Virginia Abortion Bill

[Fleur-de-Lys]

Is there a thread here already discussing these new abortion laws, passed in New York and proposed in Virginia? It seems we've reached a new level of depravity, allowing murder up until the moment of birth and even afterward in the case of a child accidentally born alive. Christ have mercy!

Virginia Democrat Proposes Bill Allowing 'Abortion' as Woman Is 'Dilating'

https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2019/01/29/virginia-democrat-proposes-bill-allowing-abortion-as-woman-is-dilating/

Virginia Democrat Delegate Kathy Tran proposed a measure last week that would not only allow abortion throughout all nine months of pregnancy in the state, but would also permit a woman to decide whether she wants to "abort" her baby as she is dilating and about to give birth.

The bill is proposed as New York Democrat Gov. Andrew Cuomo has just signed into law the Reproductive Health Act, which eliminates recognition of "personhood" in the unborn and defines a "person" as a "human being who has been born and is alive." That law has been referred to as permitting "infanticide" by many pro-life groups.

The Daily Wire reported on Tran's legislation and provided this exchange between Tran and Virginia Republican Delegate Todd Gilbert:

Gilbert: So how late in the third trimester would you be able to do that?

Tran: It's very unfortunate that our physician witnesses were not able to attend today.

Gilbert: No, I'm talking about your bill. How late in the third trimester could a physician perform an abortion if he indicated it would impair the mental health of the woman?

Tran: Or physical health.

Gilbert: Okay. I'm talking about the mental health.

Tran: Through the third trimester. The third trimester goes all the way up to 40 weeks.

Gilbert: Okay. But to the end of the third trimester?

Tran: Yep. I don't think we have a limit in the bill.

Gilbert: Where it's obvious a woman is about to give birth, that she has physical signs that she is about to give birth. Would that be a point at which she could still request an abortion if she was so certified? She's dilating.

Tran: Mr. Chairman, that would be a decision that the doctor, the physician, and the woman would make at that point.

Gilbert: I understand that. I'm asking if your bill allows that.

Tran: My bill would allow that, yes.

A summary of HB 2491, dubbed the Repeal Act because it repeals most restrictions on abortion, states the bill:

Eliminates the requirement that an abortion in the second trimester of pregnancy and prior to the third trimester be performed in a hospital. The bill eliminates all the procedures and processes, including the performance of an ultrasound, required to effect a woman's informed written consent to the performance of an abortion; however, the bill does not change the requirement that a woman's informed written consent be first obtained. The bill eliminates the requirement that two other physicians certify that a third trimester abortion is necessary to prevent the woman's death or impairment of her mental or physical health, as well as the need to find that any such impairment to the woman's health would be substantial and irremediable. The bill also removes language classifying facilities that perform five or more first-trimester abortions per month as hospitals for the purpose of complying with regulations establishing minimum standards for hospitals.

According to the Virginia Gazette, Democrat Gov. Ralph Northam, Attorney General Mark Herring, and a number of Democrats in the General Assembly are backing the legislation – which equates ending the life of an unborn baby with providing women health care.

"I'm going all the way to the Supreme Court if I have to in order to protect Virginians' health care," Herring said.

"For women seeking reproductive care, the additional costs and obstacles imposed by existing regulation could potentially include unpaid time off from work, hospital fees and other emotional distress," Tran said. "These restrictions harm women and have disproportionate effects on low-income women and women of color in Virginia."

Regarding the New York abortion law, New York Right to Life warned the legislation "repeals protection in NY law for a born-alive infant, authorizing infanticide."

National pro-life leader Lila Rose also described New York's new abortion law as "barbaric and inhumane," and "no different than infanticide."

Similarly, Christian non-profit litigation firm Liberty Counsel declared New York's Reproductive Health Act to be "infanticide."

"A child can be tortured and killed seconds before it is born in New York simply because it is seen as an 'inconvenience' to some and a money-maker for others," said Mat Staver, founder and chairman of Liberty Counsel. "If the child happens to be born alive, it can now be left to suffer and die. New York has dehumanized the child in the womb, including those born alive after a failed abortion. This is infanticide."

[Xavier]

Yes. This is infanticide pure and simple. Lord have Mercy.

[Gardener]

All abortion is infanticide.

If the boogeyman Klan were in actual power and were out killing Blacks, Jews, and Mexicans whenever they find them inconvenient, etc., does anyone think the USCCB would simply give lip service to stopping it? No. Why? Because they recognize Blacks, Jews, and Mexicans as human beings just like all other human beings. We'd be authorized to engage with extreme violence against those who perpetuate this stuff. If some anti-Nazi German partisan took out Amon Göth with a sniper rifle on his way in to work, he'd be a hero for saving people and taking out a murderer despite not being in a "legal" or "authoritative" position to do so, a la government sanctioned.

The Bishops have no interest in stopping infanticide at any level. Neither do the Republicans.

They all condemn those who take out abortion clinics and abortionists.

Either a fetus is a human being, or not.

If it's murder and immoral to kill an abortionist or blow up a clinic, then any instance of defending the innocent and those who cannot defend themselves is murder and immoral.

I'd like some consistency.

[nmoerbeek]

All abortion is infanticide.

If the boogeyman Klan were in actual power and were out killing Blacks, Jews, and Mexicans whenever they find them inconvenient, etc., does anyone think the USCCB would simply give lip service to stopping it? No. Why? Because they recognize Blacks, Jews, and Mexicans as human beings just like all other human beings. We'd be authorized to engage with extreme violence against those who perpetuate this stuff. If some anti-Nazi German partisan took out Amon Göth with a sniper rifle on his way in to work, he'd be a hero for saving people and taking out a murderer despite not being in a "legal" or "authoritative" position to do so, a la government sanctioned.

The Bishops have no interest in stopping infanticide at any level. Neither do the Republicans.

They all condemn those who take out abortion clinics and abortionists.

Either a fetus is a human being, or not.

If it's murder and immoral to kill an abortionist or blow up a clinic, then any instance of defending the innocent and those who cannot defend themselves is murder and immoral.

I'd like some consistency.

I understand your furor but, I don't agree with your conclusion.  If popular support existed for an open genocide against a group of people I don't see our Bishops supporting any form of resistance against it, except perhaps harboring those people who were being hunted. 

Perhaps I just have a lower opinion of our Bishops, but historically seldom do bishops ever support explicit examples of armed resistance within a nation state, and often times they sell out the faithful at the drop of a hat once the violence has started to get peace with the national government.

Also, between 50-60 percent of the public support infanticide, it is the status quo now.
http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2018/10/17/nearly-six-in-ten-americans-say-abortion-should-be-legal/

[TradGranny]

Petition against Gov. of Virginia at LifeSiteNews.com

[Heinrich]

All abortion is infanticide.

If the boogeyman Klan were in actual power and were out killing Blacks, Jews, and Mexicans whenever they find them inconvenient, etc., does anyone think the USCCB would simply give lip service to stopping it? No. Why? Because they recognize Blacks, Jews, and Mexicans as human beings just like all other human beings. We'd be authorized to engage with extreme violence against those who perpetuate this stuff. If some anti-Nazi German partisan took out Amon Göth with a sniper rifle on his way in to work, he'd be a hero for saving people and taking out a murderer despite not being in a "legal" or "authoritative" position to do so, a la government sanctioned.

The Bishops have no interest in stopping infanticide at any level. Neither do the Republicans.

They all condemn those who take out abortion clinics and abortionists.

Either a fetus is a human being, or not.

If it's murder and immoral to kill an abortionist or blow up a clinic, then any instance of defending the innocent and those who cannot defend themselves is murder and immoral.

I'd like some consistency.

Add to this Himmler, Goebbels and many other baptized Catholics who promoted the Nietzschean and Darwinian view of "mercy", i.e. the weak deserve to die and no one should have any remorse for it whatsoever. Ah, we can add to this list Cuomo, Pelosi, etc.

[TheReturnofLive]

Many people are critical of the images that are used by the Pro-Life movement, because what's often used are later-term abortions.

Now, I dare those people to say that this icon doesn't represent the Truth.

[TheReturnofLive]

Also, what do you know, Virginia Gov. Northam actually has a black-face photo in his yearbook, posed next to a man in a KKK costume.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/virginia-politics/northam-mum-about-his-plans-after-a-flood-of-calls-for-his-resignation-for-racist-and-offensive-photo/2019/02/02/5883402a-26e9-11e9-90cd-dedb0c92dc17_story.html?noredirect=on

What a swell guy.

[Antoninus]

Northam can advocate the slaughter of children in the womb up to nine months and even those born alive and he is celebrated by many in our sick and evil society, but he gets caught wearing blackface in a photo from 33 years ago and now he is the devil for those same people who think abortion and infanticide are great.

[carmina laetitiae]

I feel driven to despair over all of this personally. I really don't know what to do anymore. I'm 12 weeks pregnant and I find all of this devastating.

[Innocent Smith]

Also, what do you know, Virginia Gov. Northam actually has a black-face photo in his yearbook, posed next to a man in a KKK costume.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/virginia-politics/northam-mum-about-his-plans-after-a-flood-of-calls-for-his-resignation-for-racist-and-offensive-photo/2019/02/02/5883402a-26e9-11e9-90cd-dedb0c92dc17_story.html?noredirect=on

What a swell guy.

Who cares? I'm really tired of blackface being one of the worst sins against humanity. If this is an outrage to you, you have volunteered to step into their prison and allow them to turn the key. For this creep to be called onto the carpet for this crime and to not face similar heat for his comments and guidance on baby killing is grotesque.

[TheReturnofLive]

Also, what do you know, Virginia Gov. Northam actually has a black-face photo in his yearbook, posed next to a man in a KKK costume.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/virginia-politics/northam-mum-about-his-plans-after-a-flood-of-calls-for-his-resignation-for-racist-and-offensive-photo/2019/02/02/5883402a-26e9-11e9-90cd-dedb0c92dc17_story.html?noredirect=on

What a swell guy.

Who cares? I'm really tired of blackface being one of the worst sins against humanity. If this is an outrage to you, you have volunteered to step into their prison and allow them to turn the key. For this creep to be called onto the carpet for this crime and to not face similar heat for his comments and guidance on baby killing is grotesque.

I care, for three reasons.

1. Your logic is similar to arguing that a robber who killed a store clerk should not be tried for robbery or called a robber, because his crime of killing was much worse.

2. As unjust it is that our society endorses literal baby murderers (like, even pro-choicers can't argue this point with "human life doesn't begin at conception"), one less baby murderer in power = one plus for society.

3. I NEVER want to give credence to the worldview that the Left constantly vomits out, that the United States is composed only of white Neo-Nazi Trump supporters against tolerant, educated, and identity-wise diverse, warriors against Nazism.

It's clear that this narrative is a load of Dante's Bolgia #2, but considering how cognitively simple our journalists are and a massive portion of the American public is, we need to claw onto every piece of evidence that rips this worldview apart.

[Josephine87]

Is blackface a sin?

[TheReturnofLive]

Is blackface a sin?

I think any intentional attempt to disfigure the God-given dignity of any human being is sinful.

What do you think that Saint Moses the Black would think about blackface?

[Xavier]

We discussed earlier whether it was right to pray and wish death upon someone (and I admit I was thinking of Kennedy, that he may die or resign, after repentance of course) and we saw that it was, on this thread https://www.suscipedomine.com/forum/index.php?topic=19826.0 "We may wish our neighbor evil, even death itself, if we do so for his own good or some other equally great advantage, e.g., that a frivolous youth be not led astray and eternally lost, or that a father may not squander the family fortune." KK cited this from Jone-Adelman in Moral Theology. Let's begin to pray right away for the explicit and specific intentions that (1) Ginsburg and Breyer quickly die or resign, after repentance and (2) Republicans nominate and confirm good Justices, like Pryor and Barrett, who will end abortion and meanwhile (3) Gorsuch, Kavanaugh and the others make the right decisions for life.

I read that some other governor (I forgot who) said, "I'll vote for Trump 50 times if it'll keep these infanticidal lunatics out of the White House". We must press on. Just imagine the horror if Hillary Clinton had been elected and had had 2 supreme court appointments (or perhaps 4, as Breyer and Ginsburg may willingly have stepped down for her, feeling their retirement near) and it would have been goodbye, America by now. Instead, there's still a fighting chance, although I really wish the Republicans would do it faster.

Trump condemned the new york infanticidal bill in his SOTU the other day. He again asked for the Pain Capable Act. I believe Sens. Cruz and Sasse are sponsoring something like it.

Meanwhile, https://www.lifesitenews.com/news/21-states-ask-supreme-court-to-review-uphold-dismemberment-abortion-ban All eyes are on Gorsuch and Kavanaugh now. There will be some important Supreme Court decisions in the upcoming days. Let's pray for these Justices to be strong and bold and make the right decision for life.

I believe abortionist and infanticidal criminal terrorists deserve the death penalty from God in strict justice. God keeps them alive in His Mercy giving them time for repentance, but they kill His image and kill Him by implication in these poor innocent and defenseless unborn children. Leaving aside ethics for a moment and speaking from a purely utilitarian standpoint, if someone wanted to take out just 4 murderers and make a difference, it would be those liberal baby-killers on the supreme court who should be targeted. But that's not the way forward for us imo. We should look to win this fight non-violently in a way that will change hearts and minds forever about the monstrosity of what they have done. If only the 53 Republicans (or at least 50 of them,+Mike Pence, would make it a condition of their vote that any supreme court nominee must, at least, support the dismemberment abortion ban or the Heartbeat Act, we could easily settle the issue in a few years more legally speaking) on the Senate would band together and resolve to do it, it could be done.

It's prayer, grace, conversion, contrition, the Gospel, and Christ that will change hearts and minds. It's not too late, but very urgent.