El Rito Mozarabe

Started by poche, January 17, 2013, 12:30:41 AM

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poche

January 17, 2013, 12:30:41 AM
Yo quiero saber que Uds saben y piensen sobre el rito mozarabe?

Gottmitunsalex

#1
January 17, 2013, 12:38:04 AM
No sé porque de repente me dio deja vu...
"Nothing is more miserable than those people who never failed to attack their own salvation. When there was need to observe the Law, they trampled it under foot. Now that the Law has ceased to bind, they obstinately strive to observe it. What could be more pitiable that those who provoke God not only by transgressing the Law but also by keeping it? But at any rate the Jews say that they, too, adore God. God forbid that I say that. No Jew adores God! Who say so? The Son of God say so. For he said: "If you were to know my Father, you would also know me. But you neither know me nor do you know my Father". Could I produce a witness more trustworthy than the Son of God?"  St. John Chrysostom  Sunday Homily

"The two goals of the Jews: The universal domination of the world and the destruction of Catholicism, out of hatred for Christ" --Mgr. Jouin

Bonaventure

#2
January 17, 2013, 12:42:03 AM
Quote from: Gottmitunsalex on January 17, 2013, 12:38:04 AM
No sé porque de repente me dio deja vu...

Jejeje
"If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me."

poche

#3
January 17, 2013, 03:29:31 AM
Quote from: Gottmitunsalex on January 17, 2013, 12:38:04 AM
No sé porque de repente me dio deja vu...
como?

MilesChristi

#4
January 17, 2013, 07:02:14 PM Last Edit: January 17, 2013, 07:46:14 PM by MilesChristi
Si Vatican II queria regresar a un estilo de misa mas antigua y differentes formas para cada lenguaje, porque no regresaron el rito Sarum , el rito Ambrosiano, y el rito Mozarbe.
The world is charged with the grandeur of God.
    It will flame out, like shining from shook foil;
    It gathers to a greatness, like the ooze of oil
Crushed. Why do men then now not reck his rod?
Generations have trod, have trod, have trod;
    And all is seared with trade; bleared, smeared with toil;
    And wears man's smudge and shares man's smell: the soil
Is bare now, nor can foot feel, being shod.

And for all this, nature is never spent;
    There lives the dearest freshness deep down things;
And though the last lights off the black West went
    Oh, morning, at the brown brink eastward, springs —
Because the Holy Ghost over the bent
    World broods with warm breast and with ah! bright wings.

Gottmitunsalex

#5
January 17, 2013, 08:05:38 PM
Quote from: poche on January 17, 2013, 03:29:31 AM
Quote from: Gottmitunsalex on January 17, 2013, 12:38:04 AM
No sé porque de repente me dio deja vu...
como?
Es que, por un instante, pense que habiamos discutido este mismo tema.
"Nothing is more miserable than those people who never failed to attack their own salvation. When there was need to observe the Law, they trampled it under foot. Now that the Law has ceased to bind, they obstinately strive to observe it. What could be more pitiable that those who provoke God not only by transgressing the Law but also by keeping it? But at any rate the Jews say that they, too, adore God. God forbid that I say that. No Jew adores God! Who say so? The Son of God say so. For he said: "If you were to know my Father, you would also know me. But you neither know me nor do you know my Father". Could I produce a witness more trustworthy than the Son of God?"  St. John Chrysostom  Sunday Homily

"The two goals of the Jews: The universal domination of the world and the destruction of Catholicism, out of hatred for Christ" --Mgr. Jouin

poche

#6
January 18, 2013, 01:12:03 AM
Quote from: MilesChristi on January 17, 2013, 07:02:14 PM
Si Vatican II queria regresar a un estilo de misa mas antigua y differentes formas para cada lenguaje, porque no regresaron el rito Sarum , el rito Ambrosiano, y el rito Mozarbe.
Ante del concilio habia solamente 6 paroquias en que podia celebrar el rito mozarabe en Toledo. Pero despues habia mucho mas difusion en espana del rito en difentes capillas y ciudades.   

Bonaventure

#7
January 18, 2013, 01:21:54 AM
Quote from: poche on January 18, 2013, 01:12:03 AM
Quote from: MilesChristi on January 17, 2013, 07:02:14 PM
Si Vatican II queria regresar a un estilo de misa mas antigua y differentes formas para cada lenguaje, porque no regresaron el rito Sarum , el rito Ambrosiano, y el rito Mozarbe.
Ante del concilio habia solamente 6 paroquias en que podia celebrar el rito mozarabe en Toledo. Pero despues habia mucho mas difusion en espana del rito en difentes capillas y ciudades.   

Pero este "rito" fue Novusordinado, o reformado, cambiado, pero a mí me gusta decir mutilado.

No es el rito mozarabe actual, como el Novus Ordo Missae del rito romano no el la misa romana.
"If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me."

Gottmitunsalex

#8
January 18, 2013, 01:24:31 AM
Quote from: Bonaventure on January 18, 2013, 01:21:54 AM
Quote from: poche on January 18, 2013, 01:12:03 AM
Quote from: MilesChristi on January 17, 2013, 07:02:14 PM
Si Vatican II queria regresar a un estilo de misa mas antigua y differentes formas para cada lenguaje, porque no regresaron el rito Sarum , el rito Ambrosiano, y el rito Mozarbe.
Ante del concilio habia solamente 6 paroquias en que podia celebrar el rito mozarabe en Toledo. Pero despues habia mucho mas difusion en espana del rito en difentes capillas y ciudades.   

Pero este "rito" fue Novusordinado, o reformado, cambiado, pero a mí me gusta decir mutilado.

No es el rito mozarabe actual, como el Novus Ordo Missae del rito romano no el la misa romana.
Muy buena pregunta. Y otra vez, valga la redundancia, deja vu.  ;D
"Nothing is more miserable than those people who never failed to attack their own salvation. When there was need to observe the Law, they trampled it under foot. Now that the Law has ceased to bind, they obstinately strive to observe it. What could be more pitiable that those who provoke God not only by transgressing the Law but also by keeping it? But at any rate the Jews say that they, too, adore God. God forbid that I say that. No Jew adores God! Who say so? The Son of God say so. For he said: "If you were to know my Father, you would also know me. But you neither know me nor do you know my Father". Could I produce a witness more trustworthy than the Son of God?"  St. John Chrysostom  Sunday Homily

"The two goals of the Jews: The universal domination of the world and the destruction of Catholicism, out of hatred for Christ" --Mgr. Jouin

poche

#9
January 22, 2013, 12:29:54 AM
Aqui es el padre nuestro en el rito mozarabe.

poche

#10
January 23, 2013, 04:35:10 AM
Aqui es una explicacion mas comprensivo del rito mozarabe.

http://www.lexorandi.es/HispanoMozarabe/unasencillaexplicacion.htm

poche

#11
January 23, 2013, 04:36:43 AM
Aqui es el ordinario del rito mozarabe.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/57601261/OrdinarioMHM

Gottmitunsalex

#12
January 23, 2013, 10:52:21 AM
Para no hacer un cuento largo, al leer el ordinario de el rito, si esta cambiado al nuevo "novus ordo".
Ya esta la "primera" y "segunda" lectura antes del evangelio. De hecho, al igual que el NO, lo describen como "liturgia de la palabra"

"Mientras el sacerdote con los ministros y los fieles entre sí se dan el saludo de la paz, entona el coro el canto de lapaz:"

Es el mismo veneno que el NO.

No gracias.


"Nothing is more miserable than those people who never failed to attack their own salvation. When there was need to observe the Law, they trampled it under foot. Now that the Law has ceased to bind, they obstinately strive to observe it. What could be more pitiable that those who provoke God not only by transgressing the Law but also by keeping it? But at any rate the Jews say that they, too, adore God. God forbid that I say that. No Jew adores God! Who say so? The Son of God say so. For he said: "If you were to know my Father, you would also know me. But you neither know me nor do you know my Father". Could I produce a witness more trustworthy than the Son of God?"  St. John Chrysostom  Sunday Homily

"The two goals of the Jews: The universal domination of the world and the destruction of Catholicism, out of hatred for Christ" --Mgr. Jouin

poche

#13
January 24, 2013, 12:44:26 AM
Una parte del "Novus Ordo" de Ud menciona es la difusion en areas donde lerito ya se habia desparacido, por ejemplo en Tarragona y Merida y hasta Madrid. Hay ciertas aspectas que son particular al rito que no se encuentra en otros partes. Es por la antiguedad del rito.

Gottmitunsalex

#14
January 24, 2013, 02:16:30 AM
Quote from: poche on January 24, 2013, 12:44:26 AM
Una parte del "Novus Ordo" de Ud menciona es la difusion en areas donde lerito ya se habia desparacido, por ejemplo en Tarragona y Merida y hasta Madrid. Hay ciertas aspectas que son particular al rito que no se encuentra en otros partes. Es por la antiguedad del rito.
Definitivamente, algunos nombres de Santos que no estan en el rito Novus Ordo estan mencionados en el mozarabe. Lei que Mishael etc. Pero en su esencia, es lo mismo. Tiene la Liturgia de la Palabra y la liturgia de la Eucharistia.
Con algunas variaciones en nombres etc. Ofrendas se le llevan al sacerdote etc.
Sigue siendo el Novus Ordo.
"Nothing is more miserable than those people who never failed to attack their own salvation. When there was need to observe the Law, they trampled it under foot. Now that the Law has ceased to bind, they obstinately strive to observe it. What could be more pitiable that those who provoke God not only by transgressing the Law but also by keeping it? But at any rate the Jews say that they, too, adore God. God forbid that I say that. No Jew adores God! Who say so? The Son of God say so. For he said: "If you were to know my Father, you would also know me. But you neither know me nor do you know my Father". Could I produce a witness more trustworthy than the Son of God?"  St. John Chrysostom  Sunday Homily

"The two goals of the Jews: The universal domination of the world and the destruction of Catholicism, out of hatred for Christ" --Mgr. Jouin
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