My Travel Recommendations Traditional Catholics

[bigbadtrad]

Michael Wilson asked if I'd post on my experiences traveling for any trads thinking of living overseas. I do not post on here anymore but with the thought of many people who are considering living abroad I'd post this to help you and I'll be happy to answer your questions.

I've lived all over the US, Europe & traveled through South America. I've spoke to priests in Oceania, but never in Asia. I don't imagine many people here planning on living in Africa so I'm going to exclude that as well.

My guess is many people want a large traditional priory for societal life and here are the countries I could recommend:
US obviously as there are some large priories. I've lived in St Marys and know Mike Wilson. He's actually a nice guy and yes I would recommend living there as long as people don't imagine everyone and everything is charitable and wonderful. People are in the state of original sin and there are some scandalous activities that can happen there as elsewhere, but also some of the best people I could ever call friend.

I can't comment on France as there are major Mass centers there, but many of the French trads want to leave France because of the massive influx of Muslims, even rural French want to leave. Still there are many great places for nuns and vocations for contemplative men & women. I have a good friend who is a Benedictine and we were blessed to have a nanny from the States who is becoming a nun in France. I personally wouldn't recommend it after speaking to several French people about the changes to their country.

Ireland is ok, the people are wonderful, but there are very few trad families. I enjoy all of my conversations after Mass and find the Irish incredibly nice, probably the nicest in the world. If only there were more Irish trads this would be a grand slam. If you have a young family don't expect to meet many other families with younger children. There are maybe 10 in total in the whole country with more than 4 kids and under the age of 10. I don't see many marriages on the horizon either.

Italy...forget it. very very few families with young kids and a country that's lost its mind. I don't mind the driving, but it would take being used to driving in NYC frequently, which I'm used to from work for dad as a younger man. Very few families there and hard to assimilate. No one wanted to rent to us with 4 kids.

UK... forget it. I find their laws on families too overbearing with how much control the system has. I've met a lot of nice people from there but I don't know enough to comment any further. They have overbearing laws in Ireland but no one enforces them.

SOUTH AMERICA
The only country I've seen for trads is Argentina. Chile has a newer priory in Las Condes but the families there were very scarce and kids were playing hand-held video games during Mass (2 families). The Mass didn't look well attended, it's in a bad area to get to unless you can afford to live in that area which is very expensive.

Argentina has Mendoza which has about 400 people (biggest of any priory I've mentioned so far). They have a priory in La Reja where the seminary is but it's in a bad location to live. Mendoza would be the only area, but Argentina isn't that safe of a country. Every house has barbed wire around it.

Last is Australia & New Zealand.

Australia has a 1,000 person priory in Tynong by the SSPX and the FSSP has a priory in Melbourne. Cost of living is high in Australia, but if you can get employment that matches the cost it's ok, but real estate has skyrocketed. The best area Victoria with Melbourne & Tynong.

Last is Wanganui in New Zealand, about 400-600 people (not sure), but the priest who was there is a great guy but he's transferred to Tynong. Now Fr. Laisney runs the church and the school.

I hope that helps. God bless

[Maximilian]

Thanks for your report. It is very helpful indeed.

Last is Wanganui in New Zealand, about 400-600 people (not sure), but the priest who was there is a great guy but he's transferred to Tynong.

Do you mean Fr. Peek?

[bigbadtrad]

Thanks for your report. It is very helpful indeed.

Last is Wanganui in New Zealand, about 400-600 people (not sure), but the priest who was there is a great guy but he's transferred to Tynong.

Do you mean Fr. Peek?

Fr. Cranshaw. He is a native Kiwi and there for at least 15 years.

[Christe Eleison]

Michael Wilson asked if I'd post on my experiences traveling for any trads thinking of living overseas. I do not post on here anymore but with the thought of many people who are considering living abroad I'd post this to help you and I'll be happy to answer your questions.

I've lived all over the US, Europe & traveled through South America. I've spoke to priests in Oceania, but never in Asia. I don't imagine many people here planning on living in Africa so I'm going to exclude that as well.

My guess is many people want a large traditional priory for societal life and here are the countries I could recommend:
US obviously as there are some large priories. I've lived in St Marys and know Mike Wilson. He's actually a nice guy and yes I would recommend living there as long as people don't imagine everyone and everything is charitable and wonderful. People are in the state of original sin and there are some scandalous activities that can happen there as elsewhere, but also some of the best people I could ever call friend.

I can't comment on France as there are major Mass centers there, but many of the French trads want to leave France because of the massive influx of Muslims, even rural French want to leave. Still there are many great places for nuns and vocations for contemplative men & women. I have a good friend who is a Benedictine and we were blessed to have a nanny from the States who is becoming a nun in France. I personally wouldn't recommend it after speaking to several French people about the changes to their country.

Ireland is ok, the people are wonderful, but there are very few trad families. I enjoy all of my conversations after Mass and find the Irish incredibly nice, probably the nicest in the world. If only there were more Irish trads this would be a grand slam. If you have a young family don't expect to meet many other families with younger children. There are maybe 10 in total in the whole country with more than 4 kids and under the age of 10. I don't see many marriages on the horizon either.

Italy...forget it. very very few families with young kids and a country that's lost it's mind. I don't mind the driving, but it would take being used to driving in NYC frequently, which I'm used to from work for dad as a younger man. Very few families there and hard to assimilate. No one wanted to rent to us with 4 kids.

UK... forget it. I find their laws on families too overbearing with how much control the system has. I've met a lot of nice people from there but I don't know enough to comment any further. They have overbearing laws in Ireland but no one enforces them.

SOUTH AMERICA
The only country I've seen for trads is Argentina. Chile has a newer priory in Las Condes but the families there were very scarce and kids were playing hand-held video games during Mass (2 families). The Mass didn't look well attended, it's in a bad area to get to unless you can afford to live in that area which is very expensive.

Argentina has Mendoza which has about 400 people (biggest of any priory I've mentioned so far). They have a priory in La Reja where the seminary is but it's in a bad location to live. Mendoza would be the only area, but Argentina isn't that safe of a country. Every house has barbed wire around it.

Last is Australia & New Zealand.

Australia has a 1,000 person priory in Tynong by the SSPX and the FSSP has a priory in Melbourne. Cost of living is high in Australia, but if you can get employment that matches the cost it's ok, but real estate has skyrocketed. The best area Victoria with Melbourne & Tynong.

Last is Wanganui in New Zealand, about 400-600 people (not sure), but the priest who was there is a great guy but he's transferred to Tynong. Now Fr. Laisney runs the church and the school.

I hope that helps. God bless

Dear BigBadTrad

It is so great to see you here. I wish you could visit us from time to time
Thanks for the wonderful report. It is very helpful

How long have you been In Ireland? Take good care!

  Wishing you & your loved ones a Blessed Christmastide & many Blessings for 2019!

Thanks to Michael Wilson for bringing you back!

[Traditionallyruralmom]

Thanks for your report. It is very helpful indeed.

Last is Wanganui in New Zealand, about 400-600 people (not sure), but the priest who was there is a great guy but he's transferred to Tynong.

Do you mean Fr. Peek?

Fr Peek is at the Seminary

[Maximilian]

Thanks for your report. It is very helpful indeed.

Last is Wanganui in New Zealand, about 400-600 people (not sure), but the priest who was there is a great guy but he's transferred to Tynong.

Do you mean Fr. Peek?

Fr Peek is at the Seminary

Which seminary?

[Therese]

Thanks for your report. It is very helpful indeed.

Last is Wanganui in New Zealand, about 400-600 people (not sure), but the priest who was there is a great guy but he's transferred to Tynong.

Do you mean Fr. Peek?

Fr Peek is at the Seminary

Which seminary?

Virginia

[Heinrich]

Bad, what do you do for a living?

[Michael Wilson]

Bad, what do you do for a living?

Travel Agent   

[Christe Eleison]

Thank you, BigBadTrad for the wonderful thread & post!

Did you or anyone else here check out Montana? I think there are a couple of devout trad priests that grew up there.

In addition, I saw a documentary that mentioned that Bozeman, Montana would be shielded by a ring of mountains,
from several natural disasters that would be affecting the rest of the country in the decades to come.

Any thoughts on Montana?

[bigbadtrad]

Bad, what do you do for a living?

I teach marketing/online consulting & have a few white label products I actively market as well. It's all online stuff so I can travel anywhere with a good connection.

I should also mention there aren't many non-SSPX priories worldwide. It's pretty much them or bust except in US, France & Germany and they do have a priory in Melbourne and Fr. Rizzo has a church there as well, although I forgot where.

I forgot to mention Germany because it was so conclusive to me no one should move there unless they are getting paid a few million or they want their head examined. The trad schools are forced to read books which are opposed by parents and priests by decree of the gov't. We had 2 nice young woman who stayed with us for a week from the girls school in Germany (I know how it's pronounced but wouldn't dare spell it for fear of correction hahahaha). They told us how bad the books are and the nuns were against the curriculum as well so they force the kids to read them in their senior year. Homeschooling is illegal. They do have good pork though and the people are fun to argue with.

[Tales]

Thank you for this post and thank you Michael Wilson for making it happen.

This confirms what I had suspected - all bad options.  Does anyone have personal experience living in Poland or Russia?

I live in Hong Kong and its ok.  There is one Tridentine Mass once a week in the whole city but its beautiful and the community is very friendly.  We have visits from traveling FSSP priests and are supported by Cardinal Zen, whom offers Mass on Christmas Eve & Easter Sunday.  Homeschooling is legal and the society is friendly, fairly family oriented, at least in the area in which I reside.  The cost of living is enormous and the house sizing microscopic, so you there is a big loss in material quality of living.

What exactly will happen in 2047 is yet unknown, but for now things are fine.  I am mostly trying to figure out if there is any better place for my children to live long term.

[james.rogerson]

There's a diocesan Latin Mass parish in Melbourne, as well as a parish staffed by a former SSPX priest there too. The FSS have a house of formation in Sydney, as well as priories in Canberra and Sydney. Other capital cities in Australia have dedicated Latin Mass parishes. A good number of younger priests in Australia, particularly in country dioceses say the TLM. Tasmania also has a trad Benedictine monastery, and a a trad Carmel is opening up in the diocese of Wilcania Forbes. Considering the population of Australia that's not bad going; I'm not sure it's entirely accurate to suggest that the SSPX are the only show in town.

[Prayerful]

Ireland is ok, the people are wonderful, but there are very few trad families. I enjoy all of my conversations after Mass and find the Irish incredibly nice, probably the nicest in the world. If only there were more Irish trads this would be a grand slam. If you have a young family don't expect to meet many other families with younger children. There are maybe 10 in total in the whole country with more than 4 kids and under the age of 10. I don't see many marriages on the horizon either.

Between diocesan and SSPX locations, I would hold that statement to be exaggerated.

[bigbadtrad]

There's a diocesan Latin Mass parish in Melbourne, as well as a parish staffed by a former SSPX priest there too. The FSS have a house of formation in Sydney, as well as priories in Canberra and Sydney. Other capital cities in Australia have dedicated Latin Mass parishes. A good number of younger priests in Australia, particularly in country dioceses say the TLM. Tasmania also has a trad Benedictine monastery, and a a trad Carmel is opening up in the diocese of Wilcania Forbes. Considering the population of Australia that's not bad going; I'm not sure it's entirely accurate to suggest that the SSPX are the only show in town.

James that's more accurate and I appreciate that. I should have qualified my statements with the following...

I believe in order to live the life you want as a trad and are willing to move to get it you should have a community as you'd probably want your child to have the opportunity to meet people of like mind and not have friends who probably will influence your family unduly. While there are diocesan trad Masses and FSSP priories that exist there is nothing of substance out of the US, France (which aren't big), Germany & Melbourne for non-FSSP & diocesan Masses and they certainly aren't communities and large schools. The last large school the FSSP tried was Maple Hill, KS which imploded and is now a coop of mothers. Fr. Flood is trying to restore it, but it's far away from what it was 6 years ago.

This would equally apply to SSPX priories where there are a lot of faithful but not much community: St. Nicholas in Paris, St. John's Dublin, Vincent Ferrer in KC, etc..

So I disqualified areas with just a traditional Mass and bigger pocket of people. My point is there is no sense of community in those areas, just friends who go to Mass at the same church. Strong friendships, but no one really sees each other much in comparison to the cities I found best: Mendoza, St. Marys, Maple Hill (FSSP), Post Falls, Coeur d'Alene (FSSP), Tynong, and Wanganui and have laws that make it easyish to do the things that don't get you in trouble like homeschooling. Even excluding homeschooling those areas have a sense of community beyond the coffee after Mass.

Hence I excluded cities based on those criteria. If all you are looking for is a trad Mass I'm sure Wikki Missa is best. I did a lot of traveling and research to tell you what I've found as I don't feel home in the US for various considerations I won't say publicly but if you ask privately I'll tell anyone.

Mr. Wilson asked me to give a run-down of what areas could be comparable like a St. Marys. Nothing is like a St Marys for the scope and unique situation, but those are the other smaller versions which have a similar environment.

God bless and thanks for making me clarify.