Is premarital sex rarer among trads?

[Geremia]

Is premarital sex rarer among trads than among Novus Ordites? Has there been a study of this?

Contraceptive use is lower:

The following report of Fr. Kloster's 2018 survey says TLM couples have a 3.6 children fertility rate:

[KreKre]

The problem with that is that you can only survey it indirectly. This chart, for example, does not show that the use of contraception is lower among trads, but you can guess that it probably is, since the approval of contraception is lower, and fertility rate is higher.

These surveys did not ask "do you use contraception?", and if it did, some people would probably be ashamed to admit it, so the numbers would be lower. I suspect the same problem would be with a question like: "did you have sexual intercourse outside of marriage?" It's not a kind of question people like to answer. Sin, especially mortal one, is best revealed under the Sacrament of Confession, where privacy ought to be guaranteed. Not in public surveys. It's a matter between the sinner, the confessor, and God, it does not concern anyone else.

[Geremia]

Yes, such surveys have limitations.
Also, look at the results of what Catholics (and others) think of the acceptability of "casual sex" in open or committed relationships. 😱

[james03]

I have young adult daughters who love nothing more than internet stalking females interested in their brothers.  They love gossip and definitely know what's going on.  I have wept tears of grief leaving marks on my face and endure severe penances on their behalf.

Anyhow, getting on after that intro and literary flair, and considering the limited sample size, I'd say that the number of life-long Trad Catholic female virgins is much greater than 50%.  There is a sizable number of young women who, tired of being used and abused, end up becoming Trads in their mid 20s.  Their virginity rate is much lower than 50%.

NeoCatholic women have virginity rates of around 10% when they get married in my opinion.  Based on statements that the behaviour and beliefs of NeoCatholic women is indistinguishable from secular women.  It might be closer to 5%.

For men, the virginity rate is much higher in all cohorts, though probably around the same in the life-long Trad cohort.

[james03]

The other thing to consider is that most Trad Lasses get married at a reasonable age, instead of waiting until they are older than 25.  This will also result in higher virginity rates.

[Bonaventure]

Amongst men, except for f-ups and 'tists, I'd say no.

[Kaesekopf]

I've never found concupiscence to be diminished by attending a TLM.   

[Geremia]

I've never found concupiscence to be diminished by attending a TLM.   

Really? I have. It and the rosary have helped me master it (not to say that I'm not tempted).

[KreKre]

Attending mass certainly gives one many graces, including the willpower to resist temptations of sexual immorality.

[Francisco Javier]

People at the TLM have reasonable cultural expectations of how to behave leading up to marriage. Novus Ordo people don't really bat an eye if you say you've been dating for 6+ years, while TLM people start gently suggesting you go ring shopping or let the girl go at 6 months (and almost everyone puts a hard cap at 2 years).

People in the TLM also hear suggestions of not being alone together, particularly with alcohol involved, while if you suggested that in Novus Ordo company they'd ridicule you and suggest you lack self control (lol).

Same with the modesty concerns. If you suggest something towards chastity in the NO community, people act like you're a pervert for acknowledging you have a sex drive. It's like how porn has to be one of the most frequent mortal sins, but most NO churches never address it, and charismatic/conservative Catholics will touch the subject of chastity only in a milquetoast manner.

There's also greater practical shame and stigma in the TLM community, which probably prompts people to behave. I expect most novus ordo Catholic girls to have had several sexual partners. You couldn't say at a Novus Ordo Church that it is far better to marry a virgin. You'd be told that's outdated and then get publicly lynched. If you said that at the TLM, you'd probably get told it's impolite to verbalize common sense. Girls at the TLM probably have a real sense that their virtue (or lack thereof) will affect their marriage prospects.

I think TLM people probably also fornicate later on in the relationship, ie they make a mistake after dating for months where both parties desire marriage, so a pregnancy speeds things along to make the now pregnant woman into an honest woman. I actually hate how the Church currently says a pregnancy basically means you can't get married and would be grounds for an annulment. Like half of marriages historically occurred after a belated period prompts the marriage discussion. Are we really going to say all those marriages are invalid? Or that a woman who is pregnant with a child shouldn't live with the father before and after delivering said child? Marry them up and fix the problem if the man is willing to step up.

___________
Not to derail the thread but when u guys recommend asking a girl about her history of being a hoe (or lack thereof)

Too early and it's rude and you're not really entitled to that information. Too late and you've wasted everyone's time.

[drummerboy]

I've never found concupiscence to be diminished by attending a TLM.   

Really? I have. It and the rosary have helped me master it (not to say that I'm not tempted).

That's the point-it never goes away.  Like the young monk who asked the old Desert Father when temptations of the flesh go away, to which the old monk replied "They go away?"

[drummerboy]

As for the question: I'd say it's far more rare than among NO Catholics, but more common than we'd be comfortable admitting.  And much of that may be engaged couples letting things get out of hand inadvertently. 

[KreKre]

Not to derail the thread but when u guys recommend asking a girl about her history of being a hoe (or lack thereof)

Too early and it's rude and you're not really entitled to that information. Too late and you've wasted everyone's time.

I would say that's between God, her, and her confessor. Past sins which were repented are hers to keep secret if she wants to. Of course, if she has any disease, injury, addiction, illegitimate children, some sinful pattern of behavior she can't or doesn't want to change, if she is wanted for some crime, etc... she is required to tell you all of that before you get married. Failure to tell you that will invalidate the marriage. Anything that will objectively negatively impact your marriage.

But past sins, no. It's like being unfaithful in marriage and repenting. It is a mortal sin, of course, but if it is repented and confessed, the offending spouse is not required to let the other know about it. In fact, the confessor might actually advise you to keep it a secret, as that places the burden on the wronged party and causes strife in marriage, which lasts until death.

If she has a public past, that's another matter, she won't be able to hide it. But that should become obvious soon.

[Mushroom]

Not to derail the thread but when u guys recommend asking a girl about her history of being a hoe (or lack thereof)

Too early and it's rude and you're not really entitled to that information. Too late and you've wasted everyone's time.

I would say that's between God, her, and her confessor. Past sins which were repented are hers to keep secret if she wants to. Of course, if she has any disease, injury, addiction, illegitimate children, some sinful pattern of behavior she can't or doesn't want to change, if she is wanted for some crime, etc... she is required to tell you all of that before you get married. Failure to tell you that will invalidate the marriage. Anything that will objectively negatively impact your marriage.

But past sins, no. It's like being unfaithful in marriage and repenting. It is a mortal sin, of course, but if it is repented and confessed, the offending spouse is not required to let the other know about it. In fact, the confessor might actually advise you to keep it a secret, as that places the burden on the wronged party and causes strife in marriage, which lasts until death.

If she has a public past, that's another matter, she won't be able to hide it. But that should become obvious soon.

So if a man or woman wanted to marry a virgin, because they are one, how is that fair if the person that they are dating is hiding information regarding their sexual past? Sorry but when I was in the dating scene before I met my husband, I found that men were more honest about who they've been and I appreciated that. Unless I'm mistaken by your post.

[Geremia]

Failure to tell you that will invalidate the marriage.

Only impediments invalidate marriage (perpetual impotence, already married, too young, refusal to have children, etc.)