There are a number of psalms where David laments that God forsakes him, plus also Jesus cries out once asking why the Father forsakes Him.
This suggests that there may be many things in hell, that don't belong there and are not meant to be there.
I am guessing, that forsaking something is like the urge that people have to through small objects into such holes that they don't know the bottom of. Or when toddlers throw their toys out of a moving car.
In fact, discounting the human effort of volunteering some prayers, maybe abortion is in this category too.
So, here is the question, what do you do or say when God has forsaken you?
God does not forsake anyone; even the greatest of sinners.
Christ was not forsaken by God as that would be impossible; Some commentators on Christ being forsaken, to His prayer for the salvation of even the reprobate.
There is nobody in Hell that should not be there.
God the Father did not utterly forsake His Son (leaving Him to nothing or to Hell) but St. Thomas understands the words to say He forsake Him (or abandoned Him)
TO His Passion, His Suffering, His Death.
Quote from: http://www.newadvent.org/summa/4047.htm...in three respects God the Father did deliver up Christ to the Passion. In the first way, because by His eternal will He preordained Christ's Passion for the deliverance of the human race, according to the words of Isaias (53:6): "The Lord hath laid on Him the iniquities of us all"; and again (Isaiah 53:10): "The Lord was pleased to bruise Him in infirmity." Secondly, inasmuch as, by the infusion of charity, He inspired Him with the will to suffer for us; hence we read in the same passage: "He was offered because it was His own will" (Isaiah 53:7). Thirdly, by not shielding Him from the Passion, but abandoning Him to His persecutors: thus we read (Matthew 27:46) that Christ, while hanging upon the cross, cried out: "My God, My God, why hast Thou forsaken Me?" because, to wit, He left Him to the power of His persecutors, as Augustine says (Ep. cxl).
(God the Father was still with Him, but allowed Him to suffer; it is a difference sense of "forsaken")
God does not forsake anyone in the sense you mean gsas! Anyone in hell is there because they deserved it all by themselves. (They forsook God's mercy).
Do you understand this now, do you believe it?
You worry me, you say such strange things, we contradict them, and you seem to go on believing as before. I hate having you as a Catholic believe such false and horrific things.
Quote from: Non Nobis on January 18, 2020, 08:02:01 PM
God does not forsake anyone in the sense you mean gsas! Anyone in hell is there because they deserved it all by themselves. (They forsook God's mercy).
Do you understand this now, do you believe it?
You worry me, you say such strange things, we contradict them, and you seem to go on believing as before. I hate having you as a Catholic believe such false and horrific things.
I am in the Mark 9:23-25 situation. If you have Catholic schools in your country, then you don't have my problem. I would like to say that I really appreciate when you and you all debunk my heresies and misinterpretations.
I understand that belief is to build not only by logic but also by the heart as per commandment 1 and 1 chorintians 13. It took me a long time to get even this far after the Qur'an and evil occult family members, and many people like I are baptized against the explicit prohibition from family and other authorities. I hope I am not getting on any member's nerves with my endless search and speculations for the apostolic truth.
And as for the statement that there is nobody in hell who doesn't belong there, I must confess that I am not convinced. For example, there is the famous wife of the dictator Stalin, who Stalin subjected to endless daily witchcraft to the point that he destroyed her motherly instinct and she was not able to hug her daughter, before this witchcraft has also made her commit suicide. So how do we derive from doctrine that she is in hell not because she was forced into there, but because she belongs there? I confess I really don't understand the doctrine, at minimum from the applications point of view.
Quote from: gsas on January 18, 2020, 09:31:19 PM
So how do we derive from doctrine that she is in hell not because she was forced into there, but because she belongs there?
Well I can't answer your question, but I will point out that maybe she isn't in hell. The Church hasn't declared her to be in hell, and even if she lived a wicked life and died of suicide, we're not in the position to judge her.
Quote from: gsas on January 18, 2020, 09:31:19 PM
Quote from: Non Nobis on January 18, 2020, 08:02:01 PM
God does not forsake anyone in the sense you mean gsas! Anyone in hell is there because they deserved it all by themselves. (They forsook God's mercy).
Do you understand this now, do you believe it?
You worry me, you say such strange things, we contradict them, and you seem to go on believing as before. I hate having you as a Catholic believe such false and horrific things.
I am in the Mark 9:23-25 situation. If you have Catholic schools in your country, then you don't have my problem. I would like to say that I really appreciate when you and you all debunk my heresies and misinterpretations.
I understand that belief is to build not only by logic but also by the heart as per commandment 1 and 1 chorintians 13. It took me a long time to get even this far after the Qur'an and evil occult family members, and many people like I are baptized against the explicit prohibition from family and other authorities. I hope I am not getting on any member's nerves with my endless search and speculations for the apostolic truth.
You are evidently influenced (now and/or in the past) by forces that are anti-Catholic (Satanic, evil, occult). Don't you think this might be scary to the forum - Satan is powerful, could he influence us through you? God is more powerful but prayer is needed.
Could you promise to pray? That is most important of all. I and others will continue to address your reasoning but you'll need help from God too. :pray1:
Quote from: gsas on January 18, 2020, 09:31:19 PM
And as for the statement that there is nobody in hell who doesn't belong there, I must confess that I am not convinced. For example, there is the famous wife of the dictator Stalin, who Stalin subjected to endless daily witchcraft to the point that he destroyed her motherly instinct and she was not able to hug her daughter, before this witchcraft has also made her commit suicide. So how do we derive from doctrine that she is in hell not because she was forced into there, but because she belongs there? I confess I really don't understand the doctrine, at minimum from the applications point of view.
First, is there a "it's-the-bible-truth" account of Stalin and Stalin's wife such as this; or is this just an account you have heard (no matter how firmly you believe it). It would be just the story a Satanist WOULD tell to put it firmly in YOUR mind that Satan had such power. In other words: A LIE.
In any case, whatever external actions someone is driven to that he/she can't HELP, the EXTERNAL actions are not SINS, so Satan is the loser. If someone without blame neglected to hug her child, that would not deserve hell unless she freely willed to HATE her child: WITCHCRAFT cannot produce hate, because that is moving the WILL, which Satan cannot do. If someone was physically forced over the top of a cliff, that would not deserve hell, because it is not freely willed.
It is a simple matter of Catholic Faith that Satan cannot move the will, gsas. Put up the big-red-
THIS-IS-SATANIC-sign whenever THIS claim (or "Satan can force you to hell") comes up. You are just fooled to think otherwise.
It IS true that people putter in Witchcraft and go to hell but it is because they putter WILLINGLY.
If Stalin's wife did this (were the story true) INDEED SHE COULD BE IN HELL - but it would be BECAUSE SHE BELONGS THERE, and chose it (whether she CHOSE to hate her child or CHOSE to kill herself, it would be HER CHOICE and HER FAULT)
:pray1:
Right now you appear to believe Satan's lie, gsas. REALIZE that this is what you are doing.
Gsas, Satan is completely and totally a defeated foe, crushed by Our Lord through His Cross and under His Blessed Virgin Mother's Heel. He is like a chained dog and can do absolutely nothing to us unless we are careless and deliberately go near him through foolishness or through mortal sin. Never think of Satan too much. Just focus on Our Lord and Our Lady, pray to them and ask Them to protect you. Call on St. Joseph, St. Michael, all the Saints and all the Angels and all the Holy Souls in Purgatory as well, to dispel any demons afflicting you.
Just trust in Our Lady's Promises and St. Montfort's words on the Rosary, and take care to say it every day without fail: (III) The Rosary shall be a powerful armor against hell, it will destroy vice, decrease sin, and defeat heresies." http://www.themostholyrosary.com/15promises.htm "Never will anyone who says his Rosary every day be led astray. This is a statement that I would gladly sign with my blood.~Saint Louis de Montfort" http://www.thepoweroftherosary.com/rosary-quotes.html And all will be well. Strive to say the 15 decades every day. See also: ""Then listen well, you Christians: the Mother of Jesus Christ is all-powerful and she can save her servants from falling into Hell. She is the Sun which destroys the darkness of our wiles and subtlety. It is she who uncovers our hidden plots, breaks our snares and makes our temptations useless and ineffectual.
"We have to say, however reluctantly, that not a single soul who has really persevered in her service has ever been damned with us; one single sigh that she offers to the Blessed Trinity is worth far more than all the prayers, desires and aspirations of all the Saints.
"We fear her more than all the other Saints in Heaven together and we have no success with her faithful servants. Many Christians who call upon her when they are at the hour of death and who really ought to be damned according to our ordinary standards are saved by her intercession.
"Oh if only that Mary (it is thus in their fury that they called her) had not pitted her strength against ours and had not upset our plans, we should have conquered the Church and should have destroyed it long before this; and we would have seen to it that all the Orders in the Church fell into error and disorder.
"Now that we are forced to speak we must also tell you this: nobody who perseveres in saying the Rosary will be damned, because she obtains for her servants the grace of true contrition for their sins and by means of this they obtain God's forgiveness and mercy."
Taken, from Secret of the Rosary, 33rd Rose. Online at Catholic Tradition here: http://www.catholictradition.org/Classics/secret-rosary33.htm
Quote from: Non Nobis on January 19, 2020, 11:16:19 PM
Quote from: gsas on January 18, 2020, 09:31:19 PM
Quote from: Non Nobis on January 18, 2020, 08:02:01 PM
God does not forsake anyone in the sense you mean gsas! Anyone in hell is there because they deserved it all by themselves. (They forsook God's mercy).
Do you understand this now, do you believe it?
You worry me, you say such strange things, we contradict them, and you seem to go on believing as before. I hate having you as a Catholic believe such false and horrific things.
I am in the Mark 9:23-25 situation. If you have Catholic schools in your country, then you don't have my problem. I would like to say that I really appreciate when you and you all debunk my heresies and misinterpretations.
I understand that belief is to build not only by logic but also by the heart as per commandment 1 and 1 chorintians 13. It took me a long time to get even this far after the Qur'an and evil occult family members, and many people like I are baptized against the explicit prohibition from family and other authorities. I hope I am not getting on any member's nerves with my endless search and speculations for the apostolic truth.
You are evidently influenced (now and/or in the past) by forces that are anti-Catholic (Satanic, evil, occult). Don't you think this might be scary to the forum - Satan is powerful, could he influence us through you? God is more powerful but prayer is needed.
Could you promise to pray? That is most important of all. I and others will continue to address your reasoning but you'll need help from God too. :pray1:
I am a member of the Flame of Love of the Immaculate Heart of Mary movement. I have read Elisabeth's diary and the 31-day Consecration book, and pray the basic prayer set of the Flame including the Rosary every day, well almost every day, I miss days sometimes, when the devil upsets me so horribly that I have sky high anxiety and can't concentrate on even one word. Most days I pray them though. Because of the work I do, I rarely get time for the 15 decade Rosary, I do only the 5 decade one. But multiple times in the year, I repeat the Flame's consecration to the BVM, i.e. that I consecrate everything and everybody that I have ever had, have, and will have, past, present, and future, and without exception to the BVM, and after member Xavier here, to St Joseph too from the 1st of this month.
I do this with children too, and they consecrate all their toys and clothes and furnitures to the BVM too.
But I must say, that I don't understand a few things even with the Consecration, because why are you supposed to repeat it periodically, when you have consecrated all with your whole heart, past present, future, and without exception? Can some act of stupidity remove your things and people from the BVM even though all is now Her exclusive property and not yours any more to mess up? Would be good to know the answer to this one. Anyways, I re-consecrate all periodically.
I don't mean to scare anyone on this forum. This forum has the most learned and intelligent Catholics, therefore anyone who is a victim of past or ongoing witchcraft, and there are plenty of such victims in ex-soviet and middle-eastern countries, can look up to this forum for understanding, learning, and re-assurance. Especially considering, that pope Francis himself has acknowledged this problem of the devil showing more and more of its true colors. This has started by the way a decade or so after the Montfort book was re-discovered and the Age of Mary started, around the mid-1800's. I must sadly state, that the knowledge that dogmatic Church doctrine catalogs about the evil enemy is still mostly stuck with pre-Marian entries. People at eastern geographies of the Church are learning this the hard way, and luckily pope Francis is showing signs of considering this.
I use the information you provide on this forum to build my confidence, and to build the confidence of other victims who are Catholics now, most of them still under active persecution by their own family members because they chose to become Catholics. I guess the western world has no visibility about this, but it is the English language that provides the most easily usable materials to work at this.
Quote from: Non Nobis on January 20, 2020, 12:18:19 AM
Quote from: gsas on January 18, 2020, 09:31:19 PM
And as for the statement that there is nobody in hell who doesn't belong there, I must confess that I am not convinced. For example, there is the famous wife of the dictator Stalin, who Stalin subjected to endless daily witchcraft to the point that he destroyed her motherly instinct and she was not able to hug her daughter, before this witchcraft has also made her commit suicide. So how do we derive from doctrine that she is in hell not because she was forced into there, but because she belongs there? I confess I really don't understand the doctrine, at minimum from the applications point of view.
First, is there a "it's-the-bible-truth" account of Stalin and Stalin's wife such as this; or is this just an account you have heard (no matter how firmly you believe it). It would be just the story a Satanist WOULD tell to put it firmly in YOUR mind that Satan had such power. In other words: A LIE.
In any case, whatever external actions someone is driven to that he/she can't HELP, the EXTERNAL actions are not SINS, so Satan is the loser. If someone without blame neglected to hug her child, that would not deserve hell unless she freely willed to HATE her child: WITCHCRAFT cannot produce hate, because that is moving the WILL, which Satan cannot do. If someone was physically forced over the top of a cliff, that would not deserve hell, because it is not freely willed.
It is a simple matter of Catholic Faith that Satan cannot move the will, gsas. Put up the big-red-THIS-IS-SATANIC-sign whenever THIS claim (or "Satan can force you to hell") comes up. You are just fooled to think otherwise.
It IS true that people putter in Witchcraft and go to hell but it is because they putter WILLINGLY.
If Stalin's wife did this (were the story true) INDEED SHE COULD BE IN HELL - but it would be BECAUSE SHE BELONGS THERE, and chose it (whether she CHOSE to hate her child or CHOSE to kill herself, it would be HER CHOICE and HER FAULT)
:pray1:
Right now you appear to believe Satan's lie, gsas. REALIZE that this is what you are doing.
Then let me ask this question. Do I understand that by the doctrine that you are explaining above, an act of rejecting your child and giving her to satan, maybe even repeatedly, is not a sin, if it is done under some sort of satanic influence, such as for example an influence like what psychiatrists of hypnotherapy use, to program actions into their patients / victims without their knowledge, then provide triggers to make them execute those? And how are such medical cases induced by psychiatrists related to the doctrine of the will?
Quote from: Xavier on January 20, 2020, 07:38:39 AM
Gsas, Satan is completely and totally a defeated foe, crushed by Our Lord through His Cross and under His Blessed Virgin Mother's Heel. He is like a chained dog and can do absolutely nothing to us unless we are careless and deliberately go near him through foolishness or through mortal sin. Never think of Satan too much. Just focus on Our Lord and Our Lady, pray to them and ask Them to protect you. Call on St. Joseph, St. Michael, all the Saints and all the Angels and all the Holy Souls in Purgatory as well, to dispel any demons afflicting you.
Just trust in Our Lady's Promises and St. Montfort's words on the Rosary, and take care to say it every day without fail: (III) The Rosary shall be a powerful armor against hell, it will destroy vice, decrease sin, and defeat heresies." http://www.themostholyrosary.com/15promises.htm "Never will anyone who says his Rosary every day be led astray. This is a statement that I would gladly sign with my blood.~Saint Louis de Montfort" http://www.thepoweroftherosary.com/rosary-quotes.html And all will be well. Strive to say the 15 decades every day. See also: ""Then listen well, you Christians: the Mother of Jesus Christ is all-powerful and she can save her servants from falling into Hell. She is the Sun which destroys the darkness of our wiles and subtlety. It is she who uncovers our hidden plots, breaks our snares and makes our temptations useless and ineffectual.
"We have to say, however reluctantly, that not a single soul who has really persevered in her service has ever been damned with us; one single sigh that she offers to the Blessed Trinity is worth far more than all the prayers, desires and aspirations of all the Saints.
"We fear her more than all the other Saints in Heaven together and we have no success with her faithful servants. Many Christians who call upon her when they are at the hour of death and who really ought to be damned according to our ordinary standards are saved by her intercession.
"Oh if only that Mary (it is thus in their fury that they called her) had not pitted her strength against ours and had not upset our plans, we should have conquered the Church and should have destroyed it long before this; and we would have seen to it that all the Orders in the Church fell into error and disorder.
"Now that we are forced to speak we must also tell you this: nobody who perseveres in saying the Rosary will be damned, because she obtains for her servants the grace of true contrition for their sins and by means of this they obtain God's forgiveness and mercy."
Taken, from Secret of the Rosary, 33rd Rose. Online at Catholic Tradition here: http://www.catholictradition.org/Classics/secret-rosary33.htm
I often follow your prayer recommendations, I especially like the "Jesus Mary Joseph I love you save souls" short and effective weapon. I also read the 15 points of the Rosary Promises every week. I also must agree with Fr Ripperger too though, that effectiveness of prayer and level of Grace in the praying individual are in strong positive correlation, so our prayers are like chisels and it may be a monumental work for us to move even a fraction of what the infinitely Graced Jesus Christ achieved in moments when meeting His "patients". So how do we improve on this? I asked a priest too, at one of the rare days when I can meet a priest, and he didn't know the answer.
Hi GSAS. A very,very,very powerful form of prayer is where we offer the Precious Blood or the Holy Wounds etc of Our Lord Jesus to the Eternal Father. In that case, it's Our Blessed Lord's Infinite Merits themselves that are pleading for us, and in virtue of which we make our pleas.
Please read Catholic Tradition on the Holy Wounds Devotion and its Amazing Seventeen Promises: http://www.catholictradition.org/Christ/holy-wounds.htm
http://www.catholictradition.org/Children/number.htm#17 Promise #2 illustrates the Theology and lived experience behind what I'm talking about (Edit: Also Promise #4) I can vouchsafe for the fact that anyone who continues or perseveres in praying this Holy Wounds Devotion with meditation will have a very deepening knowledge and deeper love of Our Lord Jesus Christ, exactly as He Himself has promised us in Promise #6.
I pray such prayers throughout the day morning to night, even when I'm at work.
"The following prayers, composed by Our Lord, are to be said using the Rosary beads.
On the large [middle] beads: Eternal Father, I offer Thee the Wounds of our Lord Jesus Christ. To heal the wounds of our souls.
On the small [decade] beads: My Jesus, pardon and mercy. Through the merits of Thy Holy Wounds.
"PROMISES OF OUR LORD FOR THOSE WHO PRACTICE THIS DEVOTION
1. At each word that you pronounce of the Chaplet of the Holy Wounds, I allow a drop of My Blood to fall upon the soul of a sinner.
2. Each time that you offer to My Father the merits of My Divine Wounds, you win an immense fortune.
3. Souls that will have contemplated and honored My crown of thorns on earth, will be My crown of glory in Heaven!
4. I will grant all that is asked of Me through the invocation of My Holy Wounds. You will obtain everything, because it is through the merit of My Blood, which is of infinite price. With My Wounds and My Divine Heart, everything can be obtained.
5. From My Wounds proceed fruits of sanctity. As gold puri fied in the crucible becomes more beautiful, so you must put your soul and those of your companions into My sacred Wounds; there they will become perfected as gold in the furnace. You can always purify yourself in My Wounds.
6. My Wounds will repair yours. My Wounds will cover all your faults. Those who honor them will have a true knowledge of Jesus Christ. In meditation on them, you will always find a new love. My Wounds will cover all your sins.
7. Plunge your actions into My Wounds and they will be of value. All your actions, even the least, soaked in My Blood, will acquire by this alone an infinite merit and will please My Heart.
8. In offering My Wounds for the conversion of sinners, even though the sinners are not converted, you will have the same merit before God as if they were.
9. When you have some trouble, something to suffer, quickly place it in My Wounds, and the pain will be alleviated.
10. This aspiration must often be repeated near the sick: "My Jesus, pardon and mercy through the merits of Thy Holy Wounds!" This prayer will solace soul and body.
11. A sinner who will say the following prayer will obtain conversion: "Eternal Father, I offer Thee the Wounds of our Lord Jesus Christ to heal those of our souls."
12. There will be no death for the soul that expires in My Holy Wounds; they give true life.
13. This chaplet is a counterpoise to My justice; it restrains My vengeance.
14. Those who pray with humility and who meditate on My Passion, will one day participate in the glory of My Divine Wounds.
15. The more you will have contemplated My painful Wounds on this earth, the higher will be your contemplation of them glorious in Heaven.
16. The soul who during life has honored the Wounds of our Lord Jesus Christ and has offered them to the Eternal Father for the Souls in Purgatory, will be accompanied at the moment of death by the Holy Virgin and the Angels; and Our Lord on the Cross, all brilliant in glory, will receive her and crown her.
17. The invocations of the Holy Wounds will obtain an incessant victory for the Church."
Very Important for our Holy Mother Church today also based on Promise Number 17. It cannot fail.
If you want to say a similar prayer in Latin, which is even powerful, let me know and I will give you.
God Bless You.
Quote from: gsas on January 21, 2020, 12:09:51 PM
Quote from: Non Nobis on January 20, 2020, 12:18:19 AM
Quote from: gsas on January 18, 2020, 09:31:19 PM
And as for the statement that there is nobody in hell who doesn't belong there, I must confess that I am not convinced. For example, there is the famous wife of the dictator Stalin, who Stalin subjected to endless daily witchcraft to the point that he destroyed her motherly instinct and she was not able to hug her daughter, before this witchcraft has also made her commit suicide. So how do we derive from doctrine that she is in hell not because she was forced into there, but because she belongs there? I confess I really don't understand the doctrine, at minimum from the applications point of view.
First, is there a "it's-the-bible-truth" account of Stalin and Stalin's wife such as this; or is this just an account you have heard (no matter how firmly you believe it). It would be just the story a Satanist WOULD tell to put it firmly in YOUR mind that Satan had such power. In other words: A LIE.
In any case, whatever external actions someone is driven to that he/she can't HELP, the EXTERNAL actions are not SINS, so Satan is the loser. If someone without blame neglected to hug her child, that would not deserve hell unless she freely willed to HATE her child: WITCHCRAFT cannot produce hate, because that is moving the WILL, which Satan cannot do. If someone was physically forced over the top of a cliff, that would not deserve hell, because it is not freely willed.
It is a simple matter of Catholic Faith that Satan cannot move the will, gsas. Put up the big-red-THIS-IS-SATANIC-sign whenever THIS claim (or "Satan can force you to hell") comes up. You are just fooled to think otherwise.
It IS true that people putter in Witchcraft and go to hell but it is because they putter WILLINGLY.
If Stalin's wife did this (were the story true) INDEED SHE COULD BE IN HELL - but it would be BECAUSE SHE BELONGS THERE, and chose it (whether she CHOSE to hate her child or CHOSE to kill herself, it would be HER CHOICE and HER FAULT)
:pray1:
Right now you appear to believe Satan's lie, gsas. REALIZE that this is what you are doing.
Then let me ask this question. Do I understand that by the doctrine that you are explaining above, an act of rejecting your child and giving her to satan, maybe even repeatedly, is not a sin, if it is done under some sort of satanic influence, such as for example an influence like what psychiatrists of hypnotherapy use, to program actions into their patients / victims without their knowledge, then provide triggers to make them execute those? And how are such medical cases induced by psychiatrists related to the doctrine of the will?
No, you don't understand correctly. The very idea of REJECTING and GIVING your child to Satan implies that you are WILLING evil, and it is your own doing and sin. REPEATING it indicates MORE WILLING (where you are NOT RESISTING).
God has to judge the individual cases as to what small external things can be caused by force alone (and so are not sins) and what partly requires the will (and so a sin, even if a smaller sin if there is some forced influence). ("Giving" and "rejecting" are WILLED things not external things)
I don't know about psychiatry and hypnotherapy, and probably shouldn't say more. But where there is no will there is no sin.
:pray1:
Quote from: Xavier on January 21, 2020, 12:36:48 PM
Hi GSAS. A very,very,very powerful form of prayer is where we offer the Precious Blood or the Holy Wounds etc of Our Lord Jesus to the Eternal Father. In that case, it's Our Blessed Lord's Infinite Merits themselves that are pleading for us, and in virtue of which we make our pleas.
Please read Catholic Tradition on the Holy Wounds Devotion and its Amazing Seventeen Promises: http://www.catholictradition.org/Christ/holy-wounds.htm
http://www.catholictradition.org/Children/number.htm#17 Promise #2 illustrates the Theology and lived experience behind what I'm talking about (Edit: Also Promise #4) I can vouchsafe for the fact that anyone who continues or perseveres in praying this Holy Wounds Devotion with meditation will have a very deepening knowledge and deeper love of Our Lord Jesus Christ, exactly as He Himself has promised us in Promise #6.
I pray such prayers throughout the day morning to night, even when I'm at work.
"The following prayers, composed by Our Lord, are to be said using the Rosary beads.
On the large [middle] beads: Eternal Father, I offer Thee the Wounds of our Lord Jesus Christ. To heal the wounds of our souls.
On the small [decade] beads: My Jesus, pardon and mercy. Through the merits of Thy Holy Wounds.
"PROMISES OF OUR LORD FOR THOSE WHO PRACTICE THIS DEVOTION
1. At each word that you pronounce of the Chaplet of the Holy Wounds, I allow a drop of My Blood to fall upon the soul of a sinner.
2. Each time that you offer to My Father the merits of My Divine Wounds, you win an immense fortune.
3. Souls that will have contemplated and honored My crown of thorns on earth, will be My crown of glory in Heaven!
4. I will grant all that is asked of Me through the invocation of My Holy Wounds. You will obtain everything, because it is through the merit of My Blood, which is of infinite price. With My Wounds and My Divine Heart, everything can be obtained.
5. From My Wounds proceed fruits of sanctity. As gold puri fied in the crucible becomes more beautiful, so you must put your soul and those of your companions into My sacred Wounds; there they will become perfected as gold in the furnace. You can always purify yourself in My Wounds.
6. My Wounds will repair yours. My Wounds will cover all your faults. Those who honor them will have a true knowledge of Jesus Christ. In meditation on them, you will always find a new love. My Wounds will cover all your sins.
7. Plunge your actions into My Wounds and they will be of value. All your actions, even the least, soaked in My Blood, will acquire by this alone an infinite merit and will please My Heart.
8. In offering My Wounds for the conversion of sinners, even though the sinners are not converted, you will have the same merit before God as if they were.
9. When you have some trouble, something to suffer, quickly place it in My Wounds, and the pain will be alleviated.
10. This aspiration must often be repeated near the sick: "My Jesus, pardon and mercy through the merits of Thy Holy Wounds!" This prayer will solace soul and body.
11. A sinner who will say the following prayer will obtain conversion: "Eternal Father, I offer Thee the Wounds of our Lord Jesus Christ to heal those of our souls."
12. There will be no death for the soul that expires in My Holy Wounds; they give true life.
13. This chaplet is a counterpoise to My justice; it restrains My vengeance.
14. Those who pray with humility and who meditate on My Passion, will one day participate in the glory of My Divine Wounds.
15. The more you will have contemplated My painful Wounds on this earth, the higher will be your contemplation of them glorious in Heaven.
16. The soul who during life has honored the Wounds of our Lord Jesus Christ and has offered them to the Eternal Father for the Souls in Purgatory, will be accompanied at the moment of death by the Holy Virgin and the Angels; and Our Lord on the Cross, all brilliant in glory, will receive her and crown her.
17. The invocations of the Holy Wounds will obtain an incessant victory for the Church."
Very Important for our Holy Mother Church today also based on Promise Number 17. It cannot fail.
If you want to say a similar prayer in Latin, which is even powerful, let me know and I will give you.
God Bless You.
I have just tried this out. Wow this is truly so powerful! I love this prayer! Thanks for bringing it!
Quote from: Non Nobis on January 21, 2020, 10:11:14 PM
Quote from: gsas on January 21, 2020, 12:09:51 PM
Quote from: Non Nobis on January 20, 2020, 12:18:19 AM
Quote from: gsas on January 18, 2020, 09:31:19 PM
And as for the statement that there is nobody in hell who doesn't belong there, I must confess that I am not convinced. For example, there is the famous wife of the dictator Stalin, who Stalin subjected to endless daily witchcraft to the point that he destroyed her motherly instinct and she was not able to hug her daughter, before this witchcraft has also made her commit suicide. So how do we derive from doctrine that she is in hell not because she was forced into there, but because she belongs there? I confess I really don't understand the doctrine, at minimum from the applications point of view.
First, is there a "it's-the-bible-truth" account of Stalin and Stalin's wife such as this; or is this just an account you have heard (no matter how firmly you believe it). It would be just the story a Satanist WOULD tell to put it firmly in YOUR mind that Satan had such power. In other words: A LIE.
In any case, whatever external actions someone is driven to that he/she can't HELP, the EXTERNAL actions are not SINS, so Satan is the loser. If someone without blame neglected to hug her child, that would not deserve hell unless she freely willed to HATE her child: WITCHCRAFT cannot produce hate, because that is moving the WILL, which Satan cannot do. If someone was physically forced over the top of a cliff, that would not deserve hell, because it is not freely willed.
It is a simple matter of Catholic Faith that Satan cannot move the will, gsas. Put up the big-red-THIS-IS-SATANIC-sign whenever THIS claim (or "Satan can force you to hell") comes up. You are just fooled to think otherwise.
It IS true that people putter in Witchcraft and go to hell but it is because they putter WILLINGLY.
If Stalin's wife did this (were the story true) INDEED SHE COULD BE IN HELL - but it would be BECAUSE SHE BELONGS THERE, and chose it (whether she CHOSE to hate her child or CHOSE to kill herself, it would be HER CHOICE and HER FAULT)
:pray1:
Right now you appear to believe Satan's lie, gsas. REALIZE that this is what you are doing.
Then let me ask this question. Do I understand that by the doctrine that you are explaining above, an act of rejecting your child and giving her to satan, maybe even repeatedly, is not a sin, if it is done under some sort of satanic influence, such as for example an influence like what psychiatrists of hypnotherapy use, to program actions into their patients / victims without their knowledge, then provide triggers to make them execute those? And how are such medical cases induced by psychiatrists related to the doctrine of the will?
No, you don't understand correctly. The very idea of REJECTING and GIVING your child to Satan implies that you are WILLING evil, and it is your own doing and sin. REPEATING it indicates MORE WILLING (where you are NOT RESISTING).
God has to judge the individual cases as to what small external things can be caused by force alone (and so are not sins) and what partly requires the will (and so a sin, even if a smaller sin if there is some forced influence. ("Giving" and "rejecting" are WILLED things not external things)
I don't know about psychiatry and hypnotherapy, and probably shouldn't say more. But where there is no will there is no sin.
:pray1:
In that case, is the devil like e.g. an elephant handler? An elephant handler beats the little elephant badly so that when it grows up very big, it wills to work, instead of just return the beating and go home.
Witchcraft tries to achieve the same thing, through the same emotional manipulations.
But even water boarding can take you to your breaking point and thus change your will into evil if you are subjected to it?
I guess my quedtion is, is it so easy for the devil that he just needs to take everyone to his breaking point? Seems too easy and then by now everyone would be the devil's possessed slave. Puzzling.
Quote from: gsas on January 21, 2020, 10:22:21 PM
Quote from: Non Nobis on January 21, 2020, 10:11:14 PM
Quote from: gsas on January 21, 2020, 12:09:51 PM
Quote from: Non Nobis on January 20, 2020, 12:18:19 AM
Quote from: gsas on January 18, 2020, 09:31:19 PM
And as for the statement that there is nobody in hell who doesn't belong there, I must confess that I am not convinced. For example, there is the famous wife of the dictator Stalin, who Stalin subjected to endless daily witchcraft to the point that he destroyed her motherly instinct and she was not able to hug her daughter, before this witchcraft has also made her commit suicide. So how do we derive from doctrine that she is in hell not because she was forced into there, but because she belongs there? I confess I really don't understand the doctrine, at minimum from the applications point of view.
First, is there a "it's-the-bible-truth" account of Stalin and Stalin's wife such as this; or is this just an account you have heard (no matter how firmly you believe it). It would be just the story a Satanist WOULD tell to put it firmly in YOUR mind that Satan had such power. In other words: A LIE.
In any case, whatever external actions someone is driven to that he/she can't HELP, the EXTERNAL actions are not SINS, so Satan is the loser. If someone without blame neglected to hug her child, that would not deserve hell unless she freely willed to HATE her child: WITCHCRAFT cannot produce hate, because that is moving the WILL, which Satan cannot do. If someone was physically forced over the top of a cliff, that would not deserve hell, because it is not freely willed.
It is a simple matter of Catholic Faith that Satan cannot move the will, gsas. Put up the big-red-THIS-IS-SATANIC-sign whenever THIS claim (or "Satan can force you to hell") comes up. You are just fooled to think otherwise.
It IS true that people putter in Witchcraft and go to hell but it is because they putter WILLINGLY.
If Stalin's wife did this (were the story true) INDEED SHE COULD BE IN HELL - but it would be BECAUSE SHE BELONGS THERE, and chose it (whether she CHOSE to hate her child or CHOSE to kill herself, it would be HER CHOICE and HER FAULT)
:pray1:
Right now you appear to believe Satan's lie, gsas. REALIZE that this is what you are doing.
Then let me ask this question. Do I understand that by the doctrine that you are explaining above, an act of rejecting your child and giving her to satan, maybe even repeatedly, is not a sin, if it is done under some sort of satanic influence, such as for example an influence like what psychiatrists of hypnotherapy use, to program actions into their patients / victims without their knowledge, then provide triggers to make them execute those? And how are such medical cases induced by psychiatrists related to the doctrine of the will?
No, you don't understand correctly. The very idea of REJECTING and GIVING your child to Satan implies that you are WILLING evil, and it is your own doing and sin. REPEATING it indicates MORE WILLING (where you are NOT RESISTING).
God has to judge the individual cases as to what small external things can be caused by force alone (and so are not sins) and what partly requires the will (and so a sin, even if a smaller sin if there is some forced influence. ("Giving" and "rejecting" are WILLED things not external things)
I don't know about psychiatry and hypnotherapy, and probably shouldn't say more. But where there is no will there is no sin.
:pray1:
In that case, is the devil like e.g. an elephant handler? An elephant handler beats the little elephant badly so that when it grows up very big, it wills to work, instead of just return the beating and go home.
Witchcraft tries to achieve the same thing, through the same emotional manipulations.
But even water boarding can take you to your breaking point and thus change your will into evil if you are subjected to it?
I guess my quedtion is, is it so easy for the devil that he just needs to take everyone to his breaking point? Seems too easy and then by now everyone would be the devil's possessed slave. Puzzling.
It seems we say the "will is broken" when someone finally does something unwillingly. But then the will is NOT really doing it and is NOT changed into evil.
If thousands of hypnotherapists for days and hours suggest saying "I hate God" someone might say it but not MEAN it. God alone knows what is MEANT. (Even sub-consciously, underneath layers of foggy untruths perhaps). Satan and psychiatry cannot change that.
Goodness finally belongs to the SOUL, however battered the brain (whether it is psychiatry or mental illness or the external world) God knows it and put it there and the devil cannot steal it. But man's free sin can OK the devil being there.
But prayer is the final answer, of course. So it is NOT easy for the devil. We are free each step of the way to resist him; prayer is always available.
This is hard stuff and I might not have more to say.
:pray1:
Wonderful, GSAS, very happy for you. That Prayer is a True Treasure and we Roman Catholics are blessed to have it and to make use of it.
Here are two other Familiar Prayers, I suggest saying them in Latin especially if you can, from Morning to Night, even if you are at work.
Divine Mercy Prayer: Pater Aeterne, Offero Tibi Corpus et Sanguinem, Animam et Divinitatem, Dilectissimi Filli Tui Domini Nostri Jesu Christi In Propitiatione Pro Peccatis Nostri et Totius Mundi [From Memory; may be slightly off]
That is to say, Eternal Father, we offer You the Body and Blood, Soul and Divinity of Your Dearly Beloved Son, Our Lord Jesus Christ, In Atonement for our sins and for those of the whole world". Recall that St. Peter tells us to keep offering spiritual sacrifices to God in Sacred Scripture.
Immeasurably consoles the Pierced Sacred Heart of our Savior, from the which the Infinite Ocean of Divine Mercy flowed forth upon us. Pours Oceans and Oceans of Graces both upon us, our family, our loved ones, the whole world, and the souls in Purgatory. Must be prayed every day by many Catholics most especially for those who are going to die within that day, as they are in most need of Mercy, and have it the least.
St. Gertrude's Prayer: Eternal Father I offer You the Precious Blood of Thy Divine Son Jesus, in Union with the Holy Masses said throughout the world today, for all the Holy Souls in Purgatory, for sinners everywhere, for sinners in the Universal Church, especially those who are going to die this Day [Month/Year], for all within my own Home and Family"
Fr. Paul O Sullivan, with Episcopal Imprimatur, wrote that, in Read Me or Rue It, "Our Lord showed St. Gertrude a vast number of souls leaving Purgatory and going to Heaven as a result of this prayer, which the Saint was accustomed to say frequently during the day." https://www.ewtn.com/catholicism/library/read-me-or-rue-it-12622
For the same reason that offering the Holy Wounds of Jesus to the Father is immeasurably precious because of Its Infinite Merits, and wins for you also a richer reward and a higher crown in Heaven, so also no one can doubt that the Most Precious Blood of Jesus, Offered to the Eternal Father together with all the Holy Masses of the world, will also win very powerful Graces and will save souls each time.
I've not translated that into Latin yet. Will try to do that later if you wish. But you can always say them in English also as well. God Bles.
"Can God Forsake You?"
Something that comes to mind I wanted to add (but this may be slightly tangential) is: "On the Number of Sins Beyond Which God Pardons No More" (by St. Alphonsus de Liguori) https://www.churchmilitant.com/news/article/on-the-number-of-sins-beyond-which-god-pardons-no-more