Rorate launches "A Call for Unity"

Started by ADMG, January 19, 2014, 05:13:59 PM

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Kaesekopf

Quote from: Elizabeth on January 20, 2014, 11:41:58 AM
I pray for an end to backbiting and the spirit of superiority between various factions.  When you get to be as old as I am, it's just depressing beyond belief.

I'm mid20s and a 'tradvert' and it depresses me.
Wie dein Sonntag, so dein Sterbetag.

I am not altogether on anybody's side, because nobody is altogether on my side.  ~Treebeard, LOTR

Jesus son of David, have mercy on me.

LouisIX

IF I speak with the tongues of men, and of angels, and have not charity, I am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal.
IF I speak with the tongues of men, and of angels, and have not charity, I am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal.

Kaesekopf

But until everyone agrees with me, LouisIX, I will continue to fight against them, to slander and smear them, to take down their affiliation and themselves in any way I can.

To do otherwise would be to not be the truest trad!
Wie dein Sonntag, so dein Sterbetag.

I am not altogether on anybody's side, because nobody is altogether on my side.  ~Treebeard, LOTR

Jesus son of David, have mercy on me.

LouisIX

The truest trad is the one who does not make charity the enemy of truth nor the one who makes them out to be substantially the same thing.
IF I speak with the tongues of men, and of angels, and have not charity, I am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal.

Kaesekopf

Quote from: LouisIX on January 20, 2014, 01:32:23 PM
The truest trad is the one who does not make charity the enemy of truth nor the one who makes them out to be substantially the same thing.

This is clearly modernism.
Wie dein Sonntag, so dein Sterbetag.

I am not altogether on anybody's side, because nobody is altogether on my side.  ~Treebeard, LOTR

Jesus son of David, have mercy on me.

Irenaeus G. Saintonge

Quote from: LouisIX on January 20, 2014, 01:32:23 PM
The truest trad is the one who does not make charity the enemy of truth nor the one who makes them out to be substantially the same thing.

Do you mind clarifying for me what you mean by the last part?
"This is that disciple who giveth testimony of these things, and hath written these things; and we know that his testimony is true. "
Jn:21:24

????????????

LouisIX

Quote from: Irenaeus G. Saintonge on January 20, 2014, 07:11:49 PM
Quote from: LouisIX on January 20, 2014, 01:32:23 PM
The truest trad is the one who does not make charity the enemy of truth nor the one who makes them out to be substantially the same thing.

Do you mind clarifying for me what you mean by the last part?

I mean those who claim that any instantiation of the truth is charitable such that there is no such thing as prudence or tact.  To blurt out what is substantially true even in the most brutish, impatient, or spiteful way is true charity merely because of the content.  But as Saint Paul tells us, there is a way to speak the truth in charity and there is a way to speak the truth not in charity.
IF I speak with the tongues of men, and of angels, and have not charity, I am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal.

nmoerbeek

The problem is sin.  If a person views what another is doing as sinful then he should not  cooperate or approve of it.  The next questions comes down to whether or not we should engage in correction of the individual or debate for the sake of preserving others from a similar sin.

"Let me, however, beg of Your Beatitude...
not to think so much of what I have written, as of my good and kind intentions. Please look for the truths of which I speak rather than for beauty of expression. Where I do not come up to your expectations, pardon me, and put my shortcomings down, please, to lack of time and stress of business." St. Bonaventure, From the Preface of Holiness of Life.

Apostolate:
http://www.alleluiaaudiobooks.com/
Contributor:
http://unamsanctamcatholicam.blogspot.com/
Lay Association:
http://www.militiatempli.net/

Irenaeus G. Saintonge

Quote from: LouisIX on January 20, 2014, 07:19:13 PM
Quote from: Irenaeus G. Saintonge on January 20, 2014, 07:11:49 PM
Quote from: LouisIX on January 20, 2014, 01:32:23 PM
The truest trad is the one who does not make charity the enemy of truth nor the one who makes them out to be substantially the same thing.

Do you mind clarifying for me what you mean by the last part?

I mean those who claim that any instantiation of the truth is charitable such that there is no such thing as prudence or tact.  To blurt out what is substantially true even in the most brutish, impatient, or spiteful way is true charity merely because of the content.  But as Saint Paul tells us, there is a way to speak the truth in charity and there is a way to speak the truth not in charity.

Ah, thanks. I was hoping that was what you meant. :D Would be possible to interpret what you said to mean that it would be impossible to be uncharitable if one is simply saying what is true.
"This is that disciple who giveth testimony of these things, and hath written these things; and we know that his testimony is true. "
Jn:21:24

????????????

Der Kaiser

Just as diocesan trads would have a hard time uniting with a sede, I as a sede would have a hard time uniting with them. How can we ever unite when many in the FSSP simply like the pretty old Mass, but think the new is just as valid? Or that the hierachy, yes even the Pope, is not just part of the problem, but 90% of it. To go to a Mass that is celebrated in the traditional rite and have the Priest pray for "The Pope" who is trying to destroy the very rite being celebrated strikes me as a little strange. I went to one Diocesan TLM back in college and there was a huge "JPII we love you" ultramontane crowed there. Come on people wake up.
"If a Pope changes the rites of the sacraments he puts himself outside the Church and is Anathema"-Pope Innocent III

"Rome will lose the faith and become the seat of Anti-Christ"-Our Lady of La Sallette

The hebrews have not recognized the lord, therefore we can not recognize the hebrews.-St Pius X

Gerard

I think it might be that Our Lady is the only uniting force among traditionalists.  There is no 1962 vs. 1955 version of Our Lady.  You don't have to follow apparitions or be a Fatimist to be devoted to her and if enough people seek her help, she'll give it, whether it is through a consecration or some other action. 

Bonaventure

Quote from: Gerard on January 21, 2014, 12:49:55 AM
I think it might be that Our Lady is the only uniting force among traditionalists.  There is no 1962 vs. 1955 version of Our Lady.  You don't have to follow apparitions or be a Fatimist to be devoted to her and if enough people seek her help, she'll give it, whether it is through a consecration or some other action.

Great post.
"If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me."

totiusque

Quote from: Gerard on January 21, 2014, 12:49:55 AM
I think it might be that Our Lady is the only uniting force among traditionalists.  There is no 1962 vs. 1955 version of Our Lady.  You don't have to follow apparitions or be a Fatimist to be devoted to her and if enough people seek her help, she'll give it, whether it is through a consecration or some other action.

Well said.

Quote from: Der Kaiser on January 21, 2014, 12:42:56 AM
To go to a Mass that is celebrated in the traditional rite and have the Priest pray for "The Pope" who is trying to destroy the very rite being celebrated strikes me as a little strange.

Actually, I'd argue that a Pope who is trying to destroy the traditional rite is the one who needs the most prayers.  I pray for Pope Francis daily, not because he does everything I want him to, but because he generally does quite the opposite.  And there is no stronger prayer than the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass.
"Whenever anything disagreeable or displeasing happens to you, remember Christ crucified and be silent."
—St John of the Cross

nmoerbeek

Quote from: Gerard on January 21, 2014, 12:49:55 AM
I think it might be that Our Lady is the only uniting force among traditionalists.  There is no 1962 vs. 1955 version of Our Lady.  You don't have to follow apparitions or be a Fatimist to be devoted to her and if enough people seek her help, she'll give it, whether it is through a consecration or some other action.

Our Lady unites more than just Trads, Pope Leo XIII alluded to the idea of devotion to the Mother of God uniting eastern schismatics and the Church as well in his encylical ADIUTRICEM you can listen to it here: http://www.alleluiaaudiobooks.com/catholic-audiobook-the-holy-rosary-remedy-against-modern-evils/ and I have not encountered amongst the devout who attend the NO a lack of marian devotion.


"Let me, however, beg of Your Beatitude...
not to think so much of what I have written, as of my good and kind intentions. Please look for the truths of which I speak rather than for beauty of expression. Where I do not come up to your expectations, pardon me, and put my shortcomings down, please, to lack of time and stress of business." St. Bonaventure, From the Preface of Holiness of Life.

Apostolate:
http://www.alleluiaaudiobooks.com/
Contributor:
http://unamsanctamcatholicam.blogspot.com/
Lay Association:
http://www.militiatempli.net/

Older Salt

Quote from: Godfrey of Bouillon on January 19, 2014, 08:04:35 PM
Total fluff piece. This explains the division a bit better....


http://m.youtube.com/index?&desktop_uri=%2F
I clicked on this link and was confronted with some 'Vampire" fluff.
Stay away from the near occasion of sin

Unless one is deeply attached to the Blessed Virgin Mary, now in time, it impossible to attain salvation.