To what are you currently listening?

[erin is nice]

I just discovered this song- her voice is mesmerizing.
[yt]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-cSjUDyBosc[/yt]

[Lydia Purpuraria]

[yt]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dHTxHVXjlm8[/yt]

[LausTibiChriste]

[piabee]

Sunny songs for foggy days.

[yt]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GxeDBAGG1B0[/yt]

[yt]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gMwitMUfwbc[/yt]

[yt]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6tRX1PYx7G8[/yt]

[Revixit]

Modern pop, rock, or whatever, is from hell.

It really is - I'm surprised that more people don't know this.  It IS from hell; it is inspired by hell; recording artists reportedly take an oath to the devil (quite serious).  And it literally sounds like hell: senseless noise.

What a ridiculous assertion you make here:  "recording artists reportedly take an oath to the devil (quite serious)." 

Name three recording artists who will testify that they have done this (quite serious).

Saying they "reportedly" take an oath to the devil is just hearsay, gossip based on no facts.


I just read an article the other day about a book titled Who Is the Devil?, by Nicolas Corte, first published in 1958, now re-issued.  It may well be worth reading, IDK. The article, by K.V. Turley. included this paragraph:

"Maybe it was no coincidence that just a few years prior to the S.C.D.F. document being issued a well known English rock band, following the 19th Century tradition, sang of 'sympathy for the devil' whilst detailing the many guises that being donned in the 20th Century. Through all the carnage  – wars & revolutions – the song's infernal narrator sings that he is 'pleased' to meet us, hopes we can guess his name... Needless to say, we are never 'pleased' to have any dealings with this 'character', knowing exactly who and what he is, and what's more we should guard against him with all that the Church teaches. That said, in this perpetual struggle, after having read Who is the Devil? one is certainly better prepared against the wiles of this mysterious and evil entity."

The weird thing about that charge from Turley is that Mick Jagger sings the part of Satan in "Sympathy for the Devil," giving ample evidence for a great deal of the evil Satan has been part of.  But singing the part of the Devil does not transform anyone into that "mysterious and evil entity."  Jagger has done a lot of drugs, sex, and rock and roll, but without actually knowing him, we can't say he is evil, only that he has sinned.

Reading the lyrics to "Sympathy for the Devil" - available free online - should give a good basic education to those who might be ignorant about who Lucifer was and is.  Who knows how many people might have gained or returned to faith in God after hearing that song?

The author of the book "notes with interest the widespread change of 'image' given to Satan in the literature of the 19th Century: changed from foe and adversary to that of one deserving 'sympathy' – this creature but a sad reflection of Divine 'cruelty'."

Notice Corte said "in the literature of the 19th Century," not the 20th century, so some writers were suggesting "sympathy for the devil" long before Mick Jagger and Keith White were born, close to the middle of the 20th century.

And the lyrics say,

"Pleased to meet you
Hope you guessed my name, oh yeah
But what's confusing you
Is just the nature of my game"

NOT that we should ever be pleased to meet Satan, but that he [Satan] is pleased to meet us and hopes we have guessed his name.  I'm not sure the devil really wants us to guess his name but it's just a song, after all.  Songs can be over-analyzed; ask any musician who writes them.

Also, it's absolutely false to say that rock didn't exist before Vatican II.  By the mid-Fifties, I don't think that there was any place in the US where rock was not on the radio, though stations that played only rock might not have been in every area that early.  Kids were also buying lots of records, mostly 45s but also LPs, and they weren't into Sinatra.  Look up Bill Hailey and the Comets (they did a movie called "Rock Around the Clock" in, IIRC, 1955), Elvis [Presley, not Costello], Jerry Lee Lewis, Little Richard, etc., etc.  When the Sixties got underway we had surf music by Jan and Dean, the Beach Boys, the Ventures, etc., and, in early 1964, the British Invasion began -- the Beatles came to the US.

They were followed by many other British bands, including the Rolling Stones.  The Beatles' manager had cleaned them up, put them in nice mod suits, tried to keep them from being photographed smoking, presented them as "clean-cut lads from Liverpool" so the Stones were sort of the antithesis of the Beatles.  A lot of other English bands had copied the Beatles with their matching mod suits but the Stones went for a scruffier look.

[erin is nice]

There is no reason to leave the 90s-

[yt]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9AmGM5u1SjY[/yt]

[Mono no aware]

What a ridiculous assertion you make here:  "recording artists reportedly take an oath to the devil (quite serious)." 

Name three recording artists who will testify that they have done this (quite serious).

Saying they "reportedly" take an oath to the devil is just hearsay, gossip based on no facts.


I just read an article the other day about a book titled Who Is the Devil?, by Nicolas Corte, first published in 1958, now re-issued.  It may well be worth reading, IDK. The article, by K.V. Turley. included this paragraph:

"Maybe it was no coincidence that just a few years prior to the S.C.D.F. document being issued a well known English rock band, following the 19th Century tradition, sang of 'sympathy for the devil' whilst detailing the many guises that being donned in the 20th Century. Through all the carnage  – wars & revolutions – the song's infernal narrator sings that he is 'pleased' to meet us, hopes we can guess his name... Needless to say, we are never 'pleased' to have any dealings with this 'character', knowing exactly who and what he is, and what's more we should guard against him with all that the Church teaches. That said, in this perpetual struggle, after having read Who is the Devil? one is certainly better prepared against the wiles of this mysterious and evil entity."

The weird thing about that charge from Turley is that Mick Jagger sings the part of Satan in "Sympathy for the Devil," giving ample evidence for a great deal of the evil Satan has been part of.  But singing the part of the Devil does not transform anyone into that "mysterious and evil entity."  Jagger has done a lot of drugs, sex, and rock and roll, but without actually knowing him, we can't say he is evil, only that he has sinned.

Reading the lyrics to "Sympathy for the Devil" - available free online - should give a good basic education to those who might be ignorant about who Lucifer was and is.  Who knows how many people might have gained or returned to faith in God after hearing that song?

The author of the book "notes with interest the widespread change of 'image' given to Satan in the literature of the 19th Century: changed from foe and adversary to that of one deserving 'sympathy' – this creature but a sad reflection of Divine 'cruelty'."

Notice Corte said "in the literature of the 19th Century," not the 20th century, so some writers were suggesting "sympathy for the devil" long before Mick Jagger and Keith White were born, close to the middle of the 20th century.

And the lyrics say,

"Pleased to meet you
Hope you guessed my name, oh yeah
But what's confusing you
Is just the nature of my game"

NOT that we should ever be pleased to meet Satan, but that he [Satan] is pleased to meet us and hopes we have guessed his name.  I'm not sure the devil really wants us to guess his name but it's just a song, after all.  Songs can be over-analyzed; ask any musician who writes them.

Also, it's absolutely false to say that rock didn't exist before Vatican II.  By the mid-Fifties, I don't think that there was any place in the US where rock was not on the radio, though stations that played only rock might not have been in every area that early.  Kids were also buying lots of records, mostly 45s but also LPs, and they weren't into Sinatra.  Look up Bill Hailey and the Comets (they did a movie called "Rock Around the Clock" in, IIRC, 1955), Elvis [Presley, not Costello], Jerry Lee Lewis, Little Richard, etc., etc.  When the Sixties got underway we had surf music by Jan and Dean, the Beach Boys, the Ventures, etc., and, in early 1964, the British Invasion began -- the Beatles came to the US.

They were followed by many other British bands, including the Rolling Stones.  The Beatles' manager had cleaned them up, put them in nice mod suits, tried to keep them from being photographed smoking, presented them as "clean-cut lads from Liverpool" so the Stones were sort of the antithesis of the Beatles.  A lot of other English bands had copied the Beatles with their matching mod suits but the Stones went for a scruffier look.

I don't have any solid evidence that any particular rock n' roller ever made a deal with the devil, but it's pretty factual that both Jimmy Page and David Bowie were heavily into the works of Aleister Crowley (who is also one of the people on the cover of the Beatles' album Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band).  There can be no question that Crowley himself was an occultist.  The case of Jimmy Page is particularly fascinating.  He purchased Crowley's Loch Ness manor house, Boleskine—and he also recorded a soundtrack to Lucifer Rising, a film by Crowley's disciple Kenneth Anger.  (Even more fascinating: Anger rejected Page's music and decided to hire Bobby Beausoleil instead.  Beausoleil was a member of the Manson Family, serving a life sentence for murder.  And more fascinating still is the fact that Beausoleil's score is a truly amazing slice of psychedelia).  Now, granted, none of this proves a "deal with the devil," but whenever you start to research the rock scene of the 1960s, you do seem to find a tinge of Luciferianism whenever you scratch the surface.  It's not always a horned god (as with the Rolling Stones' Goats Head Soup), but there's usually something pagan or occultish: you can see it in Jimi Hendrix's Vishnu homage on the cover of Axis: Bold As Love, or in the theosophical lyrics of the 13th Floor Elevators' "Slip Inside This House."  The 60s rock scene is what brought occultism and Eastern religions to the fore of the youth culture.  I didn't realize anyone denied this.  And full disclosure: I love all of the artists I mentioned in this paragraph.  But I'm not going to put my head in the sand, either.

As for "Sympathy for the Devil," it seems a stretch to wonder "who knows how many people might have gained or returned to faith in God after hearing that song?"  The answer is probably none.  And it was earlier than the 19th century that Satan was presented as a Byronic hero: the first important instance (which doubtless impressed Byron himself) was Paradise Lost, where Milton inadvertently made Satan a more romantic character than God.  That's the sympathy referred to in the song: it's not to feel sorry for Satan because he's been condemned, but to celebrate him as the first (and still the best) campaigner for freedom from servitude.  "Just as every cop is a criminal, and all the sinners saints."

And no one here has denied that rock n' roll existed before Vatican II.  Quite obviously it did.  To the extent, however, that we can look to what Catholic prelates and moralists had to say about it, they do not seem to have been in favor.  Here is Cardinal Stritch of Chicago:

Some new manners of dancing and a throwback to tribalism in recreation cannot be tolerated for Catholic youths.  When our schools and centers stoop to such things as rock & roll tribal rhythms, they are failing seriously in their duty. God grant that this word will have the effect of banning such things in Catholic recreation.

And Bishop McVinney of Providence said of Elvis Presley that "his stage antics are intended to arouse the lower instincts. Apparently he is succeeding."  I quoted him earlier on this thread: he criticized rock music as "a musical fad which is leading its young devotees back to the jungle and animalism."  It's possible, I suppose, that these two bishops were just an anomalous pair of sour-faced old sticks in the mud—and maybe a majority of the clergy in the 1950s were fine with rock n' roll, and they were looking forward to the day when Mick Jagger would inflame people's religious sensibilities by cataloging all the wicked stuff wrought by Satan.  But somehow, I doubt it.

[Mono no aware]

There is no reason to leave the 90s

But there's no reason to be in the 90s in the first place, since there's no reason to leave the 1960s.

[yt]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ELQ-LkhJHh4[/yt]

[Chestertonian]

There is no reason to leave the 90s-

come to Brooklyn

we like to pretend y2k never happened

[erin is nice]

There is no reason to leave the 90s-

come to Brooklyn

we like to pretend y2k never happened

The dream of the 90s is alive in Brooklyn?

[Chestertonian]

There is no reason to leave the 90s-

come to Brooklyn

we like to pretend y2k never happened

The dream of the 90s is alive in Brooklyn?

yup...  bring your wallet chain

[LausTibiChriste]

Kicking it old school:

[Prayerful]

One hit wonders, but a pretty good one hit, 1999 I think.

[piabee]

[yt]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=msMYoM7Xkb8[/yt]

[Arun]

What a ridiculous assertion you make here:  "recording artists reportedly take an oath to the devil (quite serious)." 

Name three recording artists who will testify that they have done this (quite serious).

Saying they "reportedly" take an oath to the devil is just hearsay, gossip based on no facts.


I just read an article the other day about a book titled Who Is the Devil?, by Nicolas Corte, first published in 1958, now re-issued.  It may well be worth reading, IDK. The article, by K.V. Turley. included this paragraph:

"Maybe it was no coincidence that just a few years prior to the S.C.D.F. document being issued a well known English rock band, following the 19th Century tradition, sang of 'sympathy for the devil' whilst detailing the many guises that being donned in the 20th Century. Through all the carnage  – wars & revolutions – the song's infernal narrator sings that he is 'pleased' to meet us, hopes we can guess his name... Needless to say, we are never 'pleased' to have any dealings with this 'character', knowing exactly who and what he is, and what's more we should guard against him with all that the Church teaches. That said, in this perpetual struggle, after having read Who is the Devil? one is certainly better prepared against the wiles of this mysterious and evil entity."

The weird thing about that charge from Turley is that Mick Jagger sings the part of Satan in "Sympathy for the Devil," giving ample evidence for a great deal of the evil Satan has been part of.  But singing the part of the Devil does not transform anyone into that "mysterious and evil entity."  Jagger has done a lot of drugs, sex, and rock and roll, but without actually knowing him, we can't say he is evil, only that he has sinned.

Reading the lyrics to "Sympathy for the Devil" - available free online - should give a good basic education to those who might be ignorant about who Lucifer was and is.  Who knows how many people might have gained or returned to faith in God after hearing that song?

The author of the book "notes with interest the widespread change of 'image' given to Satan in the literature of the 19th Century: changed from foe and adversary to that of one deserving 'sympathy' – this creature but a sad reflection of Divine 'cruelty'."

Notice Corte said "in the literature of the 19th Century," not the 20th century, so some writers were suggesting "sympathy for the devil" long before Mick Jagger and Keith White were born, close to the middle of the 20th century.

And the lyrics say,

"Pleased to meet you
Hope you guessed my name, oh yeah
But what's confusing you
Is just the nature of my game"

NOT that we should ever be pleased to meet Satan, but that he [Satan] is pleased to meet us and hopes we have guessed his name.  I'm not sure the devil really wants us to guess his name but it's just a song, after all.  Songs can be over-analyzed; ask any musician who writes them.

Also, it's absolutely false to say that rock didn't exist before Vatican II.  By the mid-Fifties, I don't think that there was any place in the US where rock was not on the radio, though stations that played only rock might not have been in every area that early.  Kids were also buying lots of records, mostly 45s but also LPs, and they weren't into Sinatra.  Look up Bill Hailey and the Comets (they did a movie called "Rock Around the Clock" in, IIRC, 1955), Elvis [Presley, not Costello], Jerry Lee Lewis, Little Richard, etc., etc.  When the Sixties got underway we had surf music by Jan and Dean, the Beach Boys, the Ventures, etc., and, in early 1964, the British Invasion began -- the Beatles came to the US.

They were followed by many other British bands, including the Rolling Stones.  The Beatles' manager had cleaned them up, put them in nice mod suits, tried to keep them from being photographed smoking, presented them as "clean-cut lads from Liverpool" so the Stones were sort of the antithesis of the Beatles.  A lot of other English bands had copied the Beatles with their matching mod suits but the Stones went for a scruffier look.

I don't have any solid evidence that any particular rock n' roller ever made a deal with the devil, but it's pretty factual that both Jimmy Page and David Bowie were heavily into the works of Aleister Crowley (who is also one of the people on the cover of the Beatles' album Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band).  There can be no question that Crowley himself was an occultist.  The case of Jimmy Page is particularly fascinating.  He purchased Crowley's Loch Ness manor house, Boleskine—and he also recorded a soundtrack to Lucifer Rising, a film by Crowley's disciple Kenneth Anger.  (Even more fascinating: Anger rejected Page's music and decided to hire Bobby Beausoleil instead.  Beausoleil was a member of the Manson Family, serving a life sentence for murder.  And more fascinating still is the fact that Beausoleil's score is a truly amazing slice of psychedelia).  Now, granted, none of this proves a "deal with the devil," but whenever you start to research the rock scene of the 1960s, you do seem to find a tinge of Luciferianism whenever you scratch the surface.  It's not always a horned god (as with the Rolling Stones' Goats Head Soup), but there's usually something pagan or occultish: you can see it in Jimi Hendrix's Vishnu homage on the cover of Axis: Bold As Love, or in the theosophical lyrics of the 13th Floor Elevators' "Slip Inside This House."  The 60s rock scene is what brought occultism and Eastern religions to the fore of the youth culture.  I didn't realize anyone denied this.  And full disclosure: I love all of the artists I mentioned in this paragraph.  But I'm not going to put my head in the sand, either.

As for "Sympathy for the Devil," it seems a stretch to wonder "who knows how many people might have gained or returned to faith in God after hearing that song?"  The answer is probably none.  And it was earlier than the 19th century that Satan was presented as a Byronic hero: the first important instance (which doubtless impressed Byron himself) was Paradise Lost, where Milton inadvertently made Satan a more romantic character than God.  That's the sympathy referred to in the song: it's not to feel sorry for Satan because he's been condemned, but to celebrate him as the first (and still the best) campaigner for freedom from servitude.  "Just as every cop is a criminal, and all the sinners saints."

And no one here has denied that rock n' roll existed before Vatican II.  Quite obviously it did.  To the extent, however, that we can look to what Catholic prelates and moralists had to say about it, they do not seem to have been in favor.  Here is Cardinal Stritch of Chicago:

Some new manners of dancing and a throwback to tribalism in recreation cannot be tolerated for Catholic youths.  When our schools and centers stoop to such things as rock & roll tribal rhythms, they are failing seriously in their duty. God grant that this word will have the effect of banning such things in Catholic recreation.

And Bishop McVinney of Providence said of Elvis Presley that "his stage antics are intended to arouse the lower instincts. Apparently he is succeeding."  I quoted him earlier on this thread: he criticized rock music as "a musical fad which is leading its young devotees back to the jungle and animalism."  It's possible, I suppose, that these two bishops were just an anomalous pair of sour-faced old sticks in the mud—and maybe a majority of the clergy in the 1950s were fine with rock n' roll, and they were looking forward to the day when Mick Jagger would inflame people's religious sensibilities by cataloging all the wicked stuff wrought by Satan.  But somehow, I doubt it.

i dunno man. i've heard an evangelist Christian claim that Corey Taylor having a 5 1/2 octave vocal range is evidence of diabolical preternatural "gifts" but sometimes some of that stuff just ends up coming across as plain stupid or ignorant. maybe some people did "sell their souls for rock n roll" but they wouldn't of all done it like some kind of massive orchestrated diabolical scheme/plot without somebody somewhere whistleblowing on the whole thing. i was born and raised on black sabbath, for example, and a lot of people don't like them but i've found them to be pretty good and positive really. something creeps me out about zeppelin though,a nd while i used to like the doors there is something really dark that just kind of... eminates out from their music. don't know how to describe it any better than that.

but, they're sinners making the music and maybe it influences their sound and message. tchaikovsky was a bender, mozart wasn't exactly a friend to the Faith and so on. music is music, it changes throughout time and history and is in many ways a cultural reflection of the life and times of those... times. um, yeah.

there's good and bad in all genres of music. and the thing i reckon about knee jerk reactions, is there must be some weird crazy body dynamics going on there because knee jerk reactions to whole categories or genres of things tend to end peoples foot right up in their mouth. so i try avoid them myself.