Is a change coming to Church teaching on contraception?

Started by Vox Clara, August 01, 2022, 09:19:17 AM

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Vox Clara

From Aleteia:

Is a change coming to Church teaching on contraception? Pope weighs in

Kathleen N. Hattrup - published on 07/30/22

Pope Francis considers the development of Church doctrine on his return flight from Canada.

In certain Catholic circles, there's talk of Pope Francis changing the teaching of Paul VI's document on contraception, Humanae Vitae, a document which will mark its 55th anniversary next year.

The rumors are mostly linked to a book that presents the talks from a three-day conference sponsored by the Pontifical Academy for Life in fall of 2021. The book was published last month by the Vatican publishing house, called Etica teologica della vita: Scrittura, tradizione, sfide, pratiche (Theological Ethics of Life: Writing, Tradition, Practical Challenges).

A Jesuit scholar commenting on the book said a papal encyclical might be forthcoming called Gaudium Vitae (The Joy of Life).

On the plane from Canada to Rome, the Pope was asked for his thoughts on if the Church's teaching on contraception needs development. "This is something very timely," he began, in reply.

Doctrinal development

The Pope then went on to explain that "dogma, morality, is always on a path of development, but always developing in the same direction."

He cited Vincent of Lerins and "a rule that is very clear and illuminating" from the 10th century, his principle that doctrine is ut annis consolidetur, dilatetur tempore, sublimetur aetate.

This theologian maintained that doctrine does not stay still but is "consolidated by years, enlarged by time, refined by age."

In this context, the Pope said, theologians have a duty to research and reflect. "You cannot do theology with a 'no' in front of it," he said.

Instead, it's the teaching body of the Church, the Magisterium, that redirects theology if it has gone astray.

Then it is up to the Magisterium to say no, you've gone too far, come back, but theological development must be open, that's what theologians are for. And the Magisterium must help to understand the limits.

Regarding the issue of contraception, the Pope showed he was aware of the chatter about the Pontifical Academy for Life book.

On the issue of contraception, I know there is a publication out on this and other marital issues: These are the Acts of a congress, and in a congress, there are hypotheses, then they discuss among themselves and make proposals. We have to be clear: those who participated in this congress did their duty, because they have sought to move forward in doctrine, but in an ecclesial sense, not out of it, as I said with that rule of St. Vincent of Lerins.

Then the Magisterium will say, yes it is good or it is not good.


The Pope said that this dynamic and principle applies to many issues, and gave two recent examples, that of stockpiling atomic weapons and the death penalty.

To be clear: It's ok when dogma or morality develops, but in that direction, with the three rules of Vincent of Lerins. I think this is very clear: a Church that does not develop its thinking in an ecclesial sense, is a Church that is going backward.

Tradition vs traditionalists

In this regard, the Pope returned to a concern he has voiced about "traditionalists."

This is today's problem, and of many who call themselves traditional. No, no, they are not traditional, they are people looking to the past, going backward, without roots – it has always been done that way, that's how it was done last century. And looking backward is a sin because it does not progress with the Church.

Tradition, instead, someone said (I think I said it in one of the speeches), tradition is the living faith of those who have died. Instead, for those people who are looking backward, who call themselves traditionalists, it is the dead faith of the living.

Tradition is truly the root, the inspiration by which to go forward in the Church, and this is always vertical. And looking backward is going backward, it is always closed. It is important to understand well the role of tradition, which is always open, like the roots of the tree, and the tree grows... A musician used a very beautiful phrase. Gustav Mahler used to say that tradition in this sense, is the guarantee of the future, it is not a museum piece. If you conceive of tradition as closed, that is not Christian tradition... it is always the sap of the root that carries you forward, forward, forward.

So for that reason, regarding what you are saying, thinking and carrying forward faith and morals, as long as it is going in the direction of the roots, of the sap, that's ok. With these three rules of Vincent of Lerins that I mentioned.


AlNg

Quote from: Vox Clara on August 01, 2022, 09:19:17 AM

In this regard, the Pope returned to a concern he has voiced about "traditionalists."

This is today's problem, and of many who call themselves traditional. No, no, they are not traditional, they are people looking to the past, going backward, without roots – it has always been done that way, that's how it was done last century. And looking backward is a sin because it does not progress with the Church.
Perhaps this is why Pope Francis has restricted the Tridentine Latin Mass, because it is a sin to look backward and not to progress with the Catholic Church?

Greg

Who cares? Contraception is obviously wrong.

You only have to look at the damage its widespread use has done to public morals and the number of abortions it has caused.

If Pius Xth himself was resurrected and said "contraception was OK" I would disagree because it flies in the face or a truth I have witnessed in my own lifetime.  Humane Vitae was prophetic in what it suggested the effects of contraception would be.

The good thing now is that these clerics don't mix good with evil and try to confuse.  Anything they are really pushing is ALWAYS evil.  It does make discernment much easier than in the past.
Contentment is knowing that you're right. Happiness is knowing that someone else is wrong.

drummerboy

Quote from: AlNg on August 01, 2022, 10:08:56 AM
Quote from: Vox Clara on August 01, 2022, 09:19:17 AM

In this regard, the Pope returned to a concern he has voiced about "traditionalists."

This is today's problem, and of many who call themselves traditional. No, no, they are not traditional, they are people looking to the past, going backward, without roots – it has always been done that way, that's how it was done last century. And looking backward is a sin because it does not progress with the Church.

No. He's the custodian of tradition, remember....? Some tradition....
Perhaps this is why Pope Francis has restricted the Tridentine Latin Mass, because it is a sin to look backward and not to progress with the Catholic Church?
- I'll get with the times when the times are worth getting with

"I like grumpy old cusses.  Hope to live long enough to be one" - John Wayne

drummerboy

The Pope saying anything on the topic won't matter anyway. Most "catholics" use it regardless, and any solid Catholic knows better
- I'll get with the times when the times are worth getting with

"I like grumpy old cusses.  Hope to live long enough to be one" - John Wayne

clau clau

#5
Quote from: Vox Clara on August 01, 2022, 09:19:17 AMTradition is truly the root, the inspiration by which to go forward in the Church, and this is always vertical. And looking backward is going backward, it is always closed. It is important to understand well the role of tradition, which is always open, like the roots of the tree, and the tree grows... A musician used a very beautiful phrase. Gustav Mahler used to say that tradition in this sense, is the guarantee of the future, it is not a museum piece. If you conceive of tradition as closed, that is not Christian tradition... it is always the sap of the root that carries you forward, forward, forward.

So for that reason, regarding what you are saying, thinking and carrying forward faith and morals, as long as it is going in the direction of the roots, of the sap, that's ok. With these three rules of Vincent of Lerins that I mentioned.[/i]

"A fiddler on the roof. Sounds crazy, no?
But in our little village of Anatevka,
you might say every one of us is a fiddler on the roof,
trying to scratch out a pleasant,
Simple tune without breaking his neck. It isn't easy.
You may ask, why do we stay up there if it's so dangerous?
We stay because Anatevka is our home...
And how do we keep our balance?
That I can tell you in one word... Tradition."


I would rather keep my balance as well.
Father time has an undefeated record.

But when he's dumb and no more here,
Nineteen hundred years or near,
Clau-Clau-Claudius shall speak clear.
(https://completeandunabridged.blogspot.com/2009/06/i-claudius.html)

Maximilian

Quote from: AlNg on August 01, 2022, 10:08:56 AM
Quote from: Vox Clara on August 01, 2022, 09:19:17 AM

In this regard, the Pope returned to a concern he has voiced about "traditionalists."

This is today's problem, and of many who call themselves traditional. No, no, they are not traditional, they are people looking to the past, going backward, without roots – it has always been done that way, that's how it was done last century. And looking backward is a sin because it does not progress with the Church.
Perhaps this is why Pope Francis has restricted the Tridentine Latin Mass, because it is a sin to look backward and not to progress with the Catholic Church?

Yes, that's exactly what he said, in fact.

Maximilian

Quote from: drummerboy on August 01, 2022, 11:19:34 AM
No. He's the custodian of tradition, remember....? Some tradition....

Custodes means guards or jailers. It appears in today's epistle for the feast of St. Peter in Chains.

Acts 12 (Vulgate)
6 Cum autem producturus eum esset Herodes, in ipsa nocte erat Petrus dormiens inter duos milites, vinctus catenis duabus: et custodes ante ostium custodiebant carcerem.

"And the keepers before the door were guarding the prison."



Maximilian

Quote from: Vox Clara on August 01, 2022, 09:19:17 AM
On the plane from Canada to Rome, the Pope was asked for his thoughts on if the Church's teaching on contraception needs development. "This is something very timely," he began, in reply.

Which obviously is a diplomatic way of saying, "Yes." His reply shows that he was hoping for that question.

And then he was even more clear:

Quote"You cannot do theology with a 'no' in front of it," he said.

If only Francis had let God know about this principle before He issued those 10 Commandments, most of which have a "No" in front of them.

Baylee

Quote from: Maximilian on August 01, 2022, 11:41:25 AM
Quote from: AlNg on August 01, 2022, 10:08:56 AM
Quote from: Vox Clara on August 01, 2022, 09:19:17 AM

In this regard, the Pope returned to a concern he has voiced about "traditionalists."

This is today's problem, and of many who call themselves traditional. No, no, they are not traditional, they are people looking to the past, going backward, without roots – it has always been done that way, that's how it was done last century. And looking backward is a sin because it does not progress with the Church.
Perhaps this is why Pope Francis has restricted the Tridentine Latin Mass, because it is a sin to look backward and not to progress with the Catholic Church?

Yes, that's exactly what he said, in fact.

Yah, except when they want to push the idea that the Novus Ordo mass emphasizes so-called early, original features of the Mass in the time of the Church Fathers.  Then they're all about looking backwards!


King Wenceslas

#10
Overturning of Humanae Vitae based upon the development of doctrine using St. Vincent of Lerins with his statement "all men have at all times and everywhere believed must be regarded as true."

Now that is rich.

Trads make up about 2 million in a Church of 1.2 billion and this guy just can't get over us even existing after so many years after Vatican II.

In a certain manner he is proving that we are the true Church, and he leads a false church. The more he talks; the more we gain steam. Free advertising.

Keep it up, Francis.

Padraig

The idea that Francis would use Vincent of Lerins to leverage development of doctrine is so twisted and backwards, it could only have been demonically inspired.

Jmartyr

"If anyone is excommunicated it is not I, but the excommunicators." - Archbishop Marcel Lefebvre
" A false church cannot have a true mission." - St. Francis De Sales
" The way is open for us to deprive councils of their authority, contradict their acts freely, and profess confidently, whatever SEEMS to be true. " - Martin Luther

Jmartyr

Quote from: Padraig on August 01, 2022, 03:07:09 PM
The idea that Francis would use Vincent of Lerins to leverage development of doctrine is so twisted and backwards, it could only have been demonically inspired.
Inversion of all that is good and holy.
"If anyone is excommunicated it is not I, but the excommunicators." - Archbishop Marcel Lefebvre
" A false church cannot have a true mission." - St. Francis De Sales
" The way is open for us to deprive councils of their authority, contradict their acts freely, and profess confidently, whatever SEEMS to be true. " - Martin Luther

Greg

What difference would it make?

Nobody who is not using contraception already would start to use it because the apostates in Rome said it was OK and ditched Humane Vitae.

Just as zero people who have stayed unvaccinated until now are deciding, that now is the time to get vaccinated against Covid-19.

Because anyone who has stayed unvaccinated has educated themselves and has enough common sense to have the intuition to avoid the experimental jab and now the education that the jab was totally useless and carried far more risk of vaccine injury than was ever admitted.

It is 2022 and anyone of good will can see that the people in Rome are evil.
Contentment is knowing that you're right. Happiness is knowing that someone else is wrong.