What are some of the best ways to minimize our time in purgatory or even, God willing, for us to avoid it altogether? Of course, the main thing is to strive to avoid sin as much as possible, and carry our crosses patiently; indulgences are helpful; the Sabbatine privilege promised for consecrating ourselves by the Scapular and reciting the Little Office (Rosary can substitute) is my favorite; https://olrl.org/pray/rosary.shtml I recall reading other means in Fr. Paul Sullivan's booklet. Anybody have this book with them or have other suggestions for us all?
Quote from: Xavier on January 20, 2018, 10:18:43 PM
What are some of the best ways to minimize our time in purgatory or even, God willing, for us to avoid it altogether? Of course, the main thing is to strive to avoid sin as much as possible, and carry our crosses patiently; indulgences are helpful; the Sabbatine privilege promised for consecrating ourselves by the Scapular and reciting the Little Office (Rosary can substitute) is my favorite; https://olrl.org/pray/rosary.shtml I recall reading other means in Fr. Paul Sullivan's booklet. Anybody have this book with them or have other suggestions for us all?
THe Heroic Act of Charity.
http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/07292b.htm
Something that I have been thinking about a lot lately is the importance of doing the duties of one's state of life.
Thanks, Jayne. That's so true.
Thanks, Martin. That's very helpful. If many of us made the Heroic Act of charity, all of us would be better off, more plenary indulgences could be obtained whenever we receive Holy communion, and we could hope for quicker releases from purgatory. I recall there used to be a Tradition of offering 30 Gregorian Masses for the holy souls as well.
In my chapel, they have a prayer card devoted to the Precious Blood. Among other things, the Lord promised "You will be free from the pains of purgatory" to those who say 2 Pater, 2 Aves and 2 Glorias every day for 3 years in honor of His Most Precious Blood.
Avoid purgatory? Simple. Stop sinning.
Quote from: Jayne on January 21, 2018, 07:04:30 AM
Something that I have been thinking about a lot lately is the importance of doing the duties of one's state of life.
Me too. I feel like I spent too much time doing futile things like reading what Pope Francis is up to this time etc.
Give all your goods to feed the poor, and give your body to be burned ... oh wait. :-X
Even Jesus didn't avoid Purgatory.
Quote from: Greg on January 23, 2018, 06:15:38 PM
Even Jesus didn't avoid Purgatory.
I believe he visited there but surely not as a resident.
Quote from: Xavier on January 20, 2018, 10:18:43 PM
What are some of the best ways to minimize our time in purgatory or even, God willing, for us to avoid it altogether? Of course, the main thing is to strive to avoid sin as much as possible, and carry our crosses patiently; indulgences are helpful; the Sabbatine privilege promised for consecrating ourselves by the Scapular and reciting the Little Office (Rosary can substitute) is my favorite; https://olrl.org/pray/rosary.shtml I recall reading other means in Fr. Paul Sullivan's booklet. Anybody have this book with them or have other suggestions for us all?
Here you go, friend :)
How To Avoid Purgatory - Fr. Paul O'Sullivanhttps://www.basilica.ca/documents/2016/10/Fr.%20Paul%20OSullivan-How%20to%20Avoid%20Purgatory.pdf (https://www.basilica.ca/documents/2016/10/Fr.%20Paul%20OSullivan-How%20to%20Avoid%20Purgatory.pdf)
Quote from: martin88nyc on January 20, 2018, 10:30:13 PM
Quote from: Xavier on January 20, 2018, 10:18:43 PM
What are some of the best ways to minimize our time in purgatory or even, God willing, for us to avoid it altogether? Of course, the main thing is to strive to avoid sin as much as possible, and carry our crosses patiently; indulgences are helpful; the Sabbatine privilege promised for consecrating ourselves by the Scapular and reciting the Little Office (Rosary can substitute) is my favorite; https://olrl.org/pray/rosary.shtml I recall reading other means in Fr. Paul Sullivan's booklet. Anybody have this book with them or have other suggestions for us all?
THe Heroic Act of Charity.
http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/07292b.htm
It took me years to find the faith and courage to do so.
I am not entirely sure I understand the logic.
Catholicism is a religion that says suffering is a good thing.
The apostles and martyrs suffered, the saints suffered, we are told to accept suffering, Jesus's suffering is constantly promoted. Why is suffering on the other side of the grave something to avoid?
If you want to avoid Purgatory then avoid sin. Sin offends God. Purgatory doesn't offend Him. He made it. Just do your time there. It's not like you get day longer than necessary.
Quote from: Greg on January 24, 2018, 12:55:03 AM
Why is suffering on the other side of the grave something to avoid?
Because even though Purgatory is a remedy, it is God's Will that we all avoid it. He is in love with us and therefore wants us to enjoy friendship with Him sooner rather than later.
Second, we can do much more good for souls currently suffering on Earth once we are enjoying the Beatific Vision. Purgatory delays our intercession for others.
You can only avoid it by avoiding sin.
If God is worried about delayed intercession. Then why wait eons between Adam and Eve and Jesus's birth to open up Heaven?
In an infinitely long future existence why does time or "delay" ( a function of time) matter? Who is going to notice 1000 years when you exist infinitely in some metaphysical realm?
Thanks, PerEvangelicaDicta, that booklet of Fr. Paul Sullivan is very helpful.
Right, Miriam, the suffering in purgatory is not meritorious for us, as patiently bearing our Cross here on Earth is; God is more pleased when we are ready, if necessary, to undergo purgatorial sufferings and bear trials without grumbing here below to enter union with Him in the beatific vision sooner.
Greg, Our Lord Jesus descended to Limbo and Purgatory only to free the souls detained there. Before His coming, no man saw the face of God, and all were piously waiting for the Messiah to come and deliver them by His suffering, as Isaiah had prophesied. When He went to purgatory, He delivered them by the merits of His Passion and Death. Some souls had been waiting for thousands of years, but nobody could free them until Jesus came for them.
Mary of Agreda tells us.
Quote"the soul of Christ, united to the Divinity, descended to limbo in order to release the holy Fathers from the subterranean prison, where they had been detained since the death of the first just man that had died in expectance of the advent of the Redeemer of the whole human race. By the presence of the most holy Soul this obscure cavern was converted into a heaven and was filled with a wonderful splendor; and to the souls therein contained was imparted the clear vision of the Divinity.
In one instant they passed from the state of long-deferred hope to the possession of glory, and from darkness to the inaccessible light, which they now began to enjoy. All of them recognized their true God and Redeemer, and gave him thanks and glory, breaking forth in canticles of praise saying: "The Lamb that was slain is worthy to receive power and Divinity, and wisdom, and strength, and honor, and glory and benediction. Thou hast redeemed us, Lord, in thy blood, out of every tribe, and tongue, and people, and nation; and hast made us to our God a kingdom and priests, and we shall reign on the earth (Apoc. 59, 12). Thine is, O Lord, the power, thine the reign, and thine is the glory of thy works." Then the Lord commanded the angels to bring all the souls in purgatory, and this was immediately done. As if in earnest of the human Redemption they were absolved then and there by the Redeemer from the punishments still due to them, and they were glorified with the other souls of the just by the beatific vision. Thus on that day of the presence of the King were depopulated the prisonhouses of both limbo and purgatory.
The divine soul of Christ our Redeemer remained in limbo from half past three of Friday afternoon, until after three of the Sunday morning following. During this hour He returned to the Sepulchre as the victorious Prince of the angels and of the saints, whom had delivered from those nether prisons as Spoils of His victory and as an earnest of His glorious triumph over the chastised and prostrate rebels of hell.
In the sepulchre were many angels as its guard, venerating the sacred body united to the Divinity. Some of them, obeying the command of their Queen and Mistress, had gathered the relics of the sacred blood shed by her divine Son, the particles of flesh scattered about, the hair torn from his divine face and head, and all else that belonged to the perfection and integrity of his most sacred humanity. On these the Mother of prudence lavished her solicitous care. The angels took charge of these relics, each one filled with joy at being privileged to hold the particles, which he was able to secure.
Before any change was made, the body of the Redeemer was shown to the holy Fathers, in the same wounded, lacerated and disfigured state in which it was left by the cruelty of the Jews. Beholding Him thus disfigured in death, the Patriarchs and Prophets and other saints adored Him and again confessed Him as the incarnate Word, who had truly taken upon Himself our infirmities and sorrows (Is. 53, 4) and paid abundantly our debts, satisfying in his innocence and guiltlessness for what we ourselves owed to the justice of the eternal Father. There did our first parents Adam and Eve see the havoc wrought by their disobedience, the priceless remedy it necessitated, the immense goodness and mercy of the Redeemer. As they felt the effects of his copious Redemption in the glory of their souls, they praised anew the Omnipotent and Saints of saints, who had with such marvelous wisdom wrought such a salvation."
Yes, I know.
So if God tolerated that for 100,000 years then why would He not tolerate a few extra years each in Purgatory?
After all everyone was in Purgatory then. Even John the Baptist.
Or did Old Testament time mean nothing to God while New Testament time means a lot to Him?
Quote from: Miriam_M on January 24, 2018, 01:07:42 AM
Second, we can do much more good for souls currently suffering on Earth once we are enjoying the Beatific Vision. Purgatory delays our intercession for others.
Thank you Miriam. May I ask, are you of the school that denies that the souls in purgatory may intercede for the living in any way? (even in a primarily passive way by offering up their sufferings)?
The saints seem divided on this issue. But I personally side with Saint Catherine of Bologna and Saint Robert Bellarmine against the view of St. Thomas.
Quote from: St. Columba on January 26, 2018, 08:08:15 AM
Quote from: Miriam_M on January 24, 2018, 01:07:42 AM
Second, we can do much more good for souls currently suffering on Earth once we are enjoying the Beatific Vision. Purgatory delays our intercession for others.
Thank you Miriam. May I ask, are you of the school that denies that the souls in purgatory may intercede for the living in any way? (even in a primarily passive way by offering up their sufferings)?
The saints seem divided on this issue. But I personally side with Saint Catherine of Bologna and Saint Robert Bellarmine against the view of St. Thomas.
Thank you for asking.
:)
I do not have an opinion, and I'm not being coy. I just know that I have been very negligent in my adult life in praying for the souls in Purgatory, and therefore that is where I need to concentrate my efforts. (I prayed for them routinely in childhood because I was instructed to.) I trust in Divine Providence, meaning in this case that the graces I need for my salvation will be delivered, if I sincerely seek them, through whatever means are available. Normally, any prayers of mine not directed to God or Our Mother are directed to the Saints, several in particular. If there are suffering souls also aware of my needs for grace (which I am entirely open to) and in a position to plead for me, I trust that God will use their intentions for good as well. But I just don't know.
Funny that you ask, because in the last several years I have intuited many "messages" from particular deceased loved ones -- my husband and my father -- to pray for other deceased souls, and naturally I do not know from what "location" those pressing calls were coming. I had a very close relationship with my father, and thus it would be logical that he -- wherever he is-- would want to engage me.
God be with you.
Quote from: Miriam_M on January 26, 2018, 10:28:09 AM
Quote from: St. Columba on January 26, 2018, 08:08:15 AM
Quote from: Miriam_M on January 24, 2018, 01:07:42 AM
Second, we can do much more good for souls currently suffering on Earth once we are enjoying the Beatific Vision. Purgatory delays our intercession for others.
Thank you Miriam. May I ask, are you of the school that denies that the souls in purgatory may intercede for the living in any way? (even in a primarily passive way by offering up their sufferings)?
The saints seem divided on this issue. But I personally side with Saint Catherine of Bologna and Saint Robert Bellarmine against the view of St. Thomas.
Thank you for asking.
:)
I do not have an opinion, and I'm not being coy. I just know that I have been very negligent in my adult life in praying for the souls in Purgatory, and therefore that is where I need to concentrate my efforts. (I prayed for them routinely in childhood because I was instructed to.) I trust in Divine Providence, meaning in this case that the graces I need for my salvation will be delivered, if I sincerely seek them, through whatever means are available. Normally, any prayers of mine not directed to God or Our Mother are directed to the Saints, several in particular. If there are suffering souls also aware of my needs for grace (which I am entirely open to) and in a position to plead for me, I trust that God will use their intentions for good as well. But I just don't know.
Funny that you ask, because in the last several years I have intuited many "messages" from particular deceased loved ones -- my husband and my father -- to pray for other deceased souls, and naturally I do not know from what "location" those pressing calls were coming. I had a very close relationship with my father, and thus it would be logical that he -- wherever he is-- would want to engage me.
God be with you.
Thank you Miriam for your touching post. :)
At Holy Mass today (CandleMass, First Friday), I saw the prayer Our Lord Jesus taught St. Gertrude the Great, "Eternal Father, I offer you the Precious Blood of Your Divine Son, Jesus, in union with all the Holy Masses said throughout the world today, for all the holy souls in purgatory, for sinners everywhere, sinners in the universal Church, those in my own home and family" assuring her she would release some souls each time she said it. The prayer card said, Say 3 times before Mass. We can say it frequently throughout the day and we would give the best possible assistance to the holy souls by this means, that the blood of Jesus may wash away the stains of sin that remain in them, and put out the flames of purgatory for them.
Another good prayer Jesus recommended to a holy sister for the holy souls was "Eternal Father, we offer you the Holy Wounds of Our Lord Jesus Christ to heal the wounds of our souls" telling her specifically, "When offering my wounds to the Father for sinners, you must not forget to offer them especially for the holy souls in purgatory. The Holy Wounds are the Treasure of treasures for the souls in purgatory." These and other prayers can be offered for them. The holy souls in purgatory can pray for us also, and St. Thomas doesn't really deny it, but it seems fitting, given the severity of their suffering, we pray much before asking for their prayers, by means of which we can receive many blessings, as many Saints testify.
Finally, St. Margaret Mary, to whom the Sacred Heart was revealed, was one of the first to make the heroic act of charity in favor of the holy souls. At death, the devil came to tempt her saying falsely and lying to her that because she had sacrificed much for others, nothing remained for her. Then Our Lord appeared, drove the father of lies away, and multiplied the Saint's merits manifold and took her to heaven. So it will be for others who, out of love for God and neighbor, make the heroic vow for the souls in purgatory.
St. Pio said "the souls in Purgatory pray for us, and their prayers are even more effective than ours, because they are accompanied by their suffering. So, let's pray for them, and let's pray them to pray for us."
I think part of the way to do so is to familiarize oneself with the Raccolta and the Enchirdion of Indulgences. Knowing what acts are indulgence'd, and doing them out of a spirit of love for God and reparation to Him is important.
Example, IIRC, is that reading the Bible for 30 minutes is a plenary. Do that and go to Mass, and boom. All of these little habits and things can help incline us to love God more.
Which then goes into Greg's point about avoiding sin. If we can love God more, we can avoid sin more easily.
Quote from: Greg on January 24, 2018, 03:30:26 PM
Yes, I know.
So if God tolerated that for 100,000 years then why would He not tolerate a few extra years each in Purgatory?
After all everyone was in Purgatory then. Even John the Baptist.
Or did Old Testament time mean nothing to God while New Testament time means a lot to Him?
First off before Christ died on the cross, there were lots of people who didn't go to Purgatory they resided in a place call Patristic Limbo or the Limbo of the Fathers where there was no suffering.
Time as regards Purgatory is just a reference for us humans to have some way of relating to Purgatory. When we die time ceases for us. The time assigned for indulgences is to give us some understanding of the efficacy of our works.
I know one thing for sure we don't want to rely on NO Catholics to get any of us out purgatory...
Time in purgatory is a given for me. It's going in that direction anyway. I keep doing what I shouldn't and certainly do not spend my time in reparation as I should. There are a few things husband and I have been incorporating in our day, in effort to minimize our sufferings in purgatory. But the time we have wasted, is a crime in itself, though we do continue to remain hopeful and plug away at it.
There is one way I myself can hope will be useful. Brother ass. Yep, my body. If I can just carry the crosses God sends me with complete resignation and without complaining, it may chip off a small fraction of my purgatory time. Dealing with annoying things like brain damage, palsy, loss of balance, Fake joints, is a gift to me because I am somewhat lazy and a poor sacrificer ( if that's even a word). I go in spurts. I may be all gung ho for a while, then slip back into my default setting. God knows me so well, ands sends these gifts for my benefit. He does this for MANY of us and to me, it's a kindness, truly. I am grateful. Having so much I'm not good at, but sincerely do wish to improve in, I still have things to offer up. Brother ass is hard, but others have it so much harder, as we all know very well. I just have to keep my mouth shut and pray, offer up. Not trying to make it sound easy. It's not. But again, if I do it well in this life, it may serve me well in the next. At the same time I want to start incorporating some of the useful suggestions in this good thread.
Quote from: PerEvangelicaDicta on January 23, 2018, 11:12:34 PM
Quote from: Xavier on January 20, 2018, 10:18:43 PM
What are some of the best ways to minimize our time in purgatory or even, God willing, for us to avoid it altogether? Of course, the main thing is to strive to avoid sin as much as possible, and carry our crosses patiently; indulgences are helpful; the Sabbatine privilege promised for consecrating ourselves by the Scapular and reciting the Little Office (Rosary can substitute) is my favorite; https://olrl.org/pray/rosary.shtml I recall reading other means in Fr. Paul Sullivan's booklet. Anybody have this book with them or have other suggestions for us all?
Here you go, friend :)
How To Avoid Purgatory - Fr. Paul O'Sullivan
https://www.basilica.ca/documents/2016/10/Fr.%20Paul%20OSullivan-How%20to%20Avoid%20Purgatory.pdf (https://www.basilica.ca/documents/2016/10/Fr.%20Paul%20OSullivan-How%20to%20Avoid%20Purgatory.pdf)
KK sent me this little booklet last year, when I purchased some other books from him (he included it as a bonus). I guess he thought I could use all the help I could get ;) Anyway, the number one tip in the book is....stop sinning. I've come to the conclusion that avoiding Purgatory is probably something I'm not called to. Thanks a lot ,KK! :P
Quote from: Carleendiane on April 21, 2018, 09:14:56 PM
Time in purgatory is a given for me. It's going in that direction anyway. I keep doing what I shouldn't and certainly do not spend my time in reparation as I should. There are a few things husband and I have been incorporating in our day, in effort to minimize our sufferings in purgatory. But the time we have wasted, is a crime in itself, though we do continue to remain hopeful and plug away at it.
There is one way I myself can hope will be useful. Brother ass. Yep, my body. If I can just carry the crosses God sends me with complete resignation and without complaining, it may chip off a small fraction of my purgatory time. Dealing with annoying things like brain damage, palsy, loss of balance, Fake joints, is a gift to me because I am somewhat lazy and a poor sacrificer ( if that's even a word). I go in spurts. I may be all gung ho for a while, then slip back into my default setting. God knows me so well, ands sends these gifts for my benefit. He does this for MANY of us and to me, it's a kindness, truly. I am grateful. Having so much I'm not good at, but sincerely do wish to improve in, I still have things to offer up. Brother ass is hard, but others have it so much harder, as we all know very well. I just have to keep my mouth shut and pray, offer up. Not trying to make it sound easy. It's not. But again, if I do it well in this life, it may serve me well in the next. At the same time I want to start incorporating some of the useful suggestions in this good thread.
i see what you are saying.
i dont think ive gone a day (or even an hour) without complaiing in some way. sometimes its hard to see the line between complaining and informing caregivers about things that arent right. like "i cant feel my foot" or "my right foot seems higher than my left foot" or "i feel like im going to fall off the bed" i'm sure they think i'm crazy but my body feels all uneven and the way they position me feels all awkward and unnatural...but here i am complaining
I get frustrated with God because he gave me the life he gave me yet expects me to never complain. When you read stories about saints like st gemma galgani and st servulus they never once complained. I think I read that complaining negates all spiritual good that can come from offering it up, which is why I find it hard to even try to offer it up anymore--as soon as i offer it up i say something through my AAC that could be construed as complaining or i post something here or elsewhere about how much life sucks....but there's nothing good in life to report. so the only alternative seems to be a vow of silence which would make an awful lot of people very happy i suppose.
it's hard to keep trying not to complain because this really seems like more than I can handle and it takes a lot of effort to reign it in even WITH the complaining. I worry all the time that despite suffering, I will have MORE purgatory time than someone who had an easy life because of all the complaining. and that's if I don't just go straight to hell.
Quote from: MundaCorMeum on April 21, 2018, 09:44:49 PM
Quote from: PerEvangelicaDicta on January 23, 2018, 11:12:34 PM
Quote from: Xavier on January 20, 2018, 10:18:43 PM
What are some of the best ways to minimize our time in purgatory or even, God willing, for us to avoid it altogether? Of course, the main thing is to strive to avoid sin as much as possible, and carry our crosses patiently; indulgences are helpful; the Sabbatine privilege promised for consecrating ourselves by the Scapular and reciting the Little Office (Rosary can substitute) is my favorite; https://olrl.org/pray/rosary.shtml I recall reading other means in Fr. Paul Sullivan's booklet. Anybody have this book with them or have other suggestions for us all?
Here you go, friend :)
How To Avoid Purgatory - Fr. Paul O'Sullivan
https://www.basilica.ca/documents/2016/10/Fr.%20Paul%20OSullivan-How%20to%20Avoid%20Purgatory.pdf (https://www.basilica.ca/documents/2016/10/Fr.%20Paul%20OSullivan-How%20to%20Avoid%20Purgatory.pdf)
KK sent me this little booklet last year, when I purchased some other books from him (he included it as a bonus). I guess he thought I could use all the help I could get ;) Anyway, the number one tip in the book is....stop sinning. I've come to the conclusion that avoiding Purgatory is probably something I'm not called to. Thanks a lot ,KK! [emoji14]
I do my best, munda!
Christ DID say to be perfect as His Heavenly Father is perfect, though... ;)
Sent from my STV100-1 using Tapatalk
Quote from: MundaCorMeum on April 21, 2018, 09:44:49 PM
Quote from: PerEvangelicaDicta on January 23, 2018, 11:12:34 PM
Quote from: Xavier on January 20, 2018, 10:18:43 PM
What are some of the best ways to minimize our time in purgatory or even, God willing, for us to avoid it altogether? Of course, the main thing is to strive to avoid sin as much as possible, and carry our crosses patiently; indulgences are helpful; the Sabbatine privilege promised for consecrating ourselves by the Scapular and reciting the Little Office (Rosary can substitute) is my favorite; https://olrl.org/pray/rosary.shtml I recall reading other means in Fr. Paul Sullivan's booklet. Anybody have this book with them or have other suggestions for us all?
Here you go, friend :)
How To Avoid Purgatory - Fr. Paul O'Sullivan
https://www.basilica.ca/documents/2016/10/Fr.%20Paul%20OSullivan-How%20to%20Avoid%20Purgatory.pdf (https://www.basilica.ca/documents/2016/10/Fr.%20Paul%20OSullivan-How%20to%20Avoid%20Purgatory.pdf)
KK sent me this little booklet last year, when I purchased some other books from him (he included it as a bonus). I guess he thought I could use all the help I could get ;) Anyway, the number one tip in the book is....stop sinning. I've come to the conclusion that avoiding Purgatory is probably something I'm not called to. Thanks a lot ,KK! :P
I purchased the same one from Amazon, but in my case it might have been dymphna17 who told me about it.
:)
Quote from: Miriam_M on April 22, 2018, 12:47:39 AM
Quote from: MundaCorMeum on April 21, 2018, 09:44:49 PM
Quote from: PerEvangelicaDicta on January 23, 2018, 11:12:34 PM
Quote from: Xavier on January 20, 2018, 10:18:43 PM
What are some of the best ways to minimize our time in purgatory or even, God willing, for us to avoid it altogether? Of course, the main thing is to strive to avoid sin as much as possible, and carry our crosses patiently; indulgences are helpful; the Sabbatine privilege promised for consecrating ourselves by the Scapular and reciting the Little Office (Rosary can substitute) is my favorite; https://olrl.org/pray/rosary.shtml I recall reading other means in Fr. Paul Sullivan's booklet. Anybody have this book with them or have other suggestions for us all?
Here you go, friend :)
How To Avoid Purgatory - Fr. Paul O'Sullivan
https://www.basilica.ca/documents/2016/10/Fr.%20Paul%20OSullivan-How%20to%20Avoid%20Purgatory.pdf (https://www.basilica.ca/documents/2016/10/Fr.%20Paul%20OSullivan-How%20to%20Avoid%20Purgatory.pdf)
KK sent me this little booklet last year, when I purchased some other books from him (he included it as a bonus). I guess he thought I could use all the help I could get ;) Anyway, the number one tip in the book is....stop sinning. I've come to the conclusion that avoiding Purgatory is probably something I'm not called to. Thanks a lot ,KK! :P
I purchased the same one from Amazon, but in my case it might have been dymphna17 who told me about it.
:)
it's actually a great little book. I've enjoyed it so far.
Quote from: Greg on January 23, 2018, 06:15:38 PM
Even Jesus didn't avoid Purgatory.
He went to the Limbo of the Fathers to release their souls.
Quote from: St.Justin on April 22, 2018, 07:53:31 AM
Quote from: Greg on January 23, 2018, 06:15:38 PM
Even Jesus didn't avoid Purgatory.
He went to the Limbo of the Fathers to release their souls.
True, but the difference of course was he went there to visit, to release souls, not take up residence like I will me doing.
:-\
Quote from: Carleendiane on April 22, 2018, 08:00:07 AM
Quote from: St.Justin on April 22, 2018, 07:53:31 AM
Quote from: Greg on January 23, 2018, 06:15:38 PM
Even Jesus didn't avoid Purgatory.
He went to the Limbo of the Fathers to release their souls.
True, but the difference of course was he went there to visit, to release souls, not take up residence like I will me doing.
:-\
The real difference of course is that in purgatory and the Limbo of the Fathers is that there is no suffering in either the Limbo of the Fathers or the Limbo of the Innocents, unbaptized babies..
Pray every day for the grace of a happy death and don't be shy about being quite specific in your prayer. Just add this petition into your morning offering where it is certain to be prayed for every day and (hopefully) have the greatest influence. Pray that you be delivered from a sudden and unprovided death. Pray that God provide for you a holy Roman Catholic priest to give you the Last Rites and all the blessings of the Church for the dying before you die and that you receive them with the proper disposition - do this and you will have done what you can to avoid purgatory completely and go directly to heaven when you draw your last breath. This is my plan to avoid purgatory.
Read my sig and more about that here (https://www.suscipedomine.com/forum/index.php?topic=12271.msg265480;topicseen#msg265480).
Quote from: Carleendiane on April 21, 2018, 09:14:56 PM
Time in purgatory is a given for me. It's going in that direction anyway. I keep doing what I shouldn't and certainly do not spend my time in reparation as I should. There are a few things husband and I have been incorporating in our day, in effort to minimize our sufferings in purgatory. But the time we have wasted, is a crime in itself, though we do continue to remain hopeful and plug away at it.
There is one way I myself can hope will be useful. Brother ass. Yep, my body. If I can just carry the crosses God sends me with complete resignation and without complaining, it may chip off a small fraction of my purgatory time. Dealing with annoying things like brain damage, palsy, loss of balance, Fake joints, is a gift to me because I am somewhat lazy and a poor sacrificer ( if that's even a word). I go in spurts. I may be all gung ho for a while, then slip back into my default setting. God knows me so well, ands sends these gifts for my benefit. He does this for MANY of us and to me, it's a kindness, truly. I am grateful. Having so much I'm not good at, but sincerely do wish to improve in, I still have things to offer up. Brother ass is hard, but others have it so much harder, as we all know very well. I just have to keep my mouth shut and pray, offer up. Not trying to make it sound easy. It's not. But again, if I do it well in this life, it may serve me well in the next. At the same time I want to start incorporating some of the useful suggestions in this good thread.
Carleen, if you like, you can incorporate the Precious Blood devotion suggested in the OP. It's something simple that God asked of all of us, and the rewards are very great. To say 2 Paters, 2 Aves, 2 Glorias in honor of His precious blood every day for 3 years. I've tried for a few months, but then I mess up and have to start again. : ) imo, we can go beyond the minimum, and say 10 and offer it up for others. God will pour down blessings on us to the extent we have loved and desired blessings for our neighbor. After the 3 years, we can continue it for our loved ones.
St. Gertrude's prayer for the holy souls is also a simple way to liberate souls from purgatory. We can pray it many times a day, especially before Mass, offering up the precious blood and the grace of all the world's Masses for the holy souls. The more souls we liberate, the more souls will pray for us in the hour of our own death. If we seriously resolve to help save just 1 souls a day, we will have more than 10,000 souls specially interceding for us after just 30 years. If we make the heroic act, as Martin mentioned, we receive an indulgence applicable to the holy souls each time we go for confession and communion. "The Heroic Act has been enriched with numerous indulgences by Benedict XIII (1728), Pius VI (1788), and Pius IX (1852). Priests who make it receive the personal privilege of gaining a plenary indulgence for a soul of their choice each time they say Mass (see PRIVILEGED ALTAR). Laymen gain a similar indulgence each time they receive Holy Communion"
Indulgences are also great, as KK mentioned; frequenting the sacraments with devotion will itself minimize purgatory. Confession removes mortal sin; Holy communion inflames charity and removes venial sin; it protects us from future mortal sin. The Way of the Cross and Rosary are among the most heavily indulgenced prayers. We can gain indulgences for the souls in purgatory every day, and will be richly repaid by God, when it is our turn to enter eternity.
http://www.catholictradition.org/Christ/holy-wounds2.htm
QuoteThe Holy Wounds and the Holy Souls
BAR
Devotion to the Drops of Blood Lost by our Lord Jesus Christ on His Way to Calvary
St. Elizabeth, Queen of Hungary, with St. Matilda and St. Bridget, wishing to know something of the Passion of Jesus Christ, offered fervent and special prayers. upon which Our Lord revealed to them:
To all the faithful who shall recite for 3 years, each day, 2 Our Fathers, 2 Hail Marys and 2 Glory Bes in honor of the drops of Blood I lost, I will concede the following 5 graces:
1st: The plenary indulgence and remittance of your sins.
2nd: You will be free from the pains of Purgatory.
3rd: If you should die before completing the said 3 years, for you it will be the same as if you had completed them.
4th: It will be upon your death the same as if you had shed all your blood for the Holy Faith.
5th: I will descend from Heaven to take your soul and that of your relatives, until the fourth generation.
Blessed by His Holiness Pope Leo XIII in Rome, April 5, 1890.
Please keep this prayer card with others that you say daily to remind you to recite these prayers.
The thought of saving souls should always be on our mind. St. John Bosco stated it well. "There is nothing more holy in this world than to work for the good of souls, for whose salvation Jesus Christ poured out the last drops of His blood." St. Vincent de Paul tells us that: "The salvation of men and our own are so great a good that they merit to be obtained at any price."
Sad to say, the great majority of Catholics put forth little or no effort in promoting the greater honor and glory of God and the salvation of souls. Let us keep in mind that if we manage to save one soul, we also ensure the salvation of our own. The Holy Ghost reveals this to us in the Holy Bible. [St. James 5: 19-20]
This little practice gives us a very easy way to save our own soul as well as the ones most dear to us------our family.
I would say live a complete Catholic life. Don't try to take a scalpel and find the magic formula. Avoiding sin and increasing in Virtue are an iterative process. As you avoid sin, you open yourself up to Grace. As you grow in virtue, you detest sin more and more.
Acts of Charity count for a lot. Every day think about adding value to society and individuals.
Then there are the aids like the Scapula and indulgences.
Go for the complete package and you will be better off than trying to find the magical formula to stay out of Purgatory.
By the way, I commend this question. It is better to have as our goal to stay out of Purgatory than to stay out of hell. Set your standards high.
I caught hell on another thread from others on this site about this very topic. That reparation for the temporal effects of sin so as to mitigate one's purgatory or convert others is not possible to do or is even necessary.
The general consensus from others was that there's no way to make reparation to God for the temporal effects of my sins that remain after confession, or for the sins of others. All that's required is restitution (like repaying after stealing.) Nothing more is necessary because Jesus paid on the cross for every sin ever committed. It's okay, don't worry, I can be saved by faith.
Well, I reject that idea as not Catholic. Sounds Protestant.
So here's what my mama taught me as a kid on how to avoid or minimize purgatory. To my knowledge, this hasn't been rescinded:
1. Martyrdom
2. Avoiding the near occasion of sin.
3. Frequent confession and sacraments.
4. Keeping custody of my 5 senses and personal modesty.
5. Daily prayer and fasting for myself and others' petitions throughout the year.
6. First Friday or First Saturday devotions.
7. Plenary indulgences: a holy hour followed by communion and confession within 24 hours.
8. Wearing the brown scapular.
9. Offering up my daily trials, tribulations, grief, and hardships without complaining.
10. Giving alms throughout the year.
Please see my response on that other thread: https://www.suscipedomine.com/forum/index.php?topic=19798.msg442307#msg442307
It is certainly TRUE that Christ paid the full price for our sins (His sacrifice WAS Infinite). But He also asks us (and often requires us) to join in His suffering and reparation.
I think "don't worry, I can be saved by faith" refers more to the Protestant idea that we can SIN as much as we like, and still be saved. The Catholic truth is that we (as a rule) must also SUFFER (or someone must suffer for us), or do the things that you listed, in order to reduce Purgatory - protestants of course don't believe in Purgatory.
But in general your post does a good job of describing what is needed to reduce Purgatory.
Quote from: Xavier on February 02, 2018, 08:50:38 AM
At Holy Mass today (CandleMass, First Friday), I saw the prayer Our Lord Jesus taught St. Gertrude the Great, "Eternal Father, I offer you the Precious Blood of Your Divine Son, Jesus, in union with all the Holy Masses said throughout the world today, for all the holy souls in purgatory, for sinners everywhere, sinners in the universal Church, those in my own home and family" assuring her she would release some souls each time she said it. The prayer card said, Say 3 times before Mass. We can say it frequently throughout the day and we would give the best possible assistance to the holy souls by this means, that the blood of Jesus may wash away the stains of sin that remain in them, and put out the flames of purgatory for them.
Another good prayer Jesus recommended to a holy sister for the holy souls was "Eternal Father, we offer you the Holy Wounds of Our Lord Jesus Christ to heal the wounds of our souls" telling her specifically, "When offering my wounds to the Father for sinners, you must not forget to offer them especially for the holy souls in purgatory. The Holy Wounds are the Treasure of treasures for the souls in purgatory." These and other prayers can be offered for them. The holy souls in purgatory can pray for us also, and St. Thomas doesn't really deny it, but it seems fitting, given the severity of their suffering, we pray much before asking for their prayers, by means of which we can receive many blessings, as many Saints testify.
Finally, St. Margaret Mary, to whom the Sacred Heart was revealed, was one of the first to make the heroic act of charity in favor of the holy souls. At death, the devil came to tempt her saying falsely and lying to her that because she had sacrificed much for others, nothing remained for her. Then Our Lord appeared, drove the father of lies away, and multiplied the Saint's merits manifold and took her to heaven. So it will be for others who, out of love for God and neighbor, make the heroic vow for the souls in purgatory.
St. Pio said "the souls in Purgatory pray for us, and their prayers are even more effective than ours, because they are accompanied by their suffering. So, let's pray for them, and let's pray them to pray for us."
My brother says the first one everyday.
our lady pretty much told St Francisco at Fatima what he needed to do to avoid purgatory
"Will Francisco go to heaven" - our lady "he shall, but FIRST he must have to say MANY rosaries"
He was like 9 from a devout family and still had to do lots to get straight to heaven :'(
I think the rosary is your answer...
What detains us in Purgatory after our death? Here is Rev. Ernest Mura Religious of St. Vincent De Paul, in his book: "The Nature of the Mystical Body" pgs. 248-249
QuoteThe principal cause of the torment of the expiating souls is their remoteness from God...This is not because there remains even the slightest sin in them. Every sin, as far as guilt is concerned, has been fully retracted and wiped out in the first instant after death. These souls are now in the light, and through grace have adhered totally to God their sovereign Good from the instant of their exit from this world. Hence, they completely retract any slight attachments and self satisfactions they may still have held during their mortal life.....Nevertheless, after the remission of guilt, of the offense against the divine Majesty, these souls must still pay the debt contracted by them against the justice of God. They must still expiate the temporal punishment that re-establishes the divine order which has been disturbed by sin. This debt keeps them far from God. St. Catherine of Genoa writes on this subject: "Inasmuch as the souls in Purgatory are free from the guilt of sin, there is no other impediment between God and them than this punishment that has held them back, so that the instinct [of beatitude] has been unable to attain its perfection......
St. Thomas says this clearly, in answer to the following objection against prayer for the deceased: Souls are said to be held in Purgatory so that they may be purified. Now these suffrages do not produce anything in them that effect this purification; therefore they are useless. To which he answeres: " The Purification of the soul by the punishment of Purgatory is nothing else than the expiation of the guilt that hinders it from obtaining glory." (Summa Sup. q.71, a.6 ad 3).
Obviously, the best way to wipe out the temporal debt incurred by our sins; and therefore to shorten and avoid Purgatory; is to assist frequently at Mass and receive Holy Communion also frequently.
When you see the Beatific Vision for an infinity of time, then what does it matter whether you spend 10,000 years in Purgatory or 5 minutes?
In a bazillion years it will all be water under the bridge. Infinity divided by 10000 is the same as Infinity divided by 0.0001
Quote from: Greg on July 25, 2018, 10:08:11 PM
When you see the Beatific Vision for an infinity of time, then what does it matter whether you spend 10,000 years in Purgatory or 5 minutes?
In a bazillion years it will all be water under the bridge. Infinity divided by 10000 is the same as Infinity divided by 0.0001
That's the horrible thing about time, though. The thought of eternity doesn't quite rescue you from it. Our Lord knew He was going to be resurrected and ascend into heaven soon, but that didn't stop Him sweating blood in the garden before His passion. And burning alive isn't any less horrible because you know it will be over very soon.
Quote from: Carleendiane on April 21, 2018, 09:14:56 PM
Time in purgatory is a given for me. It's going in that direction anyway. I keep doing what I shouldn't and certainly do not spend my time in reparation as I should. There are a few things husband and I have been incorporating in our day, in effort to minimize our sufferings in purgatory. But the time we have wasted, is a crime in itself, though we do continue to remain hopeful and plug away at it.
There's a touching part in St. Thérèse's diary where she talks about the nuns discussing purgatory. One of the nuns says that she knows she'll be spending time in purgatory, and St. Thérèse iirc tells her not to be so grim and to trust in God's mercy. That nun soon dies and appears to St. Thérèse, telling Thérèse to pray for her because she is indeed in purgatory. The moral that St. Thérèse draws from this is that God gives us what we ask for, and we should not stifle charity and prevent ourselves from asking for the greater gifts. St. Thérèse expresses her desire to never go to purgatory, solely through the mercy of God.
Personally, I have no intention of going to purgatory either. I'm certainly not resigning myself to spending a long period of time there. Apart from the brown scapular and indulgences, I just don't want to go there and I'll periodically remind Our Lord of that fact. I don't think it's so much about "plugging away at it" as simply hoping that God in His love will let you off. In my opinion, purgatory is for the chronically lax, not for people like me who actually want to go to heaven. That's not to say I don't deserve it, because I probably deserve it more than most; just that I have a greater expectation that God will indulge me.
Quote from: JamesBy the way, I commend this question. It is better to have as our goal to stay out of Purgatory than to stay out of hell. Set your standards high.
Well, Thanks.
QuoteGo for the complete package and you will be better off than trying to find the magical formula to stay out of Purgatory.
Of course, this is absolutely true. Part of the complete package in my opinion: (1) frequently and devoutly preparing for and participating in Holy Mass, Holy Communion, Eucharistic Adoration, and Divine Office if possible, beside Scripture reading, as Kaesekopf mentioned; (2) to practice all the Devotions, Rosary, Scapular, Little Office, Way of the Cross, Precious Blood and Holy Wounds devotions, beside others I may have forgotten, and (3) make every possible effort, with the help of grace, never to commit especially mortal - which grace always makes possible - but even venial sin again, or at least to do so as rarely as possible. Lauermar's list of top 10 things to do is also just wonderful imo. Thanks to Non Nobis, Sophia, Michael and John also for the tips and responses.
But if Jesus makes a promise to us, and the Vicar of Christ or the Successors of the Apostles have placed their seal of authority attesting it, I think it's a mistake to doubt or be uncertain of the fulfilment of that promise - look at the Sabbatine privilege. Before Vatican II, Catholics knew if you wore the Scapular devoutly, practiced chastity according to your state of life, and recited the Little Office Daily, you would be delivered from Purgatory the First Saturday after your death - this is Mary's promise, attested by the Vicars of Christ. But modernists attempt to cast doubt on it or call it into question, and Catholic devotion catastrophically suffers as a result. Far fewer try praying the Little Office now. And they do many such things, and it's a mistake imho. Combined with the other Scapular promise, wearing it and being consecrated to Jesus through Mary by the Scapular will help all Catholic Christians avoid both hell and purgatory.
Quote"The devils revealed to Francis of Yepes, the brother of St. John of the Cross that three things especially tormented them. The first is the NAME OF JESUS; the second, the NAME OF MARY; and third, THE BROWN SCAPULAR OF OUR LADY OF MOUNT CARMEL. "Take off that habit," they cried to him, "which snatches too many souls from us. All those clothed in it die piously and escape us."...
Our Lady revealed to Venerable Dominic of Jesus and Mary: "Although many wear my Scapular, only a few fulfill conditions for the Sabbatine Privilege." We maintain the majority don't know them. It is an act of charity to make the Sabbatine Privilege known to all.
A soul from Purgatory was asked by a Sister: "What is the average stay of the souls in Purgatory?" The Poor Soul answered: "From thirty to forty years!" Can you see the importance of making Our Lady's Privilege known – if you consider that the flames are the same as the fires of Hell!
A last reminder – we give you the message of one pastor. He said: "If I were positive that all my parishioners died wearing the Brown Scapular, I would be most certain that we would all meet in Heaven." If this pastor can be so certain about his parishioners, why can't all pastors be just as certain? Give your pastor this circular. Why can't every father and mother be certain of their children, family and friends? Explain to them the SCAPULAR PROMISE and the SABBATINE PRIVILEGE. Heed Our Lady's wish: "Wear the Scapular devoutly and perseveringly ... "
... It shall be a sign of salvation, a protection in danger, and a pledge of peace ... What is the Peace Plan from heaven? Stop offending God with sin, pray the Rosary daily, offer prayers and sacrifices of reparation including the devotion of the Five First Saturdays, consecrate ourselves to the Immaculate Heart of Mary and wear the Brown Scapular."
https://www.olrl.org/pray/rosary.shtml
Pioflower, you're so right to remind us of the importance of the Rosary. However, I would say there is no cause for despair; for as St. Dominic related, by the Rosary and the Scapular, Mary will one day save the world, we may piously believe, She will quickly deliver us even from Purgatory, by means of them. Please see Her promises above; at Fatima too, Our Lady emphasized the importance of the Scapular as a sign of consecration along with the daily recitation of the Rosary, and promised numberless graces for these.
Quote from: Lauermar1. Martyrdom
2. Avoiding the near occasion of sin.
3. Frequent confession and sacraments.
4. Keeping custody of my 5 senses and personal modesty.
5. Daily prayer and fasting for myself and others' petitions throughout the year.
6. First Friday or First Saturday devotions.
7. Plenary indulgences: a holy hour followed by communion and confession within 24 hours.
8. Wearing the brown scapular.
9. Offering up my daily trials, tribulations, grief, and hardships without complaining.
10. Giving alms throughout the year.
Great, great list. Thanks for this.
I would beg every one here to take seriously the Lord's Promise in the Catholic Tradition site for being devoted to His Precious Blood, approved by Pope Leo XIII. You will not only avoid Purgatory, but receive a Martyr's Crown. And beside the minimum, we can offer it for all our family and friends, and for all who die daily, and suffering souls in Purgatory, and all else who need our help. Life is short and eternity is for ever. The labor short, the glory infinite, the reward everlasting, Our Lady said to Mary of Agreda. Let us give our best for as long as life shall last. The more we pray, the more graces we will see released for the Church and the world as well. Jesus and Mary want souls to pray, and to have devoted love for Them. Everything else is vanity.
Regarding point 1, of course martyrs go to heaven without purgatory. Also, we can try to practice what victim souls call white martyrdom, which is what Our Lady Herself (also St. Joseph and St. John the Apostle) practiced. To die daily, as even St. Paul, a "red martyr" said, to offer up all our sufferings for the Church and Her Shepherds, to unite all our crosses to the Lord's Cross, to seek Christian perfection by what saintly Thomas Kempis calls "the Royal Road of the Holy Cross".
Greg, the real inference would be that any suffering in time, even from the beginning to the end of the world, would be worth it to save souls, and enter a blissful eternity with Jesus and Mary, even at the end of time, as the last soul to leave Purgatory. Do we live as if we really believe that?
Quote from: Greg on July 25, 2018, 10:08:11 PM
When you see the Beatific Vision for an infinity of time, then what does it matter whether you spend 10,000 years in Purgatory or 5 minutes?
In a bazillion years it will all be water under the bridge. Infinity divided by 10000 is the same as Infinity divided by 0.0001
As regards time itself, it matters very little.
As regards suffering, 5 minutes in purgatory is like hours, perhaps years. We cannot really fathom the immense intensity of the suffering in purgatory, which is the same as hell (except we know that at some point, it will end), but even a moment suffering in purgatory is too long for me, I am absolutely afraid of spending any time at all there - and if it can be avoided - and it can - then we'd be the biggest imbeciles in history to not do everything possible to avoid it completely.
Light a match and use it to burn your hand, see how long you can you stand it before you pull it away. Then hold a lit match to the bottom of your foot, then your eyes, then your lips, and so on - most likely you could not stand it for 3 seconds, and that is only a match stick. How would you fare being completely engulfed in a fiery furnace whose very purpose is that of cleansing your soul? Fire is fire, and even blast furnaces on earth are but a cool breeze when compared to the flames in purgatory.
Gregg, don't think that way, we all have got to lose that kind of thinking and must strive, with the grace of God, to avoid purgatory at all cost, because no matter what, even 5 minutes there is 5 minutes too long.
I am realist.
If we are all imbeciles (barring a very few saints), then nobody is an imbecile.
I never let perfect be the enemy of good. I've seen a lot, WAY MORE people go hyper pious and then blow-up and burn-out than I have ever seen maintain their piety long term.
If John Paul 2 is a saint then I'll be out of Purgatory inside a year. And "the Pope" solemnly declared that he was, invoking the Holy Spirit no less. With B16 in attendance no less.
"For the honor of the Blessed Trinity, the exaltation of the Catholic faith and the increase of the Christian life, by the authority of our Lord Jesus Christ, and of the Holy Apostles Peter and Paul, and own own, after due deliberation and frequent prayer for divine assistance, and having sought the counsel of many of our brother bishops, we declare and define Blessed John XXIII, John Paul II, be saints, and we enroll them among the saints, decreeing that they are to be venerated as such by the whole Church. In the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit. Amen
Apart from the swearing and pragmatic lying I really just ain't that bad.
.
http://lovecrucified.com/victim/victim_legion_victim_souls.pdf
In the excellent work above from some decades ago, María Concepcion Zuniga Lopez explains what spiritual victimhood is and why it is so urgently needed by the Church. She speaks of the many holy souls in the past who were victims and indicates they are urgently needed in the present time. Only a legion of victim souls can now save the Church, because the need is so grave, the sins to be expiated so great, the hour so late. "These souls do not need to change their manner of living externally, that is, the married couples in their homes and in the married state, can form a part of My Work of Atonement. The young, who have not chosen a state, or the adults that are still single, those, yes. Let them consecrate themselves completely to giving veneration to My Victim Heart. Let them live united to me, and to the Minim sisters. The sick, the professionals, let them live as though fastened to the cross of their duties: let them unite themselves to the legion of victim souls." (July 17, 1974)
Our Lord also confirmed this to Sr. Josefa Menendez. From the link above, "Christ Needs Victims: Our Lord to Josefa Menendez On February 11, 1923, Our Lord appeared to Sister Josefa Menendez in France, with his Heart glowing like fire and said: "And now, let us work for souls. Many are lost, it is true, but we shall be able to save many others from the ways of perdition, and this will comfort My Heart, in spite of the offenses committed against It. Do you know, Josefa, how sinners rend Me, and how much I need those who will make reparation? That is why I come to rest among those I have myself chosen. May these souls, by their fidelity and their love, heal the wounds that sinners cause Me. I need victims to repair the bitterness inflicted on My Heart, and to relieve My sorrow. How great is the number of sins committed! How many the souls that are lost!"(Mt. 7:13)
On October 15, 1923, Our Lord told her: "Do not imagine that I am going to speak to you of anything but My Cross. By it I saved the world: by it I will bring the world back to the truths of faith and to the Way of Love. I will manifest My will to you: I saved the world from the Cross, that is to say, through suffering. You know that sin is an infinite offense and needs infinite reparation. That is why I ask you to offer up your sufferings and labors, in union with the infinite merits of My Heart. You know that My Heart is yours. Take it, therefore, and repair by It. Instill love and trust into the souls that come in contact with you. Bathe them in love; bathe them in confidence in the goodness and mercy of My Heart. Whenever you can speak of me and make Me known, tell them always not to fear, for I am a God of Love.
"I recommend three practices very specially to you: First: The practice of the Holy Hour, because it is one of the ways by which an infinite reparation
can be offered up to God the Father, through the mediation of Jesus Christ His Divine Son. –
Second: The devotion of the five Paters [Our Fathers] in honor of My wounds, since through them the world was saved. –
Third: Constant union, or rather daily offering of the merits of My Heart, because by doing so you will give to all your actions an infinite value. Unceasingly use My Life, My Blood, My Heart. Confide constantly and without any fear in this Heart:this secret is known to few: I want to you know it and profit by it." (The Way of Divine Love, p. 233, 405)
In the quote in my signature, Our Lady revealed to another saintly Sister Maria Dolores that those who would offer their whole lives and all their Masses, Communions, sacrifices and sufferings to God, out of love for God and neighbor, for the Shepherds of the Church, and for the salvation of others, in union with the Immaculate and Sacred Hearts, with a firm resolution and clear intent, would face no Purgatory. Let us strive, then, to face any sufferings here in love that we may not need to face it in the next; yet out of love (as for example by making the heroic vow, or the like), if it is necessary to suffer anything in Purgatory, let us, after making our best efforts aided by grace, also be resigned to God's adorable Will, and gratefully accept all the expiation necessary to save our souls and that of others that the good God is pleased to send to us.
Quote from: John Lamb on July 26, 2018, 02:41:31 AM
Quote from: Carleendiane on April 21, 2018, 09:14:56 PM
Time in purgatory is a given for me. It's going in that direction anyway. I keep doing what I shouldn't and certainly do not spend my time in reparation as I should. There are a few things husband and I have been incorporating in our day, in effort to minimize our sufferings in purgatory. But the time we have wasted, is a crime in itself, though we do continue to remain hopeful and plug away at it.
There's a touching part in St. Thérèse's diary where she talks about the nuns discussing purgatory. One of the nuns says that she knows she'll be spending time in purgatory, and St. Thérèse iirc tells her not to be so grim and to trust in God's mercy. That nun soon dies and appears to St. Thérèse, telling Thérèse to pray for her because she is indeed in purgatory. The moral that St. Thérèse draws from this is that God gives us what we ask for, and we should not stifle charity and prevent ourselves from asking for the greater gifts. St. Thérèse expresses her desire to never go to purgatory, solely through the mercy of God.
Personally, I have no intention of going to purgatory either. I'm certainly not resigning myself to spending a long period of time there. Apart from the brown scapular and indulgences, I just don't want to go there and I'll periodically remind Our Lord of that fact. I don't think it's so much about "plugging away at it" as simply hoping that God in His love will let you off. In my opinion, purgatory is for the chronically lax, not for people like me who actually want to go to heaven. That's not to say I don't deserve it, because I probably deserve it more than most; just that I have a greater expectation that God will indulge me.
John,
I think it follows that if you persistently ask God, He could deliver you from Purgatory. Not because He isn't all just and decided to bend the rules for you; but because through your persistence He will help you overcome temptations, lead a holier life, and die a holy death. You persistently asking to be delivered from purgatory is just cooperating with His grace.
Couple other thoughts from the thread:
1) Limbo of the Fathers ? Purgatory after Christ opened the gates of Heaven. Limbo prior to Christ' redemption was a place of waiting; not making reparation for sin.
2) We don't want to aspire "just to make it to" Purgatory or "do our time there." That's a flawed mentality even for those of us who are simply trying to be realistic or humble regarding our own sinfulness. The suffering in Purgatory is relatively similar to hell; only that in Purgatory we have the hope of the Beatific Vision, while souls in Hell obviously do not.
3) Time is different after life, where a minute in Purgatory will feel like a lifetime on earth. It just ain't somewhere we want to spend any length of time. Much better to avoid sin and do our suffering and reparation here on earth.
Quote from: Jayne on January 21, 2018, 07:04:30 AM
Something that I have been thinking about a lot lately is the importance of doing the duties of one's state of life.
I don't even know what my state in life is. LOL
I think it involves getting on people's nerves or something
The best way to avoid purgatory is to love - love very much!
One great way of gaining love of God and of Mary is to see them in everything. For example, when you look at your car, think that it represents God the Father or the Holy Spirit, or even the Mother of God. Touch it with affection, think of God/Mary. Open the door, think of God/Mary and love them. Enter the car, thinking that you enter God and sit in God, and so on.
If a bicycle, if it is a woman cycle, think it is Mary and that you sit on Mary. If a man cycle, think of Jesus and that you sit on Jesus and that you are taking this ride together! It is important to really believe Jesus or Mary is there, in the bicycle (they can be present everywhere even is grass and insects and animals) and that you talk to it, touch it, and kiss it with faith!
To see God in everything, is a great way to love God.
Whatever item it is, see God/Jesus/Mary in it, or some saint, and embrace it affectionately and kiss it, thinking or meditating as if you really touched and kisses and hugged God/Jesus/Mary, like a child holding it in your arms close to your heart and chest, just like you would embrace a child! Flowers are great to see God/Jesus/Mary in.
I Promise you, if you start to see God in everyday items (such as cellphones, cups, paper, books, cd-roms, soap bottles, food items, apples, pears, meat etc. etc.), you will notice that the items starts to "want" things from you if you desire or eat them with love, i.e., that is, you will notice that there is a presence there, or as if the items (whom you see God in) wants something from you - as if it is alive and desires your attention/affection like a child or lover, and that there is some kind of force of love there, or presence that can be physically sensed.
Quote from: Jerome on August 02, 2018, 06:31:20 AM
The best way to avoid purgatory is to love - love very much!
One great way of gaining love of God and of Mary is to see them in everything. For example, when you look at your car, think that it represents God the Father or the Holy Spirit, or even the Mother of God. Touch it with affection, think of God/Mary. Open the door, think of God/Mary and love them. Enter the car, thinking that you enter God and sit in God, and so on.
If a bicycle, if it is a woman cycle, think it is Mary and that you sit on Mary. If a man cycle, think of Jesus and that you sit on Jesus and that you are taking this ride together! It is important to really believe Jesus or Mary is there, in the bicycle (they can be present everywhere even is grass and insects and animals) and that you talk to it, touch it, and kiss it with faith!
To see God in everything, is a great way to love God.
Whatever item it is, see God/Jesus/Mary in it, or some saint, and embrace it affectionately and kiss it, thinking or meditating as if you really touched and kisses and hugged God/Jesus/Mary, like a child holding it in your arms close to your heart and chest, just like you would embrace a child! Flowers are great to see God/Jesus/Mary in.
I Promise you, if you start to see God in everyday items (such as cellphones, cups, paper, books, cd-roms, soap bottles, food items, apples, pears, meat etc. etc.), you will notice that the items starts to "want" things from you if you desire or eat them with love, i.e., that is, you will notice that there is a presence there, or as if the items (whom you see God in) wants something from you - as if it is alive and desires your attention/affection like a child or lover, and that there is some kind of force of love there, or presence that can be physically sensed.
This sounds like pantheism though.
Not really, since God is present everywhere. Just like an image of Mary will be a representation of Her, so too, can an everyday ordinary item, since such is based on the persons personal faith. Do you believe the item represents God or Mary? If so, then you could embrace it with love, as if they are really there.
Why do you think God says faith is so important? With faith one can believe and do everything! Just like as if you honor an image of the Lord the Lord will see it as if done to Himself, so too, if He is honored in a flower, will He see this is done to Himself!
This is Faith, my friend, not pantheism. The item is not God, but through Faith, you believe God is physically present. If you have faith, then God will manifest himself to you sensibly. Make a try and see!
Quote from: Jerome on August 02, 2018, 06:52:03 AM
Not really, since God is present everywhere. Just like an image of Mary will be a representation of Her, so too, can an everyday ordinary item, since such is based on the persons personal faith. Do you believe the item represents God or Mary? If so, then you could embrace it with love, as if they are really there.
Why do you think God says faith is so important? With faith one can believe and do everything! Just like as if you honor an image of the Lord the Lord will see it as if done to Himself, so too, if He is honored in a flower, will He see this is done to Himself!
This is Faith, my friend, not pantheism. The item is not God, but through Faith, you believe God is physically present. If you have faith, then God will manifest himself to you sensibly. Make a try and see!
Still sounds like pantheism, with a mix of idolatry. Creation may point to God as an effect points to its cause, but God is not physically present except in the Eucharist. That's Catholic doctrine 101.
No it is not pantheism nor idolatry, since God is present everywhere. By the way, when did I say you should worship creation like a God? I only said you should see the true God in His creation. Try to have more faith and be less of a critic.
Just like an image of Mary will be a representation of Her, so too, can an everyday ordinary item, since such is based on the persons personal faith. Do you believe the item represents God or Mary? If so, then you could embrace it with love, as if they are really there.
Why do you think God says faith is so important? With faith one can believe and do everything! Just like as if you honor an image of the Lord the Lord will see it as if done to Himself, so too, if He is honored in a flower, will He see this as if done to Himself!
This is Faith, my friend. The item is not God, but through Faith, you believe God is spiritually present in a more intimate way. If you have faith, then God will manifest Himself to you sensibly. Make a try and see!
And no, if the bird fly away, then you should not think God flees from you. You must be reasonable in your faith (however, if animals flee from you in unusual ways, make an examination of conscience, and see if you are perhaps offending God in some way). Rather, if you have faith, you will notice that birds actually approaches you instead in unusual ways! It is the same with nature. The thing with faith is this: if you believe in these things, then God will work with you with this faith and play games with you! Why do you think God wants us to be like children and have simple faith? and why do children play with items as if they represents real persons, their parents or friends (if they can do this, so can we!)? and why do you think God wants us to see Him in everything, and to think of Him constantly?
And it is not scary to live in this way. What is scary with having faith that you actually can honor and embrace those you love in everyday items? If you believe this, this is counted as a deed. Similarly, if a person dishonors an image of Jesus, this deed as counted as an offense to the Lord, for what is done to the things representing Him or that you considers represents Him, is done as to Himself.
QuoteWe don't want to aspire "just to make it to" Purgatory or "do our time there." That's a flawed mentality even for those of us who are simply trying to be realistic or humble regarding our own sinfulness. The suffering in Purgatory is relatively similar to hell; only that in Purgatory we have the hope of the Beatific Vision, while souls in Hell obviously do not.
Amen.
Please, invest 20 minutes to read the little booklet "How to Avoid Purgatory". It's quite simple, imho.
Didn't our lady tell Francisco at Fatima that he needs to say many rosaries in order for him to go straight to heaven? [one rosary in 1917 was 15 decades long]
Saying many Rosaries throughout the day whenever we can is therefore another almost infallible way to avoid Purgatory and become a Saint going straight to Heaven. St. Padre Pio used to say dozens of Rosaries throughout the day, and in his 50 years as a stigmatist, he undoubtedly delivered innumerable souls from Purgatory himself. St. John Marie Vianney, to whom the devil said that a few Priests like him would destroy his kingdom, was scarcely ever seen without a Rosary. We have the express promise of the Mother of God to St. Dominic, promise 9, "I shall deliver from purgatory those who have been devoted to the Rosary." and promise 13, "I have obtained from my Divine Son that all the advocates of the Rosary shall have for intercessors the entire celestial court during their life and at the hour of death." also promise 8, "Those who are faithful to recite the Rosary shall have, during their life and at their death, the light of God and the plenitude of His graces; at the moment of death they shall participate in the merits of the saints in paradise."
Let us resolve never to leave each other or any of our brothers and sisters in Christ in Purgatory for too long, but liberate them all as quickly as possible. St. Pio used to say always, "We must empty Purgatory."
We may piously believe, on the strength of the promises of our Savior to St. Gertrude the Great, that the "Eternal Father, I offer You the Precious Blood of Thy Divine Son, Jesus, in union with the Holy Masses that are being said throughout the world this day, for all the holy souls in Purgatory, for sinners everywhere, sinners in the Universal Church, especially those who are going to die today, those in my own home and family. Amen" will deliver some souls every time we say it. It would be well for all of us to say it many times a day, and in this way to build up our own "holy alliance" of souls.
"This means that on day one that you begin this practice of praying with a saint for a holy soul in purgatory, you grow from a force of one (just you) to a force of three (the saint you chose, the holy soul you prayed for, and you). On day two, you will add another saint and holy soul to your personal Holy Alliance, and grow to a force of five. And so on. Keep a diary to record your growing Holy Alliance."
https://www.romancatholicman.com/best-way-pray-holy-souls-purgatory-living-loved-ones/
The souls we deliver from Purgatory, along with their Guardian Angels, will doubtless be present or at least help us by their intercession in our own hour of death. Imagine if we had labored to save many souls in this short life on earth, how happy we will be in the hour of death, when many souls come to greet us, before we enter the happiness of the beatific vision forever! Such must be our Christian life always, every day we must pray for dying souls and for the faithful departed. Another way to go to Heaven without Purgatory is by, right now, joyfully resigning ourselves to whatever death the Lord God intends for us, with all the pains and suffering it may consist of. Fr. Paul Sullivan mentions this powerful means as the Sixth means in his great work cited by PerEvangelicaDicta.
Fr. Sullivan: "The idea of Pope St. Pius X was the same when he granted a plenary indulgence at the hour of death to those who say at least after one Holy Communion the following prayer:
"Eternal Father, from this day forward, I accept with a joyful and resigned heart the death it will please You to send me, with all its pains and sufferings"
It will be better still to say this prayer after every Holy Communion we receive.
It is for our best interest to accept God's will in everything that happens to us in life and in death.
Nothing can be easier when we remember that God always wishes what is best for us. If we do what God does not will, we shall surely suffer."
Quote from: PerEvangelicaDicta on August 02, 2018, 10:55:11 AM
QuoteWe don't want to aspire "just to make it to" Purgatory or "do our time there." That's a flawed mentality even for those of us who are simply trying to be realistic or humble regarding our own sinfulness. The suffering in Purgatory is relatively similar to hell; only that in Purgatory we have the hope of the Beatific Vision, while souls in Hell obviously do not.
Amen.
Please, invest 20 minutes to read the little booklet "How to Avoid Purgatory". It's quite simple, imho.
Excellent little book! Thanks for suggesting it PerEvangelicaDicta - and yes, deleantur nostra delicta ;)
From "How to Avoid Purgatory" (PDF of this book attached at the bottom of this post):
The Sacrament of Holy Orders gives a priest all his tremendous powers. Matrimony makes man and woman husband and wife. In the same way Extreme Unction, if devoutly received, prepares the dying Christian for immediate entrance into Heaven, thus delivering him from Purgatory.
How foolish it is, therefore, to put off receiving this Sacrament until very late, when the dying person is too exhausted to receive it with full knowledge of what he is doing and with due fervour and devotion. The moment of death is the supreme moment in our lives. It is the moment which decides our fate for all Eternity.I believe we should pray every day that God will send us a priest to give us the last sacraments and blessings of the Church before we die as the surest way to minimize/avoid purgatory altogether.
We should not, however, fool ourselves into thinking that we can pray for this grace while leading a sinful life, then slip into heaven on our death bed, on the contrary, those who daily, sincerely pray for this great grace should find that they begin to grow in their interior life as their rosaries, mental prayers, penances, contrition and sacrifices etc. increase over time, thus they find that their sinning eventually stops almost completely as they grow in the love of God and all things holy. That's the way this works. This and more why we all should pray for the grace of a happy death every day.
Yes, which is why it is so good to think about and pray for our soul at our own hour of death, as we do in every Hail Mary.
Everyone should try to attain at eternity having obtained, by the mercy of God, the grace not to sin again venially. This grace we should ask for especially in Holy Mass, where because of the Infinite Merit of the Sacrifice of Christ, no grace, however great - as this one is - will be denied us. Also at Holy Communion, which the Council of Trent teaches us, delivers us from daily faults, or venial sins, and preserves us from future mortal sin.
Decree of Pope St. Pius X: "Hence the Holy Council (Trent) calls the Eucharist "the antidote whereby we may be freed from daily faults and be preserved from mortal sin."
Especially when we sense the hour of death drawing close, we should earnestly petition for the grace to never sin again, which is the most urgent grace necessary. But we should begin right away, so that we may well hope, by the grace of God dispensed through the Sacraments, especially the Holy Eucharist, to obtain it some time before death.
Quote from: Xavier on July 26, 2018, 07:53:11 AM
http://lovecrucified.com/victim/victim_legion_victim_souls.pdf
In the excellent work above from some decades ago, María Concepcion Zuniga Lopez explains what spiritual victimhood is and why it is so urgently needed by the Church. She speaks of the many holy souls in the past who were victims and indicates they are urgently needed in the present time. Only a legion of victim souls can now save the Church, because the need is so grave, the sins to be expiated so great, the hour so late. "These souls do not need to change their manner of living externally, that is, the married couples in their homes and in the married state, can form a part of My Work of Atonement. The young, who have not chosen a state, or the adults that are still single, those, yes. Let them consecrate themselves completely to giving veneration to My Victim Heart. Let them live united to me, and to the Minim sisters. The sick, the professionals, let them live as though fastened to the cross of their duties: let them unite themselves to the legion of victim souls." (July 17, 1974)
Our Lord also confirmed this to Sr. Josefa Menendez. From the link above, "Christ Needs Victims: Our Lord to Josefa Menendez On February 11, 1923, Our Lord appeared to Sister Josefa Menendez in France, with his Heart glowing like fire and said: "And now, let us work for souls. Many are lost, it is true, but we shall be able to save many others from the ways of perdition, and this will comfort My Heart, in spite of the offenses committed against It. Do you know, Josefa, how sinners rend Me, and how much I need those who will make reparation? That is why I come to rest among those I have myself chosen. May these souls, by their fidelity and their love, heal the wounds that sinners cause Me. I need victims to repair the bitterness inflicted on My Heart, and to relieve My sorrow. How great is the number of sins committed! How many the souls that are lost!"(Mt. 7:13)
s.
I was bored - and was going off the i-net when I came across this post.. and was about to ignore it because it looked rather lengthy -- for someone running out of time, meaning i have things to do.. but I was so blessed by reading this... :) long story as to why and all, but thanks.. and now I will read the rest of it.. :)
Quote
In the quote in my signature, Our Lady revealed to another saintly Sister Maria Dolores that those who would offer their whole lives and all their Masses, Communions, sacrifices and sufferings to God, out of love for God and neighbor, for the Shepherds of the Church, and for the salvation of others, in union with the Immaculate and Sacred Hearts, with a firm resolution and clear intent, would face no Purgatory.
this is a little hard to believe, since Padre Pio even had to do one hour of Purgatory (after death)
but who knows..
thanks again :)
Well, am happy the texts of Our Lord speaking to Sr. Josefa Menendez on the urgent need of victim souls for the Church was helpful. Does anybody have a source for that statement about St. Pio? I would be careful in saying St. Pio needed to spend some time in Purgatory; but what happens sometimes on really rare occasions, and what some really heroic apostles like St. Pio do, is they heroically offer an hour of expiation in Purgatory for some other soul; such a thing is not unheard of in the lives of heroic victims and the book I mentioned has a section upon it. All these Saints were victims for reparation - St. Padre Pio and St. Margaret Mary, St. Therese of Liseux, St. Jacinta and the children of Fatima and many others near to our time, and they tell us Heaven urgently demands a life modeled after theirs as much as possible from us also. In the heroic vow of St. Margaret Mary, if you recall, we offer all the work we do in this life, as well as any time we may spend in Purgatory, for the relief of other souls in Purgatory. Thus, it is not surprising the Church so highly approves of this that She offers us Indulgences as often as we receive Holy Communion if we make it, as Martin mentioned in the first page. Living a life with as less sin as possible, and striving to increase in grace each day, is really the main thing.
Quote from: GregI'll be out of Purgatory inside a year
Let's make a pact of friendship and a covenant of love with all the members of the SD Family, all traditional Catholics we know, and all Catholics generally, that as far as possible, we will not allow anyone to do more than 1 Year. Simple, frequent prayers like that of St. Gertrude offered to God each day can obtain the release at least of 1 soul every day from Purgatory. Priests who make the Heroic Vow, the link mentions, can release a soul of their choice from Purgatory each time they offer Holy Mass. Laymen can hope for similar benefits each time they receive Holy Communion, it is said.
CE: "The Heroic Act has been enriched with numerous indulgences by Benedict XIII (1728), Pius VI (1788), and Pius IX (1852). Priests who make it receive the personal privilege of gaining a plenary indulgence for a soul of their choice each time they say Mass (see PRIVILEGED ALTAR). Laymen gain a similar indulgence each time they receive Holy Communion, also each Monday they hear Mass for the departed; in both cases the usual visit to a church and prayers for the intention of the pope are required" and "A decree of the Sacred Congregation of Indulgences dated 18 December, 1885, and confirmed the following day by Leo XIII, says:
The Heroic Act of Charity in favour of the souls detained in purgatory consists in this, that a member of the Church militant (Christifidelis), either using a set formula or simply by an act of his will, offers to God for the souls in purgatory all the satisfactory works which he will perform during his lifetime, and also all the suffrages which may accrue to him after his death. Many Christians devoted to the B.V. Mary, acting on the advice of the Theatine Regular Cleric Father Gaspar Olider, of blessed memory, make it a practice to deposit the said merits and suffrages as it were into the hands of the Bl. Virgin that She may distribute these favours to the souls in purgatory according to Her own merciful pleasure."
Very important is the CE explanation of the loving hope and childlike faith we place in the good God and His holy Mother to use these suffrages for their good pleasure, but also in a way that will help us in our own journey of sanctification, " "The Heroic Act is often called a vow, yet it partakes more of the nature of an offering made to God and to Mary, and it is also, unlike a vow, revocable at will. This point has been decided by the S.C. Indulg., 20 Feb., 1907, in answer to a question from Chicoutimi in Canada. A special vow "never to revoke the Act" would probably be binding, because its subject matter is an act of the personal will of which man can freely dispose, whereas he has not the disposal of his satisfactory works in favour of the departed; that depends on God; for man it is only a matter of pious desire, and only in this sense a votum. It always remains doubtful to what extent God accepts the oblation, and it is certain that the holy souls altogether lack the power of accepting it. The practice of the Heroic Act is based on the communion of saints, in virtue of which the good deeds of one member of Christ's body benefit all other members. Its meritoriousness results from the more intense charity (love of God and His suffering friends) which inspires it, and on which the intrinsic perfection of all our good deeds depends. Its heroicity arises from the willingness it involves to take upon one's self the dreadful pains of purgatory for the love of one's neighbour, although there remains the reasonable hope that God in His goodness, and the sainted souls in their gratitude, will not allow the punishment to be exacted to the full."