I'm in need of advice from those of you who have been through helping your young adult children discern who a good future partner would be. I have a young adult daughter who has met a man that's 3
years away from graduating college and will be joining the military afterwards. He seems very nice but there are some things that worry me. He's a Catholic but a regular NO Catholic and I don't think he's ever been to the TLM. My daughter really likes him a lot, but she's very modest and devout, and I'm not sure he's the same. He mentioned the fact he watches some rated R movies that I would absolutely forbid my kids from watching. I worry about if she were to marry him they would fight a lot because she was raised with traditional Catholic values and he was raised with modern Catholic values. I think she believes she can be a good influence on him.
So my question is: how much input do I have about this? She's an adult who lives at home but I also don't want to be so pushy she leaves and makes a horrible marriage choice she'll never be able to get out of.
1) According to Fr Ripperger you have almost 0 input, you can only advise. But she is under 0 obligation to listen to you (up to a point)
2) This is the definition of Trad scruples. You mentioned he occasionally watches an R rated movie... But have no fears about him joining the military? You got it backwards lady. I would be MUCH more worried about him joining the military than watching James Bond for example
Instead of whinging on a forum how about hanging out with him more? If he's an honest Catholic, albeit modern, he'll be easy to sway.... If you're not scrupulous so better leave it to your daughter tbh.
How many times do Trads not realize that just because modern Catholics don't see what we see, doesn't mean they're inherently bad. Some are, sure, but a lot ofnus started as NOers and were honest, which is why we are where we are... Ao if he's honest bring him here too.
If he's CINO then you have problems. Binding prayers will help.
I'm worried about both actually. Thanks for the input
I watch R rated movies myself. All the time.
I guess I should specify as there are some R rated movies I let my kids see such as Passion of the Christ and we did watch Silence as a family... but the kind of movies I forbid are ones that show sexual nudity, porn, blasphemy, f-words, gory unnecessary violence. Regular violence doesn't concern me. I've even let them see Braveheart and Gladiator with filters and fast forwarding
Quote from: TandJ on September 21, 2021, 01:51:43 AM
I worry about if she were to marry him they would fight a lot because she was raised with traditional Catholic values and he was raised with modern Catholic values.
Most "Catholics" aren't Catholic. Does he go to Mass on every Sunday and every Holy Day? Does he pray daily? Will he wait for marriage? Will he forego all forms of contraception and joyfully raise as many children as God gives him?
Does he get drunk? Does he vote Democrat? These R-rated movies you mention--why are they rated R? Do they have sex and nudity? It's possible to simulate violence, but it's not possible to simulate immodesty, and every violation of the 6th and 9th commandments is grave.
I have lived through a situation somewhat like this, but I'm the daughter.
My parents really didn't want me to get married at 21 to the tall, handsome former seminarian who had a poorly paying job with the Catholic diocese. And when I say "really," I mean "REALLY." They called our engagement disrespectful to their wishes, refused to have any kind of polite conversation with my fiance after the engagement, met with the priest who was doing our marriage prep and (from our best guesses) tried to pay him off to keep him from signing off on our completion of the course. It got to the point that they were at my apartment two weeks before the wedding STILL trying to persuade me to call it off. They attended the wedding, but didn't speak to us. My parents hardly talk to me at all now. I've gone to one dinner with my extended family since marriage and my husband was not allowed to come. We have a young daughter whom my parents haven't met because I'm unwilling to sweep their past behaviour and treatment of my husband under the rug.
What I'm trying to say is this: don't burn the bridge if you can help it.
The NO Catholic thing can be helped. Ask your daughter if she wants to bring him along to Mass and then hang out with the family afterwards (my family wanted nothing to do with my husband when we were first dating and it led to some of the future issues). If he's worth her time, he'll likely see the goodness of the TLM and stick around. Hopefully he'll develop some devotional practices. If it disturbs him and he can't stand it, I think your daughter will see that he's not worth the drama. If she's as devout as you say, I think she'll be able to hold her own. Keep lines of communication open with her, I beg you. If every conversation turns into nagging her about dropping the boyfriend (which happened with my mom), you're going to lose her.
Marriage is a big deal; does she understand the gravity of that?
Like Chairman, I've got some concerns about the R-rated films. Perhaps ask your daughter if she has talked to him about it. It would be worthwhile for them to have that conversation on their own and for her to ask what kind of films they are, why he enjoys them, whether she would also have to watch them with him, etc. If there's a lot of sex/nudity, I would be worried about a potential porn addiction...
Good judgement is just that. You either got it or you ain't. There are no perfect spouses. In the end you have to ask, will they both make an effort to make it work? Could your daughter do a lot better? If so, why does she not believe that?
I have seen parents crying and making a fuss at weddings because their precious child they spent 100k on the STEM education for, decided to marry and live a much simpler lifestyle. To the parent it was madness, but 10 years or 20 years later it worked out.
People get richer, get poorer, get mental illness, gain motivation, lose motivation. They have businesses that boom in Covid lockdown or fail in lockdown. Quiet men cheat, gregarious men cheat.
Ideally 21 to 25 year olds woulx be able to decide with a 50 year old mind. But that is not possible.
The better you raised a child and the better example you gave them in your own marriage the more they will be able to see the warning signs. But there are no guarantees. Marriage is a gamble, life has risks. Take the jab, don't take the jab. We make calls all the time and just hope we get the big ones correct.
Quote from: TandJ on September 21, 2021, 01:51:43 AMHe mentioned the fact he watches some rated R movies that I would absolutely forbid my kids from watching.
Oh the humanity! *clutches pearls*
Quote from: Christina_S on September 21, 2021, 07:54:32 PM
I have lived through a situation somewhat like this, but I'm the daughter.
My parents really didn't want me to get married at 21 to the tall, handsome former seminarian who had a poorly paying job with the Catholic diocese. And when I say "really," I mean "REALLY." They called our engagement disrespectful to their wishes, refused to have any kind of polite conversation with my fiance after the engagement, met with the priest who was doing our marriage prep and (from our best guesses) tried to pay him off to keep him from signing off on our completion of the course. It got to the point that they were at my apartment two weeks before the wedding STILL trying to persuade me to call it off. They attended the wedding, but didn't speak to us. My parents hardly talk to me at all now. I've gone to one dinner with my extended family since marriage and my husband was not allowed to come. We have a young daughter whom my parents haven't met because I'm unwilling to sweep their past behaviour and treatment of my husband under the rug.
What I'm trying to say is this: don't burn the bridge if you can help it.
The NO Catholic thing can be helped. Ask your daughter if she wants to bring him along to Mass and then hang out with the family afterwards (my family wanted nothing to do with my husband when we were first dating and it led to some of the future issues). If he's worth her time, he'll likely see the goodness of the TLM and stick around. Hopefully he'll develop some devotional practices. If it disturbs him and he can't stand it, I think your daughter will see that he's not worth the drama. If she's as devout as you say, I think she'll be able to hold her own. Keep lines of communication open with her, I beg you. If every conversation turns into nagging her about dropping the boyfriend (which happened with my mom), you're going to lose her.
Marriage is a big deal; does she understand the gravity of that?
Like Chairman, I've got some concerns about the R-rated films. Perhaps ask your daughter if she has talked to him about it. It would be worthwhile for them to have that conversation on their own and for her to ask what kind of films they are, why he enjoys them, whether she would also have to watch them with him, etc. If there's a lot of sex/nudity, I would be worried about a potential porn addiction...
I'm sorry that you and your husband had to go through that.
Quote from: TandJ on September 21, 2021, 06:24:12 PM
but the kind of movies I forbid are ones that show sexual nudity, porn, blasphemy, f-words, gory unnecessary violence.
So essentially 95% of all movies.
You would ban the Terminator 1 and 2. The Bourne Identity/Supremacy/Ultimatum. The Shawshank Redemption.
Fair enough, that is your right, but you are your daughter's mother. You don't get to tell your son in law what movies to watch.
All you can do is sell him on your views.
If you were a fabulous mother in law and really helped out with my young family and I saw you helping to raise my kids then I'd probably throw those DVDs out. I'd think, not watching those movies did not do her any harm.
What I have found, more frequently, is that people who ban such movies have all sorts of other hang ups and problems. I've never found that action movies make me violent.
I don't watch many movies at all now frankly, because the new ones are rubbish and I have watched all of the old ones too many times.
Quote from: Christina_S on September 21, 2021, 07:54:32 PM
We have a young daughter whom my parents haven't met because I'm unwilling to sweep their past behaviour and treatment of my husband under the rug.
Good for you.
I mean that. I've had to go through something similar. Don't let up.
My very dear friend says that whenever she has a difficult problem that she doesn't know the answer to, she says a prayer to St. Joseph and asks her husband what he thinks and 100% of the time everything miraculously works out in a way she could have never predicted.
Quote from: MaximGun on September 22, 2021, 04:16:32 AM
You would ban the Terminator 1 and 2. The Bourne Identity/Supremacy/Ultimatum. The Shawshank Redemption.
In our house, T1 is out, but T2 is OK.
T1 followed the unfortunate but standard 1980s script of using women in various states of undress to help sell a movie.
T2 didn't do anything like that, as far as I recall. And I don't recall any violence in the film that isn't part of the plot. In fact, most of it is directed against a robot who's made out of liquid metal...
Quote from: queen.saints on September 22, 2021, 07:26:23 AM
My very dear friend says that whenever she has a difficult problem that she doesn't know the answer to, she says a prayer to St. Joseph and asks her husband what he thinks and 100% of the time everything miraculously works out in a way she could have never predicted.
Gotta teach my wife that :toth:
Quote from: LausTibiChriste on September 22, 2021, 04:41:55 AM
Quote from: Christina_S on September 21, 2021, 07:54:32 PM
We have a young daughter whom my parents haven't met because I'm unwilling to sweep their past behaviour and treatment of my husband under the rug.
Good for you.
I mean that. I've had to go through something similar. Don't let up.
Thanks, LausTibiChriste.
I've missed having you around here.
Sorry Christina, I am not dragging out the complete details from your sad situation but are your parents traditional catholics or even catholic?
My non practicing husband was welcomed on day 1 by my parents and they loved him dearly, I can't imagine being in that situation.
TJ, is he a charmer, a smoozer, saying all the right things about respecting your daughters religion so that he can date her? if he is a moral upstanding steady man and he is agreeable to the children being reared in tradition then I wouldn't interfere. However my mother always said, mothers have an instinct and we should never ignore it but for me there would have to be more red flags than r movies.
I handle the naked bits in movies by knowing where they are and mostly always using DVDs so I can fast forward easily. Then we all shout, "snogging" which makes light of the whole situation. The sex scenes don't add much to the story.
There would probably be a good living to be had in taking movies and editing out the rude bit and making a site where Christians and people who did not want to watch such stuff could watch cleaned up movies.
Even though a lot of stuff got taken off VidAngel after their lawsuit with Disney, they still have a lot of movies and shows on there and you can filter out literally whatever you want.
https://www.vidangel.com/
(https://vidangelsupport.zendesk.com/hc/article_attachments/360086871671/filters2.png)
I've never watched "AVA" or heard of it; it's just an example from in their help section.
Quote from: diaduit on September 22, 2021, 04:51:41 PM
Sorry Christina, I am not dragging out the complete details from your sad situation but are your parents traditional catholics or even catholic?
My non practicing husband was welcomed on day 1 by my parents and they loved him dearly, I can't imagine being in that situation.
Yes, my parents are NO Catholics. We went to Mass every Sunday when I was growing up, and occasionally to Mass and Adoration during the week. My parents sent us to Catholic summer camps and would sometimes pray the Rosary at home with us. They followed all Church teachings on contraception, abortion, gay marriage, etc with no issues.
My mom announced in July that she has left the faith, but I don't know what the situation is for the rest of the family. I think things took a bad turn when they were unhappy about my marriage, which the Church ruled was just fine, but with the COVID nonsense keeping them away from Mass and the sacraments for months last year, that probably drove the spike deeper.
QuoteHe seems very nice but there are some things that worry me. He's a Catholic but a regular NO Catholic and I don't think he's ever been to the TLM.
Does he go regularly? That's a huge plus. Most men instinctively love the TLM. Bring him to one. Also, he's attracted to your daughter, whom I'm assuming is feminine and traditional. Good taste. Is he masculine? What does your husband think of him?
QuoteI worry about if she were to marry him they would fight a lot
That would be a plus. Has she ever been so angry with him that she scratched him? If so, he's the one.
Quotebecause she was raised with traditional Catholic values and he was raised with modern Catholic values. I think she believes she can be a good influence on him.
She probably can. She needs to be ready to set some boundaries. Her future marriage will be Catholic and the family is going to the TLM. I doubt he is anti-TLM and a lot of men don't have much of an opinion at their age. If he values her because she is feminine and traditional virtues, being he is a man and lives on logic and not emotion, he'll want to raise his kids the same way.
QuoteSo my question is: how much input do I have about this? She's an adult who lives at home but I also don't want to be so pushy she leaves and makes a horrible marriage choice she'll never be able to get out of.
1. Don't let the perfect be the enemy of the good.
2. Advise your daughter to start taking him to the TLM.
Quote from: TandJ on September 21, 2021, 01:51:43 AMShe's an adult who lives at home but I also don't want to be so pushy she leaves and makes a horrible marriage choice she'll never be able to get out of.
Since she is an adult, i think it is better to mention your concerns one time only. In the end it will be her decision. It is not going to be easy for her to find a perfect partner who meets your specifications. As far as movies are concerned, some PG-13 movies are just as bad with the use of our Lord's Name in vain and the f word. I don't know why Catholics don't boycott movies which use the Holy Name in vain. I am sure that a Muslim would be upset if a movie were to blaspheme the name of their prophet.
Quote from: james03 on September 23, 2021, 12:43:02 PM
QuoteI worry about if she were to marry him they would fight a lot
That would be a plus. Has she ever been so angry with him that she scratched him? If so, he's the one.
Please tell me you're kidding.
My writing style, if you haven't noticed, is to over exaggerate to make a point.
Fighting, if done properly, is good for a marriage. Women love the emotion involved, but more importantly it gets problems out in the open and avoids secret grudges.
Eliminating drugs, alcohol, and dudes beating the crap out their wives, in my experience the usual cause of divorce is lack of fighting.
I had a buddy who got divorced. I finally had to ask, so asked him what went wrong. He said, "She was a bitch. One time I was napping and she started up the vacuum cleaner."
"What did you do?"
"I was so mad I left."
"Dude, did you ever consider that she was looking to fight with you?"
His mouth dropped open because he realized I was right.