Already PM'd the King about this, but wanted to get your guys' input too.
Mrs Laus To Be and I want to be wed on a 2nd class feast day. Old manuals stipulate no nuptials on this day, but as HK put it this is akin to the communion fast from midnight - was the tradition but has gone to the way side. Any thoughts for or against?
Additionally - even if we're not allowed a nuptial Mass, we can still marry and have the nuptial blessing in the context of the Mass of that day, correct?
To be more specific, I believe it was the rubrical revisions of 1960 which elevated the rank of votive nuptial Masses. If you look at early 20th century texts, they'll say the nuptial Mass has no Gloria. But the Gloria was prescribed from 1960 on.
See the 1960 Rubricae Generales: http://divinumofficium.com/www/horas/Help/Rubrics/Missal1960%20rubrics.html
QuoteI - Votive Masses of the 2nd Class in General
341. By a votive Mass of the 2nd class is meant a votive Mass which may be celebrated on all liturgical days of the 2nd , 3rd and 4th class. The Mass for bride and bridegroom and the Mass of thanksgiving on the 25th or 50th wedding anniversary are prohibited, however, on all Sundays.
342. Votive Masses of the 2nd class, provided for by the general rubrics, are:
a) the Mass at the solemn blessing of a church or oratory, and at the consecration of an altar (no. 345);
b) the Mass of the rogations on the greater and lesser litanies (nos 346-347); c) votive Masses on the occasion of the Forty Hours devotion or some other exposition of the Blessed Sacrament (nos. 348-355);
d) Masses of the external solemnity of feasts (nos. 356-361);
e) The Mass on the day of the coronation of the pope and on the anniversaries of the pope and of the diocesan bishop (nos. 362-365);
f) A Mass for a matter of public importance (pro re gravi et publica simul causa) (nos. 366-368);
g) The Mass “for the propagation of the Faith†(no. 369);
h) Masses on certain special occasions (nos. 370-372);
i) Votive Masses at shrines (nos. 373-377);
j) The votive Mass “for Bride and Bridegroom†and the Mass of thanksgiving on the 25th and 50th wedding anniversary (nos. 378-382).
343. The privileges of votive Masses of the 2nd class are:
a) they are said Gloria, unless violet vestments are used; but without creed, unless it is said by reason of an occurring Sunday or octave;
b) they admit of only one commemoration, and they exclude a collect ordered by the local ordinary;
c) the collect of the impeded votive Mass is added under a single conclusion to the collect of the Mass of the day, provided a day listed under nos. 1, 2, 3 and 8 in the table of precedence does not occur; the prescription at no. 380 is observed, however;
d) if they are sung , the solemn tone is used.
And:
QuoteXI - The Votive Mass “For Bride and Bridegroom†and the Mass of Thanksgiving on the 25th and 50th Wedding Anniversary
378. The votive Mass “For Bride and Bridegroom,†or at least its collect in the Mass of the day which impedes it, is permitted whenever a wedding is celebrated, whether outside of the closed time or even in the closed time, if the local ordinary for a good reason has permitted the solemn nuptial blessing.
379. Besides the days on which votive Masses of the 2nd class are prohibited, the Mass “For Bride and Bridegroom†is prohibited also on Sundays and whenever, according to no. 381c, the nuptial blessing cannot be given.
380. Whenever the Mass “For Bride and Bridegroom,†but not the nuptial blessing, is prohibited, the Mass of the office of the day is said, and to its collect is added under a single conclusion the collect of the impeded votive Mass, even on those days on which, according to no. 343c, a commemoration of an impeded votive Mass of the 2nd class is prohibited; and the nuptial blessing is given in the usual way in the Mass of the day.
But when both the Mass “For the Bride and Bridegroom†and the nuptial blessing are prohibited, the Mass together with the blessing may be transferred to a timely unimpeded day, after the marriage has been celebrated.
381. With regard to the Mass “For the Bride and Bridegroom†and the nuptial blessing, these points shall also be observed:
a) The nuptial blessing is inseparable from the Mass. Hence, it cannot be given outside of the Mass, unless by apostolic indult; in which case it is to be imparted according to the formula which is found in the Roman ritual, tit. 8, ch. 3;
b) The nuptial blessing within the Mass must be given by the priest who is celebrating the Mass, even if another priest has presided over the marriage;
c) The nuptial blessing is omitted if the spouses are not present; and it is omitted if both of them or one of them has already received the blessing. Wherever the custom prevails, however, of imparting the blessing if only the man has received it, that custom may be retained;
d) On the commemoration of All the Faithful Departed and during the sacred triduum, the votive Mass and its commemoration in the Mass of the day and the nuptial blessing within the Mass are all prohibited.
382. For thanksgiving on the 25th or 50th wedding anniversary, either the Mass of the Most Holy Trinity or a Mass of the Blessed Virgin Mary may be said as a votive Mass of the 2nd class, the collect for thanksgiving being added under a single conclusion with the first collect.
After the Mass, the prayers found in the Roman ritual tit. 8, ch. 7, are said over the couple.
Of course, if you want to go old-school and have Mass of the feast instead, that's also an option. But I think, especially if you have a lot of guests who have never been to a TLM before, the votive nuptial Mass is the better choice.
I'm all for old school. I'm putting a lock and chain on the organ so I don't gotta listen to that trash.
I don't have any liturgical knowledge to add to the thread. I just want to express my joy in reading it. :cheeseheadbeer:
Quote from: LausTibiChriste on April 20, 2018, 10:06:57 AM
I'm all for old school. I'm putting a lock and chain on the organ so I don't gotta listen to that trash.
I would further advise outfitting all the servers in huge billowy English surplices and giving all the major ministers real tonsures.
Well, from the time of Pope Benedict XV (i.e. the implementation of St Pius X's
Divino afflatu) until the 1960 revisions, the rubrics would call for the Mass of the 2nd Class feast, with the commemoration of the Nuptial Mass
sub unica conclusione cum prima, and with the Nuptial Blessing after the Pater Noster and after the Ite, Missa est included (cf.
Additiones et Variationes in Rubricis Missalis, II, 2).
The actual Tridentine rubrics don't really say anything directly about the Nuptial Mass, but in effect would be the same as the
Divino afflatu revision.
Quote from: The Harlequin King on April 20, 2018, 10:05:18 AM
Of course, if you want to go old-school and have Mass of the feast instead, that's also an option. But I think, especially if you have a lot of guests who have never been to a TLM before, the votive nuptial Mass is the better choice.
That is certainly a point to consider.
Quote from: LausTibiChriste on April 20, 2018, 09:47:33 AM
Already PM'd the King about this, but wanted to get your guys' input too.
Mrs Laus To Be and I want to be wed on a 2nd class feast day. Old manuals stipulate no nuptials on this day, but as HK put it this is akin to the communion fast from midnight - was the tradition but has gone to the way side. Any thoughts for or against?
Additionally - even if we're not allowed a nuptial Mass, we can still marry and have the nuptial blessing in the context of the Mass of that day, correct?
Congratulations
I was at a wedding not too long ago held on Dec 27th.
The Mass was the Mass of St. John the Evangelist.
The wedding ceremony was performed, and the nuptial blessing was given. But the readings were those of the day.
Why don't you just ask your priest? :huh: