Author Topic: Harvard: Unvaccinated Children Pose Zero Risk  (Read 585 times)

Offline Habitual_Ritual

  • St. Joseph's Workbench
  • Feldwebel
  • ***
  • Posts: 3599
  • Thanked: 568 times
  • Religion: Papist
Harvard: Unvaccinated Children Pose Zero Risk
« on: July 10, 2017, 07:43:38 PM »
A Harvard immunologist has written an open letter explaining why unvaccinated children pose no risk to their vaccinated counterparts.

http://yournewswire.com/harvard-unvaccinated-children-risk/
" There exists now an enormous religious ignorance. In the times since the Council it is evident we have failed to pass on the content of the Faith.

(Pope Benedict XVI speaking in October 2002.)
 
The following users thanked this post: kayla_veronica, Heinrich, Maximilian, Carleendiane

Offline martin88nyc

  • St. Joseph's Workbench
  • Feldwebel
  • ***
  • Posts: 2163
  • Thanked: 1228 times
  • Religion: Catholic
Re: Harvard: Unvaccinated Children Pose Zero Risk
« Reply #1 on: July 10, 2017, 08:17:39 PM »
A Harvard immunologist has written an open letter explaining why unvaccinated children pose no risk to their vaccinated counterparts.

http://yournewswire.com/harvard-unvaccinated-children-risk/
If someone attacks you with an argument that unvaccinated children pose a risk to those who have been vaccinate then it just means that the vaccines are shitty and it's all about sales.
"These things I have spoken to you, that in me you may have peace. In the world you shall have distress: but have confidence, I have overcome the world." John 16:33
 
The following users thanked this post: Heinrich, Habitual_Ritual, Carleendiane

Offline Quaremerepulisti

  • Feldwebel
  • ***
  • Posts: 3288
  • Thanked: 979 times
  • Religion: Catholic
Re: Harvard: Unvaccinated Children Pose Zero Risk
« Reply #2 on: July 11, 2017, 08:23:28 AM »
As usual, the anti-science and anti-vax crowd is going to eat this one up.  No amount of logical argumentation will convince them otherwise, for it's simply an a priori worldview not based on reason.  Never mind the headline is completely wrong and misleading, for the immunologist is not arguing that unvaccinated children pose ZERO risk, but that they do not pose a higher risk than the vaccinated for certain vaccines.  But who cares about truth when you have an ideological agenda to push?

But anyway:

Yes, SOME vaccines are for non-communicable diseases or designed to prevent disease symptoms and not colonization and infection.  For THOSE vaccines, obviously unvaccinated individuals present no increased risk to the public at large, for the pathogens can be communicated just as readily by the vaccinated.

But for OTHER vaccines, they actually DO prevent infection and transmission such that there is increased transmission when they aren't used.  Even the immunologist says so herself regarding whole cell pertussis vaccine; when it was replaced with acellular pertussis vaccine (which doesn't prevent colonization and transmission) there was a resurgence.


The real purpose of traditionalist polemics is not to find truth, but to attempt to construct an epistemological fortress rendering one's worldview impervious to attack.
 
The following users thanked this post: Kaesekopf, GloriaPatri, Prayerful

Offline martin88nyc

  • St. Joseph's Workbench
  • Feldwebel
  • ***
  • Posts: 2163
  • Thanked: 1228 times
  • Religion: Catholic
Re: Harvard: Unvaccinated Children Pose Zero Risk
« Reply #3 on: July 11, 2017, 11:34:23 AM »
As usual, the anti-science and anti-vax crowd is going to eat this one up.  No amount of logical argumentation will convince them otherwise, for it's simply an a priori worldview not based on reason.  Never mind the headline is completely wrong and misleading, for the immunologist is not arguing that unvaccinated children pose ZERO risk, but that they do not pose a higher risk than the vaccinated for certain vaccines.  But who cares about truth when you have an ideological agenda to push?

But anyway:

Yes, SOME vaccines are for non-communicable diseases or designed to prevent disease symptoms and not colonization and infection.  For THOSE vaccines, obviously unvaccinated individuals present no increased risk to the public at large, for the pathogens can be communicated just as readily by the vaccinated.

But for OTHER vaccines, they actually DO prevent infection and transmission such that there is increased transmission when they aren't used.  Even the immunologist says so herself regarding whole cell pertussis vaccine; when it was replaced with acellular pertussis vaccine (which doesn't prevent colonization and transmission) there was a resurgence.
Go ahead and vaccinate your child with 21 vaccines before the age of six. It is all safe because FDA says so. They are omnipotent.
"These things I have spoken to you, that in me you may have peace. In the world you shall have distress: but have confidence, I have overcome the world." John 16:33
 
The following users thanked this post: Habitual_Ritual, Carleendiane

Offline Heinrich

  • Der hat einen Rosenkranz und steht jetzt als Arbeiter bei
  • St. Joseph's Workbench
  • Hauptmann
  • ****
  • Posts: 5748
  • Thanked: 1159 times
  • "Hebst du doch, Geck?" Schlank und eisig.
  • Religion: Catholic
Re: Harvard: Unvaccinated Children Pose Zero Risk
« Reply #4 on: July 11, 2017, 11:51:13 AM »
As usual, the anti-science and anti-vax crowd is going to eat this one up.  No amount of logical argumentation will convince them otherwise, for it's simply an a priori worldview not based on reason.  Never mind the headline is completely wrong and misleading, for the immunologist is not arguing that unvaccinated children pose ZERO risk, but that they do not pose a higher risk than the vaccinated for certain vaccines.  But who cares about truth when you have an ideological agenda to push?

But anyway:

Yes, SOME vaccines are for non-communicable diseases or designed to prevent disease symptoms and not colonization and infection.  For THOSE vaccines, obviously unvaccinated individuals present no increased risk to the public at large, for the pathogens can be communicated just as readily by the vaccinated.

But for OTHER vaccines, they actually DO prevent infection and transmission such that there is increased transmission when they aren't used.  Even the immunologist says so herself regarding whole cell pertussis vaccine; when it was replaced with acellular pertussis vaccine (which doesn't prevent colonization and transmission) there was a resurgence.

In all these discussions on vaccines, I have seen you push an agenda as well. All the while giving no tangible evidence as to why the current pro vaccine camp has the goods on all that is beneficial to healthy living. Try to push your intellectual arrogance aside and answer accusations against antiseptic antigens accordingly.
Pray for the Consecration.                           
Lex Orandi, lex credendi, lex vivendi.
"Bear in mind that the more the enemy assaults you, God is closer to your soul." --St. Padre Pio
 
The following users thanked this post: Habitual_Ritual

Offline Quaremerepulisti

  • Feldwebel
  • ***
  • Posts: 3288
  • Thanked: 979 times
  • Religion: Catholic
Re: Harvard: Unvaccinated Children Pose Zero Risk
« Reply #5 on: July 11, 2017, 02:09:26 PM »
In all these discussions on vaccines, I have seen you push an agenda as well.

No, you haven't, because I haven't been pushing one, except to have these types of questions be decided by empirical data and not ideology.

Quote
All the while giving no tangible evidence as to why the current pro vaccine camp has the goods on all that is beneficial to healthy living.

That is of course a straw man.  What I'm really denying is the anti-vax charge that the current pro vaccine camp has the goods on nothing beneficial to healthy living.

If you are determined a priori that there is no tangible evidence, there will be none.  You can always find other explanations for the data.  You can also deny that smoking causes lung cancer, if you are so inclined, using the same m.o.  But this is starting with a theory and making the data fit it like Procrustes' bed, not constructing a theory based on the data.

Reductions in incidence of lots of communicable diseases following mass immunization?  It's due to something else like improved hygiene.

Eradication of smallpox and polio?  They weren't really eradicated and again the massive decrease in incidence was due to other factors.

Knowledge of the mechanisms behind vaccines?  Works perhaps in a petri dish, but no one has actually seen it in a live human.

Double-blind randomized controlled study or the closest we can come due to ethical/IRB issues?  The researchers were paid off by Big Pharma.

And so on.  It's just like:

Socialism hasn't worked anywhere it's been tried and has resulted in much more misery for the very working classes it was supposed to help?  The right people weren't in charge.


Quote
Try to push your intellectual arrogance aside and answer accusations against antiseptic antigens accordingly.

Again, the old trad "if you don't agree with me, you're evil" meme.
The real purpose of traditionalist polemics is not to find truth, but to attempt to construct an epistemological fortress rendering one's worldview impervious to attack.
 

Offline Quaremerepulisti

  • Feldwebel
  • ***
  • Posts: 3288
  • Thanked: 979 times
  • Religion: Catholic
Re: Harvard: Unvaccinated Children Pose Zero Risk
« Reply #6 on: July 11, 2017, 02:10:46 PM »

Go ahead and vaccinate your child with 21 vaccines before the age of six. It is all safe because FDA says so. They are omnipotent.

The issue here isn't vaccine safety, but vaccine efficacy.
The real purpose of traditionalist polemics is not to find truth, but to attempt to construct an epistemological fortress rendering one's worldview impervious to attack.
 

Offline Kaesekopf

  • Enkindle in us the virtues of humility and patience So we too may obediently do your will faithfully.
  • Oberst
  • Major
  • *****
  • Posts: 19675
  • Thanked: 4987 times
    • Suscipe Domine
  • Religion: Catholic
Re: Harvard: Unvaccinated Children Pose Zero Risk
« Reply #7 on: July 11, 2017, 02:37:26 PM »
Harvard?  No.  She got her doctorate from Rockefeller University, and did postdoctoral research training at Harvard Medical School and at Stanford University School of Medicine.

Headline is wrong.

Shitty blog 'reporting' is shit.
Wie dein Sonntag, so dein Sterbetag.

I am not altogether on anybody's side, because nobody is altogether on my side.  ~Treebeard, LOTR

Jesus son of David, have mercy on me.
 
The following users thanked this post: Chestertonian

Offline Heinrich

  • Der hat einen Rosenkranz und steht jetzt als Arbeiter bei
  • St. Joseph's Workbench
  • Hauptmann
  • ****
  • Posts: 5748
  • Thanked: 1159 times
  • "Hebst du doch, Geck?" Schlank und eisig.
  • Religion: Catholic
Re: Harvard: Unvaccinated Children Pose Zero Risk
« Reply #8 on: July 11, 2017, 04:31:11 PM »
Quote
Try to push your intellectual arrogance aside and answer accusations against antiseptic antigens accordingly.

Again, the old trad "if you don't agree with me, you're evil" meme.

You can't accuse me of fallacy and then engage in them as well. Regardless of the sloppiness of the "research" and "findings," try to at least be less condescending and understanding: There very well may be some here who are stakeholders and have a legitimate complaint due to simple cause and effect experience.
Pray for the Consecration.                           
Lex Orandi, lex credendi, lex vivendi.
"Bear in mind that the more the enemy assaults you, God is closer to your soul." --St. Padre Pio
 

Offline Quaremerepulisti

  • Feldwebel
  • ***
  • Posts: 3288
  • Thanked: 979 times
  • Religion: Catholic
Re: Harvard: Unvaccinated Children Pose Zero Risk
« Reply #9 on: July 11, 2017, 04:59:21 PM »
Regardless of the sloppiness of the "research" and "findings," try to at least be less condescending and understanding: There very well may be some here who are stakeholders and have a legitimate complaint due to simple cause and effect experience.

Granted.  But that doesn't justify their actions.  Nor does it mean I shouldn't try to prevent them from becoming victims, yet again, from the "VACCINES ARE KILLING US ALL!!!" hucksters.



The real purpose of traditionalist polemics is not to find truth, but to attempt to construct an epistemological fortress rendering one's worldview impervious to attack.
 

Offline martin88nyc

  • St. Joseph's Workbench
  • Feldwebel
  • ***
  • Posts: 2163
  • Thanked: 1228 times
  • Religion: Catholic
Re: Harvard: Unvaccinated Children Pose Zero Risk
« Reply #10 on: July 11, 2017, 05:57:01 PM »
What if empirical data is prevented from being documented?. In Poland there was recently a march against early vaccinations. The reason? hundreds of families with children who became victims of post vaccination syndrome caused by mercury and other stuff. They demand answers from the ministry of health but unfortunately the ministry keeps mum. My own sister had post vaccination complications. I won't be wasting my time on this issue. sometimes people have to experience it first hand to finally see what is going on. I am not against reasonable and safe vaccinations but there is just far too many "unwanted" so-called side effects from vaccinations that I refuse to turn a blind eye.
"These things I have spoken to you, that in me you may have peace. In the world you shall have distress: but have confidence, I have overcome the world." John 16:33
 
The following users thanked this post: Heinrich, Habitual_Ritual

Offline Prayerful

  • St. Joseph's Workbench
  • Hauptmann
  • ****
  • Posts: 5639
  • Thanked: 2178 times
  • Religion: Catholic
Re: Harvard: Unvaccinated Children Pose Zero Risk
« Reply #11 on: July 11, 2017, 06:12:38 PM »
Innoculation first, and later vaccination has spared so many parents from having to bury their children. A world without vaccines would be a far harder one, a very dangerous one for children and adults of a fragile constitution. Vaccination is not perfect, at times highly imperfect, but the positives vastly outweigh the negatives that come from careless doctors and pharma companies.
But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach a gospel to you besides that which we have preached to you, let him be anathema.

Galatians I, 4
 
The following users thanked this post: Chestertonian, martin88nyc

Offline martin88nyc

  • St. Joseph's Workbench
  • Feldwebel
  • ***
  • Posts: 2163
  • Thanked: 1228 times
  • Religion: Catholic
Re: Harvard: Unvaccinated Children Pose Zero Risk
« Reply #12 on: July 11, 2017, 06:17:47 PM »
Innoculation first, and later vaccination has spared so many parents from having to bury their children. A world without vaccines would be a far harder one, a very dangerous one for children and adults of a fragile constitution. Vaccination is not perfect, at times highly imperfect, but the positives vastly outweigh the negatives that come from careless doctors and pharma companies.
That's why we need a new medical body. There is too much corruption and dishonesty. The medical system has had its own Vatican II.
"These things I have spoken to you, that in me you may have peace. In the world you shall have distress: but have confidence, I have overcome the world." John 16:33
 
The following users thanked this post: Prayerful

Offline Prayerful

  • St. Joseph's Workbench
  • Hauptmann
  • ****
  • Posts: 5639
  • Thanked: 2178 times
  • Religion: Catholic
Re: Harvard: Unvaccinated Children Pose Zero Risk
« Reply #13 on: July 11, 2017, 06:29:42 PM »
Innoculation first, and later vaccination has spared so many parents from having to bury their children. A world without vaccines would be a far harder one, a very dangerous one for children and adults of a fragile constitution. Vaccination is not perfect, at times highly imperfect, but the positives vastly outweigh the negatives that come from careless doctors and pharma companies.
That's why we need a new medical body. There is too much corruption and dishonesty. The medical system has had its own Vatican II.

Yes. Too many doctors seem easy prey to companies bearing goodies/gifts.
But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach a gospel to you besides that which we have preached to you, let him be anathema.

Galatians I, 4
 
The following users thanked this post: martin88nyc

Offline Heinrich

  • Der hat einen Rosenkranz und steht jetzt als Arbeiter bei
  • St. Joseph's Workbench
  • Hauptmann
  • ****
  • Posts: 5748
  • Thanked: 1159 times
  • "Hebst du doch, Geck?" Schlank und eisig.
  • Religion: Catholic
Re: Harvard: Unvaccinated Children Pose Zero Risk
« Reply #14 on: July 11, 2017, 07:09:00 PM »
What if empirical data is prevented from being documented?. In Poland there was recently a march against early vaccinations. The reason? hundreds of families with children who became victims of post vaccination syndrome caused by mercury and other stuff. They demand answers from the ministry of health but unfortunately the ministry keeps mum. My own sister had post vaccination complications. I won't be wasting my time on this issue. sometimes people have to experience it first hand to finally see what is going on. I am not against reasonable and safe vaccinations but there is just far too many "unwanted" so-called side effects from vaccinations that I refuse to turn a blind eye.
[/quote

Yup.
Pray for the Consecration.                           
Lex Orandi, lex credendi, lex vivendi.
"Bear in mind that the more the enemy assaults you, God is closer to your soul." --St. Padre Pio
 
The following users thanked this post: Habitual_Ritual, martin88nyc