Chinese dropping like flies

[Tales]

And so the Chinese government blew up their economy and locked down hundreds of millions of people across the country just to get back at some few thousand protesters in Wuhan from years ago?  The Chinese government would have disappeared those people ages ago if they wanted to (maybe they already did).  That costs them almost nothing and they do it without batting an eyelash.  Blowing up their supply chains has cost them countless billions of dollars and risked toppling their power.  They locked down hundred of millions, not just irrelevant little Wuhan.  When a bottle of shampoo has 20+ SKUs in it and without even one that entire product cannot be made, and those 20 SKUs come from 20 different factories (of which they themselves rely upon other suppliers), shutting this entire supply chain down does not mean one can just "turn it back on" like a light switch when one wants.  These networks suffered a great blow that will take many months to return to normal production, and the losses are staggering.

Why has Taiwan banned every non-Taiwanese from even entering their island?  Why are Singapore and Hong Kong forcing 14 day quarantine on everyone who crosses the border?  Singapore & HK are financial / trading / aviation hubs that thrive on open borders.  Being that they are both Chinese and both have extensive networks in the mainland, what do you think they learned through their networks about the extent of the threat that you do not know?

You all are jumping through hoops to do anything but recognize the obvious:  there is a highly contagious viral pandemic now.  This is not really a big shocker, given as others have already noted, we always have pandemics (flu, common cold).

From reading all of these posts I sense that you all think the protective measures are too much.  That is a more reasonable thing to discuss.  Imagine a hypothetical in which the virus would only kill one person globally but to prevent the death it would require a year-long lockdown across the globe.  Is that cost acceptable?  No.  Well somewhere between that extreme and another extreme like total global annihilation is some vague area in which reasonable people start to say "yes, this threat is so severe that it is worth the cost."

As for the comment on Mass cancellation being evidence that the "fear & hysteria" (protective measures) are evidence that they (the protective measures) are evil, I disagree.  The evil is the virus.  Attempting to protect oneself and one's family / friends / society is not evil.  If Mass is cancelled for a week because the parish needs to be fumigated due to severe rodent infestation, the fumigation is not the evil, the infestation is the evil.  Extrapolate from that (odd) example to the current situation.

[awkwardcustomer]

If Mass is cancelled for a week because the parish needs to be fumigated due to severe rodent infestation, the fumigation is not the evil, the infestation is the evil.  Extrapolate from that (odd) example to the current situation.

Your (odd) example doesn't work because a cat would sort out a rodent infestation in no time.

[Aeternitus]

Yes, fear and hysteria reign supreme and I watch it happen before my eyes in open-mouthed shock.   We have had a supermarket employee stabbed, security guards posted in shops and now the police to patrol the toilet paper aisle in particular.   And the frail, disabled and elderly, who it is claimed are the main object of our  "protection" in this exercise, are instead the biggest losers in this fear-induced, hysterical fall-out.  They are unable to compete with the jostling crowds in supermarkets so miss out on essentials, including medications which are also high on the hoarders list and low in supply. They are too terrified to allow their grandchildren or great grandchildren (the "carriers")  visit them, so become even more socially isolated, with just a television/radio and the latest update on the "death" statistics to keep them company and fuel their anxiety.   Community services have either closed down or are operating on a much reduced level to incorporate the "social-distancing" principles affecting the services and aids, upon which this vulnerable group rely so heavily.   They are terrified, miserable, lonely and suffering, but, hey, at least they won't die from CoV-19.  A heart attack from watching the latest "statistics" might take them out instead.   

Countless jobs have been lost already.  The unemployment rate will skyrocket.  People will lose their homes, along with their jobs.  Crime will increase.  People of all ages and not just the elderly and infirm are impacted by the solutions imposed.     If there is a virus (and I find KR's arguments against this much more convincing than flawed statistics), this fall-out on all levels, including economic, should have been factored into any decisions taken and restrictions imposed by anyone concerned for their people as a whole.  You can't call something a solution if the collateral damage is catastrophic.

[John Lamb]

If Mass is cancelled for a week because the parish needs to be fumigated due to severe rodent infestation, the fumigation is not the evil, the infestation is the evil.  Extrapolate from that (odd) example to the current situation.

Your (odd) example doesn't work because a cat would sort out a rodent infestation in no time.

But awkwardcustomer, the government is the cat! And guess who the rodents are? Us!

Somewhere there's a dying Catholic requesting the last rites but who won't get them because the priest's duty to save people from contagion is greater than his duty to save them from hell.

[John Lamb]

Yes, fear and hysteria reign supreme and I watch it happen before my eyes in open-mouthed shock.   We have had a supermarket employee stabbed, security guards posted in shops and now the police to patrol the toilet paper aisle in particular.   And the frail, disabled and elderly, who it is claimed are the main object of our  "protection" in this exercise, are instead the biggest losers in this fear-induced, hysterical fall-out.  They are unable to compete with the jostling crowds in supermarkets so miss out on essentials, including medications which are also high on the hoarders list and low in supply. They are too terrified to allow their grandchildren or great grandchildren (the "carriers")  visit them, so become even more socially isolated, with just a television/radio and the latest update on the "death" statistics to keep them company and fuel their anxiety.   Community services have either closed down or are operating on a much reduced level to incorporate the "social-distancing" principles affecting the services and aids, upon which this vulnerable group rely so heavily.   They are terrified, miserable, lonely and suffering, but, hey, at least they won't die from CoV-19.  A heart attack from watching the latest "statistics" might take them out instead.   

Countless jobs have been lost already.  The unemployment rate will skyrocket.  People will lose their homes, along with their jobs.  Crime will increase.  People of all ages and not just the elderly and infirm are impacted by the solutions imposed.     If there is a virus (and I find KR's arguments against this much more convincing than flawed statistics), this fall-out on all levels, including economic, should have been factored into any decisions taken and restrictions imposed by anyone concerned for their people as a whole.  You can't call something a solution if the collateral damage is catastrophic.

The hysteria will likely cause more illness than the virus, but the statistics won't be recorded.

I really wish the UK would run as normal. If more people die, at least we didn't become hysterical cowards overnight. And if there's no more deaths in this country than any other, that's proof positive it was a sham. I guess that's why it's important for every country to get with the program lol.

[Xavier]

More Words from Heaven giving guidance: "Children, as your nation and the world stand in the shadow of the cross, please understand that the Holy Mother stands with you interceding on your behalf. My Provision is your constant. I am listening to your prayers. The cross of this particular virus is unprecedented. So too, must be your response in trust."

"Remember, I look only at hearts. Some of you have a heavier burden to bear due to the virtual quarantine of most of your nation. My grace never respects a quarantine. It is always a part of your present moment and cannot be challenged by any disease."

"These are the times when you must learn to depend upon My Grace. Pray for the collapse of this virus much sooner than anticipated. Once again, be united in prayer. Spiritual union is far more powerful than physical union. The disease is but a symptom of Satan's desire to capture the world.". And Ephesians 6:10-18+ to read on prayer warfare:

God also often says to all of us to learn to depend much more on His Providence for all of us that provides for our needs; and first pray with great faith and then calmly trust in Him to provide for all our needs, both material and spiritual. If people did that more, they would panic less.

I'm not a fan of panic at all. From what I could see, Trump did not encourage panic; asked everyone to remain calm; but also implemented basic precautionary measures. Some nations have already tried not taking precautions. It hasn't worked out, so they're doing it now.

[Xavier]

Coronavirus updates from Germany: https://berlinspectator.com/2020/03/19/coronavirus-in-germany-number-of-infected-rises-by-25-percent-in-one-day-1/

"In Germany, the number of Coronavirus cases has not been rising this rapidly since the crisis began. On Wednesday night, there were 12,327 infected persons, 3,000 more than a day before.

The increase of Coronavirus cases in Germany was alarming on Wednesday, when the number of infected persons suddenly jumped to over 12,000. Twenty-four hours before, it had been at around 9,000. This means the number rose substantially in one day, in spite of all the measures the federal government in Berlin and the federal states have taken so far. At 13:25 hrs. CET, the total number was 13,000."

"Nearly 10 million people in Germany could become infected with coronavirus within the next three months, if strict measures to stem its spread are not implemented, the country's disease control agency warned on Wednesday.

Speaking at a news conference in the capital Berlin, Lothar Wieler , head of the Robert Koch Institute (RKI) said the government's recent measures to limit social contact in public places, closure of all non-essential shops, bars and sport venues was extremely important to stem the spread of coronavirus, also known as COVID-19.

"If we don't succeed in effectively limiting social contact in the coming weeks, it is possible that we will have up to 10 million cases in Germany in the next two to three months," he said, adding that such a development could lead to collapse of the country's healthcare system.

He called on citizens to follow basic hygiene measures, refrain from social gatherings, keep at least 1.5 meters distance from others and stay at home except for the most essential reasons." https://www.aa.com.tr/en/latest-on-coronavirus-outbreak/germany-warned-of-10m-covid-19-cases-in-3-months/1770356

[Graham]

Where do the Chinese Virus Sympathizers get off calling others fearmongers? So far I've seen them argue the following:

-the economy is going to crash because of lockdown
-society is going to end
-the government and corporations are going to take over everything
-there is a global conspiracy with the level of universal control necessary to pull this off
-MORE people will die because of lockdown
-viruses dont exist and you cant trust anything a doctor says
-vetus ordo worships Satan

Among others. That's some seriously scary stuff.

[Xavier]

Btw, Holy Mass hasn't completely stopped everywhere. Even semi-public Masses continue in the vatican; with some social distancing. For e.g.



For those who want a livestream of 24*7 Eucharistic Adoration, you have many places. You can participate in EA right from your home:



Here's last Sunday's Traditional Mass live streamed at the time and online now: We are dispensed from obligation, but you can follow:

[Xavier]

This channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC7gYdjjfejL2Im_k2dPZYkA St. John Cantius Church also has Masses livestreamed often.

[John Lamb]

Italy is entering its fourth week of the worst national crisis since World War II with no end in sight.

More than 60 million people are living under an increasingly unbearable lockdown that is growing tighter by the day. The stores that remain open are shuttering earlier and police are patrolling in ever-greater numbers, chasing families out for walks back into their homes and ensuring no one is outside without a valid reason.
Where do the Chinese Virus Sympathizers get off calling others fearmongers? So far I've seen them argue the following:

-the economy is going to crash because of lockdown
-society is going to end
-the government and corporations are going to take over everything
-there is a global conspiracy with the level of universal control necessary to pull this off
-MORE people will die because of lockdown
-viruses dont exist and you cant trust anything a doctor says
-vetus ordo worships Satan

Among others. That's some seriously scary stuff.

Everyone has their coping strategy in times of fear. For some, it's going along with the prevailing wisdom and following the advice of authority. For others, it's making light of the situation and seeing it as far less serious as people are perceiving it. For others, it's thinking of an abstract explanation for the situation that ties it altogether. And so on. I'm sorry if anything I've said has scared or disturbed anyone. I'm making light of the situation. I don't know how bad it is in reality. All I'm certain of is mass fear and social distrust and anxiety is worse than sickness and death. I'd rather die in a peaceful and sane society than live in a panicked and insane one. But that's irrelevant. The point is we need to keep our hearts open to each other and the Holy Spirit and not expect everyone to act the same way. We need to act with love, not fear, and keep our eyes on heaven and on Christ. Remember St Paul who wanted to be with Christ so much he was eager to die, and only wanted to stay alive to help others come to Christ.

[Tales]

All I'm certain of is mass fear and social distrust and anxiety is worse than sickness and death. I'd rather die in a peaceful and sane society than live in a panicked and insane one.

John,

Thank you for your openness.  I have suspected for awhile now that there is a relationship between British culture and the anti-virus position.  Excluding Graham & MaximGun (who are both British, I think), the rest of our British friends here are vehemently against any action being taken.  Your comment I think sums it up and it fits perfectly with orderly British culture and stiff upper lips, that sort of thing, hence extreme repulsion at any break of that order.

Do you or any other of your compatriots think there is any connection, or am I wildly off?

[awkwardcustomer]

Coronavirus updates from Germany: https://berlinspectator.com/2020/03/19/coronavirus-in-germany-number-of-infected-rises-by-25-percent-in-one-day-1/

......  "Nearly 10 million people in Germany could become infected with coronavirus within the next three months, if strict measures to stem its spread are not implemented, the country's disease control agency warned on Wednesday.

...... "If we don't succeed in effectively limiting social contact in the coming weeks, it is possible that we will have up to 10 million cases in Germany in the next two to three months," he said, adding that such a development could lead to collapse of the country's healthcare system......

Fear inducing bullying.

Do as we say or you're going to die.

[queen.saints]

Oh no, I thought Graham was Canadian : (

[Tales]

I may very well be wrong.  This is just what I've gleaned from disparate posts over the years.