Author Topic: Any saints who were seriously evil and depraved before their conversion?  (Read 704 times)

Offline beev_bove_biv

  • Vizekorporal
  • **
  • Posts: 101
  • Thanked: 121 times
  • Religion: Roman Catholic
I mean like really, really bad.
 

Offline Michael Wilson

  • St. Joseph's Workbench
  • Hauptmann
  • ****
  • Posts: 9974
  • Thanked: 9768 times
  • Religion: Catholic
You can read this book by Reverend Alban Goodier "Saints For Sinners"; has some great stories of sinners that became saints.
https://www.sistersofcarmel.com/saints-for-sinners-archbishop-alban-goodier.php
Saint Mary of Egypt was a prostitute that became an anchorite renowned for her penance and purity of life.
There is a saint who's name escapes me, a Virgin who converted a magician that was sent to pervert her, and he along with her became a martyr.
Here below is the story of  "Blessed" Bartolo Longo (1841-1926) A Satanic high priest, that became a Dominican Tertiary and died in the odor of Sanctity:https://dominicanfriars.org/former-satanist-priest-became-saint/
 
"The World Must Conform to Our Lord and not He to it." Rev. Dennis Fahey CSSP

"My brothers, all of you, if you are condemned to see the triumph of evil, never applaud it. Never say to evil: you are good; to decadence: you are progess; to death: you are life. Sanctify yourselves in the times wherein God has placed you; bewail the evils and the disorders which God tolerates; oppose them with the energy of your works and your efforts, your life uncontaminated by error, free from being led astray, in such a way that having lived here below, united with the Spirit of the Lord, you will be admitted to be made but one with Him forever and ever: But he who is joined to the Lord is one in spirit." Cardinal Pie of Potiers
 
The following users thanked this post: Heinrich, maryslittlegarden, Jayne, LausTibiChriste, Lynne, james03, drummerboy, Melkor

Offline Heinrich

  • Steig mal auf den Berg hinauf
  • St. Joseph's Workbench
  • Hauptmann
  • ****
  • Posts: 9818
  • Thanked: 5060 times
  • Gott, wende Dich zu uns und gib uns neues Leben
  • Religion: römisch-katholisch
St. Mary Magdalene.
Schaff Recht mir Gott und führe meine Sache gegen ein unheiliges Volk . . .   .                          
Lex Orandi, lex credendi, lex vivendi.
"Die Welt sucht nach Ehre, Ansehen, Reichtum, Vergnügen; die Heiligen aber suchen Demütigung, Verachtung, Armut, Abtötung und Buße." --Ausschnitt von der Geschichte des Lebens St. Bennos.
 
The following users thanked this post: maryslittlegarden, Michael Wilson

Offline Elizabeth

  • Mary Garden
  • Hauptmann
  • ****
  • Posts: 5266
  • Thanked: 2473 times
This is a really good topic.  Back in maybe 2003-04 SSPX had a calendar of such saints and bios.  I just couldn't believe it, and I wish I'd saved it.  Who knew that so many saints had been heroic in service to Our Lord after repenting.  I really thought they all were special from the get-go.  Wonder how we could find more?

St. Rita of Cortona
St. Mary of Egypt
 
The following users thanked this post: Heinrich, Michael Wilson, Melkor

Offline nmoerbeek

  • Feldwebel
  • ***
  • Posts: 1919
  • Thanked: 1326 times
  • Serve ye the Lord with fear: and rejoice unto him
    • Alleluia Audio Books
  • Religion: Catholic
I mean like really, really bad.

St. Vladimir the Great before his baptism was a bloodthirsty, murderous, pagan who raped his brothers wife after having him murdered.

"Let me, however, beg of Your Beatitude...
not to think so much of what I have written, as of my good and kind intentions. Please look for the truths of which I speak rather than for beauty of expression. Where I do not come up to your expectations, pardon me, and put my shortcomings down, please, to lack of time and stress of business." St. Bonaventure, From the Preface of Holiness of Life.

Apostolate:
http://www.alleluiaaudiobooks.com/
Contributor:
http://unamsanctamcatholicam.blogspot.com/
Lay Association:
http://www.militiatempli.net/
 
The following users thanked this post: Jayne, Michael Wilson

Offline Heinrich

  • Steig mal auf den Berg hinauf
  • St. Joseph's Workbench
  • Hauptmann
  • ****
  • Posts: 9818
  • Thanked: 5060 times
  • Gott, wende Dich zu uns und gib uns neues Leben
  • Religion: römisch-katholisch
St. Paul

St. Boniface the Roman
Schaff Recht mir Gott und führe meine Sache gegen ein unheiliges Volk . . .   .                          
Lex Orandi, lex credendi, lex vivendi.
"Die Welt sucht nach Ehre, Ansehen, Reichtum, Vergnügen; die Heiligen aber suchen Demütigung, Verachtung, Armut, Abtötung und Buße." --Ausschnitt von der Geschichte des Lebens St. Bennos.
 
The following users thanked this post: maryslittlegarden, Larry, Michael Wilson

Offline mikemac

  • Major
  • ****
  • Posts: 10362
  • Thanked: 7340 times
  • Religion: Catholic
 
There is a saint who's name escapes me, a Virgin who converted a magician that was sent to pervert her, and he along with her became a martyr.
 

Possibly Saint Christina?

https://sanctoral.com/en/saints/saint_christina.html


I don't think he was really, really bad, but liked to party too much.  St. Monica prayed for her son St. Augustine for a long time before he converted.

https://www.catholic.org/saints/saint.php?saint_id=1
« Last Edit: May 15, 2022, 08:46:11 PM by mikemac »
Like John Vennari (RIP) said "Why not just do it?  What would it hurt?"
Consecrate Russia to the Immaculate Heart of Mary (PETITION)
https://lifepetitions.com/petition/consecrate-russia-to-the-immaculate-heart-of-mary-petition

"We would be mistaken to think that Fatima’s prophetic mission is complete." Benedict XVI May 13, 2010

"Tell people that God gives graces through the Immaculate Heart of Mary.  Tell them also to pray to the Immaculate Heart of Mary for peace, since God has entrusted it to Her." Saint Jacinta Marto

The real nature of hope is “despair, overcome.”
Source
 
The following users thanked this post: Jayne, Michael Wilson

Offline drummerboy

  • St. Joseph's Workbench
  • Feldwebel
  • ***
  • Posts: 2971
  • Thanked: 890 times
  • Religion: More Catholic than the Pope
I mean like really, really bad.

St. Vladimir the Great before his baptism was a bloodthirsty, murderous, pagan who raped his brothers wife after having him murdered.

Don't forget the Old Testament and David's murder of Uriah to cover his adultery
"Mightier than the sound of many waters, mightier than the surgings of the sea: mighty is the Lord on high"
- Ps 92:4
 
The following users thanked this post: Jayne, Michael Wilson

Offline Elizabeth

  • Mary Garden
  • Hauptmann
  • ****
  • Posts: 5266
  • Thanked: 2473 times
There was that occultist Bongo or something...of course St. Augustine. 
 
The following users thanked this post: Michael Wilson

Offline james03

  • Major
  • ****
  • Posts: 12825
  • Thanked: 8521 times
  • The Brutal Clarity of a Winter Morning
  • Religion: Catholic
St. Augustine

Fr. Andreas Wouters of the Martyrs of Gorkum:

Quote
To be blunt, Andreas Wouters had been a lousy priest.  A drunkard and notorious womanizer,  he had fathered several children.  Suspended from his duties  he was living in disgrace when the Sea Beggars captured Gorkum.  This was his cue to run as far away as possible, based on his past history.  Instead, perhaps understanding that God was giving him maybe his last chance to redeem himself, he volunteered to join the captive priests and brothers.

....  As the noose was being fastened around his neck, his captors kept mocking Father Wouters.  His last words before he entered eternity were:   Fornicator I always was; heretic I never was.
"But he that doth not believe, is already judged: because he believeth not in the name of the only begotten Son of God (Jn 3:18)."

"All sorrow leads to the foot of the Cross.  Weep for your sins."

"Although He should kill me, I will trust in Him"
 
The following users thanked this post: Kaesekopf, maryslittlegarden, Larry, Michael Wilson, Prayerful, Melkor

Offline MaximGun

  • Feldwebel
  • ***
  • Posts: 2277
  • Thanked: 3296 times
  • Religion: Trad Catholic
Really really bad, no.

There are no former sodomite saints. No corrupters of children.  No abortionist saints.  There does appear to be a line which if you cross you are not going to become a saint or even die in a state of grace.  A prostitute in the past cannot be compared to a prostitute in the Western world today. The motive and alternative options for keeping yourself fed are very different.

The idea that really evil people convert simply is not translated into reality.  If there were really really evil people who became saints we would know about it because it makes a more interesting tale.


 

Offline Julio

  • Korporal
  • **
  • Posts: 294
  • Thanked: 238 times
  • Religion: Catholic
^^I think Saint Paul by persecuting and killing the believers of Jesus was really that bad. Killing is a mortal sin in the first place that equals those sinful acts that you mentioned.
 
The following users thanked this post: Jayne, Michael Wilson

Offline Greg

  • St. Joseph's Workbench
  • Major
  • ****
  • Posts: 13911
  • Thanked: 8659 times
I can think of three who caused the loss of millions of souls and never even converted or regretted their actions - as far as we have even 1 iota of evidence for.

Saints are not what they used to be.
 
The following users thanked this post: Lynne, Maximilian

Offline Jayne

  • Mary Garden
  • Major
  • ****
  • Posts: 15946
  • Thanked: 8359 times
  • Comic Sans Frontières
  • Religion: Roman Catholic
There does appear to be a line which if you cross you are not going to become a saint or even die in a state of grace. 

All the evidence suggests that Dr. Bernard Nathanson died in a state of grace. 

He was an abortionist who personally killed thousands of babies, oversaw the murders of tens of thousands more, and, as a founder of NARAL, contributed to the deaths of millions beyond that.

He came to understand the evil that he had done and became active in the Prolife movement.  Eventually he was baptized as a Catholic and remained a Catholic in good standing up to the time of his death.

There is nothing in Catholic teaching about crossing a line beyond the reach of God's grace.  That just somebody's personal opinion which we are free to ignore.  And so we should.

As far as the Church is concerned, anybody can convert.  This is the meaning of the parable of the Vineyard Workers. (Matt 20:1-16)  Those who wasted most of the day and were only hired on to work at the very end of the day still received the full wage.

Corinthians 6: 9-11 contains a (non-exhaustive) list of sins that can be forgiven.

Quote
Know you not that the unjust shall not possess the kingdom of God? Do not err: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, [10] Nor the effeminate, nor liers with mankind, nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor railers, nor extortioners, shall possess the kingdom of God.  And such some of you were; but you are washed, but you are sanctified, but you are justified in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, and the Spirit of our God.

(The phrase "liers with mankind" refers to sodomy.  This sin is explicitly mentioned as one from which people were justified and sanctified, so MG is wrong about this too.)

Whatever we have done, we can be washed, sanctified and justified in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ and the Spirit of our God.  Anyone who said that our sins are too great to be forgiven and told us to give up on salvation would be guilty of counselling despair, itself a serious sin.
Jesus, meek and humble of heart, make my heart like unto Thine.
 
The following users thanked this post: mikemac, orate, Michael Wilson

Offline Bernadette

  • Mary Garden
  • Major
  • ****
  • Posts: 10229
  • Thanked: 5995 times
  • Religion: Roman Catholic
I remember reading that a really bad Nazi commandant went to confession before his execution. That was pretty cool.
"Make merry, and be glad: for this thy brother was dead, and is come to life again; he was lost, and is found."
 
The following users thanked this post: Jayne