Author Topic: As Jewish Leaders Meet With Pope, New Hopes On Pius XII Archives  (Read 7702 times)

Offline Innocent Smith

  • Wachtmeister
  • ***
  • Posts: 1425
  • Thanked: 849 times
  • Religion: Roman Catholic
It looks to me that instead of cleaning house of blackmailed, homosexual Cardinals, Bishops and priests, the Pope will be "investigating" Pope Pius XII. 

The Vatican may be about to turn Catholic attention exclusively to Jewish concerns.  The public will be distracted by a re-hash of those old newsreels of the Holocaust and Hitler and Mussolini while the queers go on their merry way.

The homosexual pedophile scandal can just "go away" any time that the media decides to stop reporting on it   

The blackmailers don't want that dealt with.  So I think there's a good chance that media will give Bergoglio a long "honeymoon" and lay off the sex scandals for a while, and shift the attention to the Holocaust. and the dead pope Pius XII.

Are the blackmailers the Jews? And did they just get their payment in the election of Pope Francis with a promise to make the Vatican Archives new History, or is that Hitler Channel?

I think we will have our answer if the story on the homosexual curia goes away, no major house cleaning takes place and the Pius XII gets raked over the coals.

Is this the real reason Ratzinger quit? That they were going to force him to open the Archives on Pius XII and he thought he would hand the job over to a younger and stronger man. Perhaps one who is really friendly with the blackmailers?

As Jewish Leaders Meet With Pope, New Hopes On Pius XII Archives

Argentine rabbi says Pope Francis wants ‘to learn the truth’ of Pius’ role during Holocaust.

Quote
A dozen Jewish leaders and other clerics were invited to meet with Pope Francis one day after his inauguration Tuesday, among them the national director of the Anti-Defamation League, who said he hopes the pope will lift the “cloud” hanging over the Vatican.

“The Shoah [Holocaust] has been a cloud in Pope John Paul’s day and Pope Benedict’s, and maybe it will now get resolved,” said ADL’s  national director Abraham Foxman. “He [Pope Francis] indicated in his book the need to open the archives.”

Pope Francis, 76, is the first Jesuit ever to be chosen pope. He publicly called for the opening of the Vatican archives when he was known as Cardinal Jorge Maria Bergoglio. He said its opening was necessary to learn the true role Pope Pius XII played during the Holocaust.

There have been allegations that Pope Pius XII, who is on track to be canonized by the Church, remained silent despite the mass extermination of Jews and that he was friendly to the Nazis. Others have claimed that he secretly instructed Catholic clergy to hide Jews, and that he did so himself inside the walls of Vatican City.

Rabbi Abraham Skorka, who co-authored a book in 2010 with the new pope, “On Heaven and Earth,” told The Jewish Week that they devoted a chapter to analyzing “the attitude of Pope Pius XII during the Second World War. [Cardinal Bergoglio’s] answer was, in essence, that we have to wait to open all the archives and analyze all the details regarding this issue.”

Asked if he believes that with his new authority Pope Francis will order the opening of the archives, Rabbi Skorka replied: “I believe yes, that his attitude will be to search for all of the details and to open all the archives. He will use this opportunity to learn the truth.”

Rabbi Skorka said that during his discussion with Cardinal Bergoglio about this issue, “I explained that I could not understand how a person — a spiritual leader — didn’t involve himself more and more during the Shoah [Holocaust]. His answer was, ‘Let us continue searching to reach the truth.’”

Rabbi Skorka was in Buenos Aires this week and did not attend the inauguration, but he said he received a private call from Pope Francis Monday evening, “a couple hours before the ceremony in which he was crowned as pope.”

Among those attending Tuesday’s inaugural Mass was David Michaels, director of inter-communal affairs at B’nai B’rith International.

“It was, as expected, a moment of celebration for Catholics — but it also further signaled the new pope’s personal commitment to the continuance of the unique and historic contemporary friendship between Catholics and Jews,” he wrote in an e-mail interview. “Immediately after his election, Pope Francis sent a personal message to this effect to the chief rabbi of Rome; today, not only did Jewish leaders enjoy a place of prominence and proximity to the pope in St. Peter’s Square, but the Jewish community was the only inter-religious partner group of the Catholic Church to be singled out for specific greeting during the pope’s public remarks.”

Michaels said he views this as “a clear continuation of the practice of Benedict XVI — and a sign of allegiance to the momentous path of John Paul II.”

In his letter to Rome’s chief rabbi, Riccardo di Segni, Pope Francis said he “profoundly hopes to be able to contribute to the progress that Jewish-Catholic relations have seen starting from the Second Vatican Council [1962-65], in a spirit of renewed collaboration.”

In an interview last week with The Associated Press, Rabbi di Segni said the dialogue between Catholicism and Judaism was “complicated” but added that the new pope’s background “gives me trust and hope” that relations will continue to improve.

He was referring to the fact that Cardinal Bergoglio maintained a close relationship with the Jewish community in Argentina — expressing sympathy after the bombing of the AMIA Jewish center, celebrating Jewish holidays at Buenos Aires synagogues and participating in Kristallnacht observances that marked the state-sponsored attacks on synangogues in Nazi Germany in November 1938.

Israeli President Shimon Peres said Pope Francis “represents devotion, the love of God, the love of peace, a holy modesty and a new continent which is now awakening. We need, more than ever, a spiritual leadership and not just a political one.”

Peres invited the pope to visit Israel and said that as “a man of inspiration” he “can add to the attempt to bring peace in a stormy area. … The relations between the Vatican and the Jewish people are now at their best in the last 2,000 years, and I hope they will grow in content and depths.”

Although Israel and the Holy See established diplomatic relations in 1993, some bilateral issues have remained unresolved despite years of negotiation. However, the impasse appears to have been resolved during a meeting in Jerusalem Jan. 29 of the Bilateral Permanent Working Commission. A joint communiqué at the end of the meeting said that “significant progress” had been made in a “thoughtful and constructive atmosphere.” It added that both sides looked forward to a “speedy conclusion” of the talks.

One of those in attendance, Israeli Deputy Foreign Minister Danny Ayalon, reportedly said later that the two sides were on the “verge” of finalizing an agreement, which is to establish the juridical rights of the Catholic Church in Israel as well as regulate property and taxation issues.

Ayalon was quoted by the Jerusalem Post as saying a completed accord — which is subject to ratification by both the Israeli government and the Vatican — would be “nothing short of a milestone.”

Foxman said he too looked forward to that event and pointed out that the relationship between the Vatican and Israel has grown over the years “and it needs to grow more.”

“It was held hostage by the bilateral agreement,” he said. “Now, hopefully, there is an opportunity to celebrate the 20-year relationship in a more dynamic way.”

In his e-mail, Michaels of B’nai B’rith noted that the international Jewish community, both in Israel and the diaspora, was well represented at the inaugural, which he said was “a tribute to the importance we place on Catholic-Jewish relations.”

Foxman said he had not planned to attend, but “when I got a personal invitation, I thought it appropriate to go.”

“The fact that he did reach out and invite us stems from the relationship he had with the Jewish community in Argentina,” he observed. “In his book, he speaks of his commitment to the traditions of John Paul and Benedict. … What is important is that those traditions and changes continue to be institutionalized by the church. The fact that [Pope Francis] comes with such warm baggage gives us further hope that this relationship will only be strengthened.”

Rabbi Skorka said he and Pope Francis have been friends for 20 years and that last October the future pope arranged for him to receive an honorary doctorate from Pontificia Universidad Catolica Argentina (Catholic University of Argentina). Such an award to a rabbi was unprecedented in Latin America and was meant to stress on the 50th anniversary of the Second Vatican Council that the council had truly opened the door to a growing rapprochement between the Catholic Church and Judaism.

In his presentation of the honorary doctorate, the rector of Catholic University of Argentina, the Rev. Victor Fernandez said the council’s actions as well as those or recent pope “have been welcomed in Argentina, and Christian institutions can embrace the wisdom of a rabbi.”

In reporting on the event, the newsletter of Catholic Theological Ethics in the World wrote that Rabbi Skorka, 62, and the father of two, thanked the university with a “Hebrew verb meaning ‘to join, connect.’ He evoked family memories and dialogues with Cardinal Bergoglio … [and spoke of the] intellectual courage of Pope Paul II. He said that ‘God is reached by love, and urged [the restoration of] spiritual bonds.’”

Rabbi Skorka told The Jewish Week that the university was founded in the 19th century under the supervision of the Vatican, and that he was the “first Jew so honored … and through me all of the Jewish community.”
Buenos Aires has the largest Jewish community in Latin America. Latin America is also home to 40 percent of the world’s 1.2 billion Roman Catholics.

“It was an historic moment because under [Cardinal Bergoglio’s] guidance they changed the relationship between the Catholic Church in Argentina and the Jewish community,” Rabbi Skorka said. “It was an impressive sign.”

For a number of years Rabbi Skorka and Bergoglio conducted a televised dialogue “related to all aspects of life,” including politics, God, fundamentalism, death, the Holocaust and capitalism. Rabbi Skorka, who is rector of the Latin American Rabbinical Assembly, said he also invited Bergoglio to join his congregation, Benei Tikva Synagogue, for Selichot services in the days before the High Holy Days and Rosh HaShanah services.

“He gave a special message in the name of the Argentinean Church to my congregants and to all the Jewish community in Buenos Aires,” Rabbi Skorka recalled. “He is very close to all kinds of people in power in Buenos Aires, and he is very open to dialogue with us. He has condemned on several occasions anti-Semitism in a very stark way.”

After the AMIA Jewish community center was bombed in 1994, Cardinal Bergoglio visited the scene several times and expressed condolences for the 85 people killed, the rabbi added.

In 2005, Rabbi Joseph Ehrenkranz of the Center for 
Christian-Jewish Understanding at Sacred Heart University in Fairfield, Conn., praised Cardinal Bergoglio’s leadership, saying: “He was very concerned with what happened.”


That year, Cardinal Bergoglio was the first public personality in Argentina to sign a petition calling for justice in the AMIA bombing case, and was a signatory on a document called “85 victims, 85 signatures.”

Argentine investigators believe officials and diplomats in Tehran planned the bombing, and in 2007 Interpol issued an international arrest warrant for them. Iran refused extradition but last month — subject to the approval of the Iranian parliament — agreed to allow Argentine authorities to question the suspects in Iran.
During a 2010 commemoration of the AMIA bombing, Cardinal Bergoglio called the rebuilt building “a house of solidarity” and stated, “God bless them and help them accomplish their work.”

With Cardinal Bergoglio’s active support, the Buenos Aires Metropolitan Chapel, the main Roman Catholic Church in Argentina’s capital, erected a memorial to that bombing and to the victims of the Holocaust. Towards the rear of the main sanctuary, a large glass-enclosed case in a silver-wrought frame houses several Jewish artifacts, including a menorah, a Star of David, and sheets of prayer books rescued from Treblinka, Auschwitz and the Warsaw Ghetto.

The Holocaust memorial, known as the Commemorative Mural, is the only-such tribute to Holocaust victims in a Christian church, according to the International Raoul Wallenberg Foundation.

Another rabbi in Buenos Aires, Silvina Chemen, told The Jewish Week she has known Pope Francis for many years and found him to be “a serious man and a very intelligent person — he is very measured. He takes his time in speaking and making his opinions known. He is very respected in Argentina and he reads a lot.”

In fact, she said, two months ago at an event celebrating a newspaper supplement dealing with religious values “he told me that he has my book of commentaries on the Torah by his night table.’”

Rabbi Chemen said she found Pope Francis “open not only to Jewish-Catholic dialogue but to inter-religious dialogue in general. Every Chanukah he is invited to our synagogue and he comes and is very impressive. And he opens his house to meetings with the rabbis.”

In addition, he meets with Jewish community leaders, including Jorge Burkman, executive director of B’nai B’rith in Argentina, whose membership numbers 500 families.

“We work with him on interfaith relations because he is very committed to dialogue,” he told The Jewish Week. “He was always sensitive about Jewish issues. And twice in the cathedral in Buenos Aires he has commemorated Kristallnacht, the last time in November of last year.”

“We have developed a very good relationship since he came to the city of Buenos Aires,” Burkman said.
Pope Francis became the archbishop of Buenos Aires in 1998 and a cardinal in 2001. His selection as the 266th pontiff came last week on the fifth ballot of the 115 cardinals who had gathered in Rome to elect a successor for Pope Benedict XVI, who retired last month.

“We have in the cardinal a very good friend, and we hope he can develop the same as a pope,” Burkman added.
During the pope’s years in Argentina, there were allegations that the Catholic Church there had been silent and even complicit during what was known as the “dirty war” of the Argentine military junta in which countless people were murdered or vanished from 1976 until 1983. Rabbi Skoka pointed out that there were even allegations that Cardinal Bergoglio who headed the Jesuit order there from 1973 until 1979 was a member of the church hierarchy that supported or conspired to cover-up the junta’s actions.

“Our book deals with the dictatorship and in it he condemned with very sharp words the behavior of those who went along with the torture and killings,” Rabbi Skorka said.

He stressed that none of the allegations against Cardinal Bergoglio were ever proven and there was no evidence to support the claims. The primary allegation against him was that he was involved in the kidnapping of two Jesuit priests who were then held under inhumane conditions. Cardinal Bergoglio claimed that he, in fact, worked secretly to save the lives of the priests and others that he hid from the death squads.

“Not only did he totally deny it, but he also condemned with the sharpest words all of the clergymen and Catholic priests who stood with the killers during the regime,” Rabbi Skorka said.

In Rome this week, Rabbi David Rosen, international director of Interreligious Affairs for the American Jewish Committee, said he does not believe Pope Francis will address any serious issues. He said such matters are usually left to the Vatican’s secretary of state, who has yet to be appointed.

“The important thing today and tomorrow is simply to demonstrate our good will and ensure the continuation of Pope Francis’ remarkable commitment to and interest in the Jewish people and the dialogue between us,” he wrote in an e-mail from Rome.

Michaels of B’nai B’rith said he too is not looking for anything substantive from the pope this week regarding Catholic relations with other religions.

“Ultimately, it is my hope that he will express deep appreciation for Jews’ national expression — rejecting intensified forms of animus to Israel among too many — and also respect for Jews’ religious sensibilities. In this regard, a most welcome step would be constructive assessment of the content and framing of the Good Friday prayer for Jews’ conversion, in the Latin-language Tridentine Mass,” he said.

Stewart Ain and Steve Lipman are staff writers.
I am going to hold a pistol to the head of the modern man. But I shall not use it to kill him, only to bring him to life.
 

Offline Vetus Ordo

  • Feldwebel
  • ***
  • Posts: 4147
  • Thanked: 5362 times
  • Hopeful Fatalist
Re: As Jewish Leaders Meet With Pope, New Hopes On Pius XII Archives
« Reply #1 on: March 21, 2013, 12:39:50 AM »
All of this, of course, is bad news for traditional Catholicism. Perhaps a wake up call, who knows?

In any case, it's nothing unexpected. Restoring the pre-Vatican II church is more of a chimera of a few devoted faithful than the actual reality as it is.
DISPOSE OUR DAYS IN THY PEACE, AND COMMAND US TO BE DELIVERED FROM ETERNAL DAMNATION, AND TO BE NUMBERED IN THE FLOCK OF THINE ELECT.
 

Offline Gottmitunsalex

  • "As the head of the Church, I cannot answer you otherwise: The Jews have not recognized Our Lord; therefore we cannot recognize the Jewish people." ---Pope St. Pius X
  • Feldwebel
  • ***
  • Posts: 2143
  • Thanked: 24 times
  • Magister Generalis - Hochmeister
    • My position.
  • Religion: römisch-katholisch
Re: As Jewish Leaders Meet With Pope, New Hopes On Pius XII Archives
« Reply #2 on: March 21, 2013, 12:47:35 AM »
It looks to me that instead of cleaning house of blackmailed, homosexual Cardinals, Bishops and priests, the Pope will be "investigating" Pope Pius XII. 

The Vatican may be about to turn Catholic attention exclusively to Jewish concerns.  The public will be distracted by a re-hash of those old newsreels of the Holocaust and Hitler and Mussolini while the queers go on their merry way.

The homosexual pedophile scandal can just "go away" any time that the media decides to stop reporting on it   

The blackmailers don't want that dealt with.  So I think there's a good chance that media will give Bergoglio a long "honeymoon" and lay off the sex scandals for a while, and shift the attention to the Holocaust. and the dead pope Pius XII.

Are the blackmailers the Jews? And did they just get their payment in the election of Pope Francis with a promise to make the Vatican Archives new History, or is that Hitler Channel?

I think we will have our answer if the story on the homosexual curia goes away, no major house cleaning takes place and the Pius XII gets raked over the coals.

Is this the real reason Ratzinger quit? That they were going to force him to open the Archives on Pius XII and he thought he would hand the job over to a younger and stronger man. Perhaps one who is really friendly with the blackmailers?

As Jewish Leaders Meet With Pope, New Hopes On Pius XII Archives

Argentine rabbi says Pope Francis wants ‘to learn the truth’ of Pius’ role during Holocaust.


The last Catholic bishop who told the truth about the "Holocaust" got kicked out of Argentina....
Go figure
« Last Edit: March 21, 2013, 01:01:03 AM by Gottmitunsalex »
"Nothing is more miserable than those people who never failed to attack their own salvation. When there was need to observe the Law, they trampled it under foot. Now that the Law has ceased to bind, they obstinately strive to observe it. What could be more pitiable that those who provoke God not only by transgressing the Law but also by keeping it? But at any rate the Jews say that they, too, adore God. God forbid that I say that. No Jew adores God! Who say so? The Son of God say so. For he said: "If you were to know my Father, you would also know me. But you neither know me nor do you know my Father". Could I produce a witness more trustworthy than the Son of God?"  St. John Chrysostom  Sunday Homily

"The two goals of the Jews: The universal domination of the world and the destruction of Catholicism, out of hatred for Christ" --Mgr. Jouin
 

Offline Bonaventure

  • Oberstleutnant
  • Hauptmann
  • *****
  • Posts: 9063
  • Thanked: 1713 times
  • Religion: Roman Catholic
Re: As Jewish Leaders Meet With Pope, New Hopes On Pius XII Archives
« Reply #3 on: March 21, 2013, 01:13:58 AM »
All of this, of course, is bad news for traditional Catholicism. Perhaps a wake up call, who knows?

Only a false sign from Satan.

Quote
In any case, it's nothing unexpected. Restoring the pre-Vatican II church is more of a chimera of a few devoted faithful than the actual reality as it is.

Oh? The reality of one man's amorphous system of beliefs?
 

Offline Innocent Smith

  • Wachtmeister
  • ***
  • Posts: 1425
  • Thanked: 849 times
  • Religion: Roman Catholic
Re: As Jewish Leaders Meet With Pope, New Hopes On Pius XII Archives
« Reply #4 on: March 21, 2013, 10:06:17 AM »
It looks to me that instead of cleaning house of blackmailed, homosexual Cardinals, Bishops and priests, the Pope will be "investigating" Pope Pius XII. 

The Vatican may be about to turn Catholic attention exclusively to Jewish concerns.  The public will be distracted by a re-hash of those old newsreels of the Holocaust and Hitler and Mussolini while the queers go on their merry way.

The homosexual pedophile scandal can just "go away" any time that the media decides to stop reporting on it   

The blackmailers don't want that dealt with.  So I think there's a good chance that media will give Bergoglio a long "honeymoon" and lay off the sex scandals for a while, and shift the attention to the Holocaust. and the dead pope Pius XII.

Are the blackmailers the Jews? And did they just get their payment in the election of Pope Francis with a promise to make the Vatican Archives new History, or is that Hitler Channel?

I think we will have our answer if the story on the homosexual curia goes away, no major house cleaning takes place and the Pius XII gets raked over the coals.

Is this the real reason Ratzinger quit? That they were going to force him to open the Archives on Pius XII and he thought he would hand the job over to a younger and stronger man. Perhaps one who is really friendly with the blackmailers?

As Jewish Leaders Meet With Pope, New Hopes On Pius XII Archives

Argentine rabbi says Pope Francis wants ‘to learn the truth’ of Pius’ role during Holocaust.


The last Catholic bishop who told the truth about the "Holocaust" got kicked out of Argentina....
Go figure

Good point. And he was also thrown under the bus by Benedict and Fellay.

As an aside what was +Williamson doing there? In all the hullabaloo I don't recall. Was he running a seminary down there?

Either way, I recommend reading the article from the link I provided as it is very long. And I forgot to mention it is from The Jewish Week a publication out of New York.

You let these people in at these archives concerning Pope Pius XII, of happy memory, you will soon have them going through everything and making the case of a persecuted people at the hands of the Church throughout Her history. It will be never ending. And it would be the biggest prize for propaganda efforts ever.

And who knows if "reparations" would be forthcoming. I'm sure it does come down to dollars and cents, pounds, and pence, and Swiss Franks in the long run.

The holocaust jig may be up and they may well be in need of some new material. Or to add confusion to the mix and keep it alive.

Of course we all know what is evil and the biggest problem is our bishops and Churchmen not preaching about what we must do and what we must not do. And this is the disease of modernism. And so we have the antidote  if only we would live up to it. So in the end, this moving in the wrong trajectory concerning the truth is mostly a problem of our own making. 

But it is true also that Jewish Naturalism is always there to tempt us away from what we must do and how we must live, and they may have indeed penetrated to the highest levels of the Church.

Starting to look that way and it would not be very difficult to engineer this kind of penetration.

We may have another clue form Benedict's last public statements. He said Vatican II was a "Media Council". That is where it went astray, says our Pope Emeritus. Because he is still defending the Council. But, let's forget that fact temporarily as it is a distraction. Who owns the media? He seems to be talking in code.

But what does Benedict the Quitter do? He resigns and let's the media define his resignation and this Conclave and the Installation of this new Pope. During Lent and now we are in Passiontide about to enter Holy Week.

Last thing I want to mention is that in the article the Jews are very happy about having such dignity in there seats for the Papal Inauguration and that the Jewish people were mentioned specifically in Francis' homily. I also noticed at the end of the Inaugural Mass that there was signage prominent that spelled out the words "Shalom". It was brief and they cut away from it quickly on the live feed that everyone seemed to receive worldwide.

It is time for Unity within the Church instead of Dialogue with Her enemies. It was looking to go that way, but looks to me that the Jews played their Trump Card here.

So you think the new Good Friday prayer was bad? I think I can safely say, you ain't seen nothing yet.

I am going to hold a pistol to the head of the modern man. But I shall not use it to kill him, only to bring him to life.
 

Online Greg

  • St. Joseph's Workbench
  • Major
  • ****
  • Posts: 14774
  • Thanked: 9853 times
Re: As Jewish Leaders Meet With Pope, New Hopes On Pius XII Archives
« Reply #5 on: March 21, 2013, 10:26:48 AM »
And he was also thrown under the bus by Benedict and Fellay.

I wonder if Cardinal Bergoglio was riding on that bus. ;)
 

Offline Innocent Smith

  • Wachtmeister
  • ***
  • Posts: 1425
  • Thanked: 849 times
  • Religion: Roman Catholic
Re: As Jewish Leaders Meet With Pope, New Hopes On Pius XII Archives
« Reply #6 on: March 21, 2013, 10:28:18 AM »
Oh yes, I forgot to mention one other thing that is connected to this that is bothering me.

I did watch the Hitler video where he protests the election. It was somewhat humorous, but now I must ask myself why that appeared.

Is it part of a Black or Psychological Operation? Are Trads some kind of Nazis? Are we to look at love of Liturgy and doing what is in Red and saying what is in Black as some kind of Goose Stepping? Is wanting a High Mass equivalent to the detail involved in a Nazi Rally like the famous one at Nuremberg?

Pope Benedict is of German descent and was a member of the Hitler Youth. We all know the stories.

Don't think the Trad Movement, if you want to call it that wants to be hitching their wagons to Hitler's star.

Just saying.
I am going to hold a pistol to the head of the modern man. But I shall not use it to kill him, only to bring him to life.
 

Offline Magnificat

  • Vizekorporal
  • **
  • Posts: 150
  • Thanked: 5 times
Re: As Jewish Leaders Meet With Pope, New Hopes On Pius XII Archives
« Reply #7 on: March 21, 2013, 11:51:15 AM »
As Jewish Leaders Meet With Pope, New Hopes On Pius XII Archives
Quote
Rabbi Skorka was in Buenos Aires this week and did not attend the inauguration, but he said he received a private call from Pope Francis Monday evening, “a couple hours before the ceremony in which he was crowned as pope.”

I can relate to this. A couple of hours before my wedding ceremony, all I could think about were my exes and when I'd be able to see them again.








:o :P


Seriously, who occupies themselves with calling Jewish leaders a couple of hours before their Papal coronation? How on earth is that what's consuming your thoughts? To the point that you HAVE to call a meeting right then for the next day? If it takes an overly-critical, bitter trad to think that is very, very off, call me an overly-critical bitter trad.

Meeting with Jewish leaders doesn't surprise me, that was expected. But the time before such an event is so deep and monumental and defining that spending it this way just knocks your reason off its seat for a minute.

And how bold. They're not even going to deign to try and put on a show of Faith. It's blatant politics and modern definitions of "spiritual". "Spiritual leadership". Yeah, we all know what that means. Absolutely nothing. Everyone and their dog is "spiritual" these days. Modernists have a completely different meaning for the word than we do. It's why so many well-intentioned people get sucked in. They've high jacked our vocabulary. When a modernist speaks of God, of the Devil, of spiritual life, the well-intentioned person processes it using their own orthodox understanding. And they've been so trained that they cannot, under any circumstances, judge another's actions, that they cannot recognize by the modernist's actions, that the meaning of their words is different. It's a completely alternate reality that mimics the Faith as closely as possible to fool as many as possible and even make those who see the glitches question their own sanity. Absolutely diabolical. These times call for truly heroic Faith and courage.       
 

Offline Guapo

  • Feldwebel
  • ***
  • Posts: 1700
  • Thanked: 229 times
  • Religion: Trad!
Re: As Jewish Leaders Meet With Pope, New Hopes On Pius XII Archives
« Reply #8 on: March 21, 2013, 12:08:20 PM »

Blessing in Disguise???

    http://www.veteranstoday.com/2013/02/13/intel-dump-wednesday-february-13-2012/

    According to Gordon Duff, the reason for this resignation is because the Pope was going to open the Vatican Archives.  In the process, the version of the holocaust that is taught would have come to an end.




http://www.veteranstoday.com/2013/02/17/the-vatican-and-the-german-holocaust-video/

Powerful factions outside the Vatican DO NOT WANT THEM OPEN. Please try to understand this.

 

Offline MilesChristi

  • St. Joseph's Workbench
  • Feldwebel
  • ***
  • Posts: 3845
  • Thanked: 909 times
  • Santiago Matamoros, Ora pro Nobis
  • Religion: Catholic
Re: As Jewish Leaders Meet With Pope, New Hopes On Pius XII Archives
« Reply #9 on: March 21, 2013, 12:21:52 PM »
I want to believe this is true, but then, why would the Jews want them open?

Naivete that their story truly is true, or that they truly want to know the truth
The world is charged with the grandeur of God.
    It will flame out, like shining from shook foil;
    It gathers to a greatness, like the ooze of oil
Crushed. Why do men then now not reck his rod?
Generations have trod, have trod, have trod;
    And all is seared with trade; bleared, smeared with toil;
    And wears man's smudge and shares man's smell: the soil
Is bare now, nor can foot feel, being shod.

And for all this, nature is never spent;
    There lives the dearest freshness deep down things;
And though the last lights off the black West went
    Oh, morning, at the brown brink eastward, springs —
Because the Holy Ghost over the bent
    World broods with warm breast and with ah! bright wings.
 

Offline Gerard

  • Feldwebel
  • ***
  • Posts: 4355
  • Thanked: 1897 times
  • .. and his raiment became white and glittering
Re: As Jewish Leaders Meet With Pope, New Hopes On Pius XII Archives
« Reply #10 on: March 21, 2013, 12:27:38 PM »

Blessing in Disguise???

    http://www.veteranstoday.com/2013/02/13/intel-dump-wednesday-february-13-2012/

    According to Gordon Duff, the reason for this resignation is because the Pope was going to open the Vatican Archives.  In the process, the version of the holocaust that is taught would have come to an end.




http://www.veteranstoday.com/2013/02/17/the-vatican-and-the-german-holocaust-video/

Powerful factions outside the Vatican DO NOT WANT THEM OPEN. Please try to understand this.


Are you sure about the quality of those articles?

This jumped out concerning Bp Williamson: 

Quote
Though Williamson was not in Germany, his broadcast was played in Germany and he was extradited and prosecuted for committing the crime of “illegal speech” that, though it wasn’t perpetrated in Germany, it was “heard” there.
Insane?
Where did Williamson’s ideas come from?  Williamson, a “prince of the church,” had access to the Vatican archives. They contain the most extensive archives on World War II in the world today, including materials capable of bringing down the oligarchical power that so many today serve, the very real Kingdom of Satan on earth today.
When you hear America called “the great Satan,” it isn’t the joke some might think.
Ratzinger saw the Williamson humiliation as the ”last straw.”  He was going to open the Vatican Archives. In the process, the version of the holocaust that is taught would have come to an end.

Bp. Williamson is not "cloak and dagger." If his source for his opinions was Vatican archives, he would have said so.  I think he got his ideas from the usual small group of revisionists that are constantly reviled.

 

Offline Guapo

  • Feldwebel
  • ***
  • Posts: 1700
  • Thanked: 229 times
  • Religion: Trad!
Re: As Jewish Leaders Meet With Pope, New Hopes On Pius XII Archives
« Reply #11 on: March 21, 2013, 03:26:54 PM »
Gerard, Duff is ex seeeeyeaaaa.  A standard ploy is to use disinformation with real intel. So you may get 80 percent nonsense, but 20 percent a diamond of intel.   In this case, do i know for certain? No

(Malachi Martin used this "faction" in his books as well)
Putting aside H.E. and the big H. thing.

According to Msgr George Kelly (one of his books) he states that after WW2 they wanted to make Germany into a parking lot, just flatten the whole thing, no cities, nothing...Cardinal Spellman (not my favorite) stopped them from doing a Carthage on Germany. I tend to believe this story. The destruction and genocide of Germany and Japan was that both would be an impediment to the N.W.O.
Neither Germans nor the Japanese would accept and would hinder control, both  were purposely taken down. WW2 was ALL smoke and mirrors.  I am not condoning with what either did, but there is a whooooooooole more to the so called history books and i am just scratching the surface.

In Vet. Today, a German journalist immediately saw what happened to Benedict, it appears that video is now gone.
I contend Benedict was forced out because he tried to reform the IOR; don't screw with the Rotshchilds money is the message and this is what these secular German video pointed out with evidence. So the bottom line, is they wanted to destroy patriotism, nationalism and hope of these nations and they did.  It was genocide of the German people.  This must have burned in the soul of Benedict to carry such a burden and not to be able do anything about it.
« Last Edit: March 21, 2013, 04:00:27 PM by Guapo »
 

Offline Guapo

  • Feldwebel
  • ***
  • Posts: 1700
  • Thanked: 229 times
  • Religion: Trad!
Re: As Jewish Leaders Meet With Pope, New Hopes On Pius XII Archives
« Reply #12 on: March 21, 2013, 03:30:41 PM »
I want to believe this is true, but then, why would the Jews want them open?

Naivete that their story truly is true, or that they truly want to know the truth
Good q. important to make distinctions. Zionism is not Judaism and that many factions reside in  Judaism.  Not all
are the ADL type, thank God.  Some do want the truth to come out but more powerful forces are at work.
 

Offline Gerard

  • Feldwebel
  • ***
  • Posts: 4355
  • Thanked: 1897 times
  • .. and his raiment became white and glittering
Re: As Jewish Leaders Meet With Pope, New Hopes On Pius XII Archives
« Reply #13 on: March 21, 2013, 06:12:59 PM »
Gerard, Duff is ex seeeeyeaaaa. 

I don't know about that. If he claims he's "ex-CIA" that means he's currently CIA and he's not spilling any beans or it means he was never CIA to begin with.   

Anybody familiar with Malachi Martin knows that the emphasis since the early 1990s and before has been to force Popes to resign.  Windswept House is all about trying to force JPII to resign.

Kung was part of this movement and so was Ratzinger. 

Ratzinger was simply fulfilling the changing of the papacy according to that "Kung vision." 

There may be secular politics involved whether it be greed or political influence, but above all of that is the spiritual agenda. 

We know the Curia is corrupt.  But we've got a Pope who is no better who is more than likely going to exert the anti-papal Jesuit line and dismantle the power of the papacy and regionalize the Church. 

The idea the Pope Benedict is the "good guy" is ridiculous.  It's recycled "John Paul II is trapped in the Vatican" which was fed to us way too much.
 
The following users thanked this post: Malaichi

Offline Innocent Smith

  • Wachtmeister
  • ***
  • Posts: 1425
  • Thanked: 849 times
  • Religion: Roman Catholic
Re: As Jewish Leaders Meet With Pope, New Hopes On Pius XII Archives
« Reply #14 on: March 22, 2013, 02:13:56 PM »
I want to believe this is true, but then, why would the Jews want them open?

Naivete that their story truly is true, or that they truly want to know the truth

Gordon Duff has admitted to telling 40% B.S. So I don't believe that Ratzinger was going to open the archives. He is obviously somehow beholden to the Jews as was JPII.

Just like Ratzinger was going to open this 300 page report, but now is leaving it only to the pope in a safe.

I can't tell you how many conspiracy theories end with "he was going to open the lid on something, but was then killed, or forced to resign or whatever".

Like I said earlier, they may want to go on a fishing expedition that begins with looking into Pius XII.

Also, they can make anything look like anything. Show one document and withhold part of it, or a different one, and you've got Pius XII lighting the Pontius Pilot Lights to the ovens.

I think the Jews desperately want access to all the Vatican Archives. An ongoing search of them makes the Church guilty in the eyes of the majority right off the bat.

Recent sex scandals. This ridiculous idea that more people have died in the name of God through war etc, all point to that reality and how it would be perceived. In fact, it would be more exciting for the world than waiting for white smoke.

You really want Jews to go into the Vatican Archives, read the data and then render a judgement on Holy Mother Church.

You might want to think that one over a bit.

I am going to hold a pistol to the head of the modern man. But I shall not use it to kill him, only to bring him to life.