Forum improvements?

[TerrorDæmonum]

Just to be clear, if banning medical advice were a thing on this forum (and I highly doubt KK would do something like that),

If? A hypothetical addressed at last, plus speculating on what someone might do in such a contingency!

But I agree that such a rule would be a minefield and that is even without the virus or vaccines. It would make baby talk and other related family discussions tricky, not that I take usually part in those.

The spiritual advice on this forum is probably more important to keep in line.

Maybe a little disclaimer in the rules: All users are expected to exercise their own judgement and not use any forum interaction as legal, medical, or spiritual advice.

Or something like that if liability is a concern.

But I think almost everybody who did or did not get vaccinated did so on their own anyway already.

[Jayne]

Just to be clear, if banning medical advice were a thing on this forum (and I highly doubt KK would do something like that), it should also apply to advising people to take a "vaccine" for which there is very little data available.  At least with the medications/supplements people have proposed taking, a person can do research on it, ask a [trustworthy] doctor about it, etc.  With the "vaccine", it's untested and has been out for a year.  How bad side effects are, or how many there are, or how long-lasting they will be, among other things --  all of those things are yet to be determined.

While there are many members telling others not to get vaccinated, I can think of only one who tells people to get vaccinated.  I think the forum would be greatly improved if neither of these things happened, although I don't see it as practical to try to enforce it.

[TerrorDæmonum]

Forum improvement suggestion: if a particular person has been banned multiple times for a grave infraction on the forum, and then repeat it yet again, they should be banned forever. Who invites spam accounts back? Why would other such things be welcomed back?

I know there is a schedule somewhere around here, but there are some things that shouldn't be tolerated: spam, illegal content, obscenities, blasphemies, blatant trolling, etc. They infect the forum and restrict its use.

[TerrorDæmonum]

The medical advice restriction proposal earlier does seem like a good idea for giving or asking for advice on off-label medications for diseases that are subject to a lot of misinformation and conspiracy theories.

At the very least, the forum probably shouldn't have a public record of people pushing or recommending such things to pursue on one's own rather than consulting an actual medical professional of some sort who can direct treatment based on knowledge.

Maybe the Plagues, etc board could be visible only to people logged in. That is just a little box to uncheck on the board's permissions.

[Jayne]

The medical advice restriction proposal earlier does seem like a good idea for giving or asking for advice on off-label medications for diseases that are subject to a lot of misinformation and conspiracy theories.

At the very least, the forum probably shouldn't have a public record of people pushing or recommending such things to pursue on one's own rather than consulting an actual medical professional of some sort who can direct treatment based on knowledge.

I can easily imagine people having a serious outcome from following advice they received here.  They or their families might be in a position to take legal action against the forum in such a situation.  Even if nothing goes wrong people could possibly be charged with unauthorized practice of medicine.  I think it is worth putting some thought into how to avoid this.

[TerrorDæmonum]

The "and if it gets serious, take X" type of posts are the most alarming.

If one is just treating colds at home, then it is usually fine. Try lozenges, try hot baths, try grapefruit, or whatever, and maybe you'll get better a little faster.

But if it is dealing with actual medical emergencies, then the winging it approach, especially when pharmaceuticals, is completely inappropriate for public discussion.

[Miriam_M]

I don't think there's any need to sound alarms.  KK does not pretend to moderate even an informal medical blog.  Participants in many blogs and forums assert authority and knowledge over many areas of self-care:  exercise, nutrition, sleep habits, and choice of medical approach (Eastern, Western, homeopathy, and more).  That doesn't make a forum owner responsible for the outcomes of readers who foolishly, and without consulting their own doctors, take advice from anonymous users.  Members of CI also suggest standard, unusual, untried, experimental, and radical advice for self-care, and I'm sure we would know if the owner had been sued for advice that didn't work or harmed.  Does Youtube get sued for all of those annoying commercials that interrupt talks and sermons and promote so-called singular miracle cures?  I doubt it.  Same for TV.

The Internet is ultimately an uncontrolled or very-difficult-to-control environment.  KK could issue a policy statement about public posts, but that doesn't prevent users from PM'ing each other with authoritarian advice, or emailing each other. Ultimately, decision-making rests with adults and the expectation of using common sense.  No one is being coerced to follow anyone's unlicensed advice. 

[TerrorDæmonum]

Those are good points.

Everybody is free to do what they will.

It is mainly the public appearance of the forum that I think about in this. Part of it is association concerns, but I'm mainly thinking of it as a liability for the owner, but I'm not the owner.

I really do think that this forum's public appearance would be improved by not allowing certain elements of it to be public though. But maybe people who visit have a right to know what they are getting into, although, that can cause even more radical elements to be attracted. If that is what the owner is fine with, I guess I am too.

But it should be understood that what is publicly allowed and promoted here forms the basis for future activity of its current members and prospective members.

[TerrorDæmonum]

There are actually, and do not get them started. They make us all look like idiots.

This is in regard to Flat Earthers.

But the idea that the image of a minority on this forum could reflect poorly on the rest of us is sound.

With that in mind, perhaps the discussions that actively promote the views that traditional Catholics are aligned with extreme political views, conspiracy theories, and other unsavory elements could be regulated to less public boards.

The most sane reaction to those kinds of posts are simply to ignore that, but that seems like acceptance, so one wants to disassociate from them, and that just invites responses, etc. It would be much easier if one did not have to worry about being associated with those views that have nothing to do with the Church. Those kinds of things actually dissuade many people from posting, because they don't want those kinds of responses. So it contributes to the drift towards the extreme, as such views attract like views, and push away others who don't want to deal with it or be associated with it.

[andy]

What about banning naivete.

[TerrorDæmonum]

Suggestion: Change the Site Slogan from the default forum software image.

[Baylee]

I don't think there's any need to sound alarms.  KK does not pretend to moderate even an informal medical blog.  Participants in many blogs and forums assert authority and knowledge over many areas of self-care:  exercise, nutrition, sleep habits, and choice of medical approach (Eastern, Western, homeopathy, and more).  That doesn't make a forum owner responsible for the outcomes of readers who foolishly, and without consulting their own doctors, take advice from anonymous users.  Members of CI also suggest standard, unusual, untried, experimental, and radical advice for self-care, and I'm sure we would know if the owner had been sued for advice that didn't work or harmed.  Does Youtube get sued for all of those annoying commercials that interrupt talks and sermons and promote so-called singular miracle cures?  I doubt it.  Same for TV.

The Internet is ultimately an uncontrolled or very-difficult-to-control environment.  KK could issue a policy statement about public posts, but that doesn't prevent users from PM'ing each other with authoritarian advice, or emailing each other. Ultimately, decision-making rests with adults and the expectation of using common sense.  No one is being coerced to follow anyone's unlicensed advice.

I tend to agree with this, but I would suggest that KK write a general disclaimer somewhere prominent for his own protection.  It can't hurt.  Unless there is one and I just missed it.   

[The Curt Jester]

When people sign up for a forum, there is often a default policy which a person agrees to which includes that posts made on the forum are the views of the individual poster.   I do not remember if SD has that on it, but I wouldn't be surprised if there is one. 

[TerrorDæmonum]

When people sign up for a forum, there is often a default policy which a person agrees to which includes that posts made on the forum are the views of the individual poster.   I do not remember if SD has that on it, but I wouldn't be surprised if there is one. 

Indeed, but it can also be edited. This is what is used here and I  think it is the SMF default. It was written by weasels:

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My commentary on this issue was less about legal liability and more about moral and reputation issues.

If this forum is overrun with Neo-Nazi Homeopathic Feminists, the disclaimer would probably absolve him of legal liability...but it would certainly not erase a possible reputation that could arise from this.

I don't think the current intention is to run a conspiracy theory and an extremist political forum.

[TerrorDæmonum]

Don't think I didn't notice the upgrade to SMF 2.0.19. You may hide sometimes, but I saw it.

In addition to updating software, stickies could use some revamping. A lot of them are very old and probably not viewed anymore.