulisti]

A Catholic priest can still confidently preach from the pulpit that divorce is wrong. Once the Church officially declares divorce is tolerated "in some extreme cases", then we'll have big problems.

Well you have big problems, and have for some time.  Divorce and remarriage under "oekonomia" was the official position of the Byzantine Church even after reunion with Rome, and continued for centuries afterwards without opposition from Rome, until the 1917 promulgation of the Code of Canon Law.

[Philip G.]

The catholic church also has its own matrimony problems.  The idea that we presume validity of marriages outside the church seems crazy to me.  Which, is probably a result of the marriage the church has tried to perform with the state in pursuit of empire ever since Charlemagne.  The orthodox are not the only ones with matrimony problems stemming from relations with the state.

[Vetus Ordo]

"Both Churches should work to achieve full communion with one another."

This programme has been going on for almost 60 years now. No results whatsoever.

It's mere empty rhetoric at this point, especially given the collapse of the Western church in the decades following Vatican II.

[St.Justin]

The catholic church also has its own matrimony problems.  The idea that we presume validity of marriages outside the church seems crazy to me.  Which, is probably a result of the marriage the church has tried to perform with the state in pursuit of empire ever since Charlemagne.  The orthodox are not the only ones with matrimony problems stemming from relations with the state.

Matrimony is the only Sacrament in which the couple are the administrators. The Priest only acts as a witness. so it is entirely possible for there to be  valid marriages outside of the Church.