For the feast of Saint Thomas Becket

Started by The Harlequin King, December 29, 2013, 02:37:53 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

The Harlequin King

I wrote a summary/book review of John Guy's Thomas Becket: Warrior, Rebel, Saint for today. I only got the first part done, which covers Thomas's youth up to his appointment as a clerk in Theobald, archbishop of Canterbury's household.

Here's the link.

VeraeFidei

HK: I lost my 1954 St. Andrew Missal.

Prior to the Pius XII changes, would Mass today have been of St. Thomas, or of the Sunday within the Octave?

Also, prior to the Pius XII changes, how many Commemorations would have been made today at Mass? Nativity, St. Stephen, St. John, Holy Innocents, and Sunday/St. Thomas? Or limited to 3 Orations?

The Harlequin King

Quote from: VeraeFidei on December 29, 2013, 02:57:40 PM
HK: I lost my 1954 St. Andrew Missal.

Prior to the Pius XII changes, would Mass today have been of St. Thomas, or of the Sunday within the Octave?

Also, prior to the Pius XII changes, how many Commemorations would have been made today at Mass? Nativity, St. Stephen, St. John, Holy Innocents, and Sunday/St. Thomas? Or limited to 3 Orations?

That's a good question. I don't have a pre-55 missal on hand, but most likely, it would have been Sunday within the Octave.

Also not sure about the commemorations, but my guess is 3 only.

VeraeFidei

Quote from: The Harlequin King on December 29, 2013, 03:04:07 PM
Quote from: VeraeFidei on December 29, 2013, 02:57:40 PM
HK: I lost my 1954 St. Andrew Missal.

Prior to the Pius XII changes, would Mass today have been of St. Thomas, or of the Sunday within the Octave?

Also, prior to the Pius XII changes, how many Commemorations would have been made today at Mass? Nativity, St. Stephen, St. John, Holy Innocents, and Sunday/St. Thomas? Or limited to 3 Orations?

That's a good question. I don't have a pre-55 missal on hand, but most likely, it would have been Sunday within the Octave.

Also not sure about the commemorations, but my guess is 3 only.
I just checked Divinum Officium, and they say it would be St. Thomas.

I seem to remember that doubles are limited in the number of Orations they allow...

The Harlequin King

Quote from: VeraeFidei on December 29, 2013, 03:35:31 PM
I just checked Divinum Officium, and they say it would be St. Thomas.

If that's the case, then I'm surprised at the esteem he retained up to 1955 within the Roman calendar.

Archer

Thanks for posting this HK, very interesting. 
"All the good works in the world are not equal to the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass because they are the works of men; but the Mass is the work of God. Martyrdom is nothing in comparison for it is but the sacrifice of man to God; but the Mass is the sacrifice of God for man." - St. John Vianney

VeraeFidei

Quote from: The Harlequin King on December 29, 2013, 03:41:58 PM
Quote from: VeraeFidei on December 29, 2013, 03:35:31 PM
I just checked Divinum Officium, and they say it would be St. Thomas.

If that's the case, then I'm surprised at the esteem he retained up to 1955 within the Roman calendar.
Why's that?

Bonaventure

"If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me."

The Harlequin King

I just posted the second part now, which covers Thomas Becket's service as a clerk under Theobald, archbishop of Canterbury, and Thomas's role in resolving the civil war between King Stephen and Empress Matilda.

Quote from: VeraeFidei on December 29, 2013, 06:24:25 PM
Why's that?

Pope Paul III remarked at the death of Saint John Fisher that he was martyred for a true cause, while Saint Thomas Becket died merely over a property dispute. Whether or not that's true, I haven't written about yet. But since the cult of Becket was exterminated in England after the Reformation, it's hard to imagine it survived long elsewhere in the face of newer and more popular Italian saints.

VeraeFidei

Quote from: Bonaventure on December 29, 2013, 07:49:28 PM
I go to pre-55 and he was commemorated.
I checked Dom Gueranger, and he says that in England and her territories, St. Thomas takes precedence, but otherwise it would be the Sunday within the Octave with a Commemoration of St. Thomas; so Divinum Officium must have England's rubrics - at least on this one.

The Harlequin King

Part III: The King's Right Hand is up now. It concerns Thomas's career as chancellor of England, his policies, and character before the famous appointment to the see of Canterbury.