Can I ask?

Started by diaduit, June 15, 2021, 02:21:01 AM

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diaduit

So was Christula really Insanis? as per thread on 'chat box'.

If so, its just for clarification and I can't believe they were the same person and hopefully with the permanent ban that will put an end to the turbulence of the previous number of weeks.

Lynne

No, I don't believe they are the same person. People here know Chris in real life and other knew Insanius from other forums.

I'll be glad to have all the drama end though.
In conclusion, I can leave you with no better advice than that given after every sermon by Msgr Vincent Giammarino, who was pastor of St Michael's Church in Atlantic City in the 1950s:

    "My dear good people: Do what you have to do, When you're supposed to do it, The best way you can do it,   For the Love of God. Amen"

diaduit

Ah I get it now, saw the banned members....sorry.

Christula is General Lee.

Yes I hope it settles down too.

Jayne

I'm afraid that I am going to be suspicious of new posters for a while, since I would not be at all surprised if christulsa tries again to circumvent his ban with a new account.  I know this is not fair to new members, but I don't see how to avoid being affected by this possibility.
Jesus, meek and humble of heart, make my heart like unto Thine.

Kaesekopf

If anyone has any questions with respect to member identity, please PM me. 

As a reminder, it is a rule that members not have more than one account.   This rule is enforced. 

I do not know of any members who currently have two (active) accounts here. 

Again, any questions or concerns about particular posters, please PM. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Wie dein Sonntag, so dein Sterbetag.

I am not altogether on anybody's side, because nobody is altogether on my side.  ~Treebeard, LOTR

Jesus son of David, have mercy on me.

Lynne

Quote from: Jayne on June 15, 2021, 08:22:05 AM
I'm afraid that I am going to be suspicious of new posters for a while, since I would not be at all surprised if christulsa tries again to circumvent his ban with a new account.  I know this is not fair to new members, but I don't see how to avoid being affected by this possibility.

KK spots the duplicate accounts pretty quickly through some kind of techy magic.  :cheeseheadbeer:
In conclusion, I can leave you with no better advice than that given after every sermon by Msgr Vincent Giammarino, who was pastor of St Michael's Church in Atlantic City in the 1950s:

    "My dear good people: Do what you have to do, When you're supposed to do it, The best way you can do it,   For the Love of God. Amen"

Insanis

Quote from: diaduit on June 15, 2021, 02:21:01 AM
its just for clarification

You found the truth, but for more clarification: he was referencing the chat with the forum where I was active (still am).

He had a very mistaken idea about...everything, and is a very unreliable narrator.

But the short answer is christulsa was trolling the chat, and after he was banned from the forum (note: chat moderation is separate from forum moderation), he started using the General Lee account on the forum, and then used the name in chat and denied being the same (although, it was obvious he was). There is actually no restriction on his use of chat: the only policies in place are based on behaviors at the time.

Moderation is done as needed and there isn't a strong need for any strict policies: IRC works quite differently from the forum. Kicking someone from IRC doesn't ban them and there is nothing stopping someone from rejoining.

He, and anybody else, is welcome to use the chat, but spamming or trolling usually results in moderator actions to restrict the disruption if people are trying to use the chat.

The chat is not private, but it is not generally logged (although anybody can log it), and most discussions are transitory.


Insanis

Quote from: Lynne on June 15, 2021, 02:56:38 PM
KK spots the duplicate accounts pretty quickly through some kind of techy magic.  :cheeseheadbeer:

Thank you, but I'm not "techy magic".

Jayne

Quote from: Insanis on June 15, 2021, 03:02:36 PM
Thank you, but I'm not "techy magic".

To be fair, KK is good at figuring it out, even when you are not around to inform him like you did this time.
Jesus, meek and humble of heart, make my heart like unto Thine.

Kaesekopf

Quote from: Insanis on June 15, 2021, 03:02:36 PM
Quote from: Lynne on June 15, 2021, 02:56:38 PM
KK spots the duplicate accounts pretty quickly through some kind of techy magic.  :cheeseheadbeer:

Thank you, but I'm not "techy magic".
:lol:

I have other ways, too!  :P


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Wie dein Sonntag, so dein Sterbetag.

I am not altogether on anybody's side, because nobody is altogether on my side.  ~Treebeard, LOTR

Jesus son of David, have mercy on me.

andy

One thing about Chat/IRC is that it does not hide IP address (as far as I remember, it was a long while ago I used IRC). That gives predators extra information about  people.

Insanis

Quote from: Jayne on June 15, 2021, 03:07:17 PM
Quote from: Insanis on June 15, 2021, 03:02:36 PM
Thank you, but I'm not "techy magic".

To be fair, KK is good at figuring it out, even when you are not around to inform him like you did this time.

Certainly. There was no great difficulty in identifying the accounts, but it was far more obvious at first glance in chat than on the forum....especially when it is right after the previous account left and the "new" person comes in with the same IP address and continues the conversation where it was left off and just denying to be the same person.

In chat, moderation policy is based on behaviors at the time, not the identify of the person. People can use the chat without using the forum at all. After the ban on the forum, there was no need to pretend to be someone else in chat. If he hadn't associated his duplicate account with his "new" IRC nick, I wouldn't have spotted it. Anybody can go into chat with any name that isn't registered by someone else.

Quote from: Kaesekopf on June 15, 2021, 03:22:09 PM
:lol:

I have other ways, too!  :P

I hope so.

(And in this particular case, I wish it required some technical know-how...it was very transparent to the point of being comical in chat.)

Quote from: andy on June 15, 2021, 03:24:18 PM
One thing about Chat/IRC is that it does not hide IP address (as far as I remember, it was a long while ago I used IRC). That gives predators extra information about  people.

Mibbit doesn't reveal IP addresses. It creates a hostmask which gives information about the location and a random identification. One can see that an "IP address" is the same if the hostmasks are the same, but the hostmask itself is not revealing much. And in this case, the general location was revealed in the forum account name, so it didn't even reveal that. Having the same hostmask as the previous known user was enough in itself.

(People concerned about this even can connect to chat through Tor or something to hide that. Forum policy restricts the use of Tor and other obfuscation methods, but chat doesn't restrict it. And people concerned about IP addresses: look to the bottom right of your post (on desktop anyway).)

Kaesekopf

Quote from: Insanis on June 15, 2021, 03:33:01 PM
(People concerned about this even can connect to chat through Tor or something to hide that. Forum policy restricts the use of Tor and other obfuscation methods, but chat doesn't restrict it. And people concerned about IP addresses: look to the bottom right of your post (on desktop anyway).)

For the record, Forum policy re: TOR was brought about due to the Atheist Issue a few years back, if I am thinking properly.
Wie dein Sonntag, so dein Sterbetag.

I am not altogether on anybody's side, because nobody is altogether on my side.  ~Treebeard, LOTR

Jesus son of David, have mercy on me.

andy

Quote from: Insanis on June 15, 2021, 03:33:01 PM

Mibbit doesn't reveal IP addresses. It creates a hostmask which gives information about the location and a random identification. One can see that an "IP address" is the same if the hostmasks are the same, but the hostmask itself is not revealing much. And in this case, the general location was revealed in the forum account name, so it didn't even reveal that. Having the same hostmask as the previous known user was enough in itself.

(People concerned about this even can connect to chat through Tor or something to hide that. Forum policy restricts the use of Tor and other obfuscation methods, but chat doesn't restrict it. And people concerned about IP addresses: look to the bottom right of your post (on desktop anyway).)

I do not think that our forum reveals you IP to other members except the admin. BTW, there are other ways to hide your IP/location without using Tor, however the digital footprint we leave these days is so excessive, that even when using Tor, a well skilled professional could easily 'find you' if wanted.

Insanis

Quote from: andy on June 15, 2021, 04:02:54 PM
Quote from: Insanis on June 15, 2021, 03:33:01 PM
(People concerned about this even can connect to chat through Tor or something to hide that. Forum policy restricts the use of Tor and other obfuscation methods, but chat doesn't restrict it. And people concerned about IP addresses: look to the bottom right of your post (on desktop anyway).)

I do not think that our forum reveals you IP to other members except the admin.
That is true, ideally.

QuoteBTW, there are other ways to hide your IP/location without using Tor,

Yes, I know. I wrote "Tor or something" for a reason. I recommend Tor because most people here who I have interacted with were not extensively experienced with IRC and I know the chat works just fine on the website (this forum or the Mibbit online chat, channel #suscipedomine) with the Tor Browser without configuration. People can use chat with any IRC client on any network they want, but most seem to use it using the web client or the forum widget in the same browser they use for the forum.

Quote
however the digital footprint we leave these days is so excessive, that even when using Tor, a well skilled professional could easily 'find you' if wanted.

That depends on the individual. "We" have different behaviors: some may be more private/secure than others. The people who reveal their name and location publicly on the forum or even in their usernames have far less difficulty in being found than those who don't.

Also, security and privacy are not absolutes: it is a complex subject, and the fact that someone somewhere can "easily" do something means nothing. I mean, anybody can break into anything, so why use locks? If people don't want any information from their ISP being revealed on chat (normally, general location and ISP), they can use Tor and be totally obfuscated. That was the extent of my recommendation: it can be used to hide the hostmask in chat for those who are concerned. Security/privacy practices otherwise are a lot more complex and require a multifaceted consideration of many more subjects and relative risks.

Chat moderation is based on behaviours in chat: so even someone obviously using Tor with a suspicious  username isn't moderated unless they actually do something that is disruptive. (Actual blasphemous or trolling nicks could be subject to moderation, however, that has never happened while I was on chat.)