Why is this place so toxic?

[Kaesekopf]

Here's a rather open-ended question for anyone reading and active in this forum. 

Why is this place so toxic (I don't like this word because someone's previous usage of it left a bad taste in my mouth but it's the only one that I think fits)?  Why is everyone jumping down everyone's neck left and right?

Don't give me the cop out that it's because I haven't moderated this place.  This is a forum geared for adults who are typically self-selected as traditional Catholics. 

And yet the bickering and fighting and pot-shotting and everything that goes on persists and only amplifies.  I get it, I'm getting a taste of my own medicine from when I posted at FishEaters.  But, in my defense, I was a 20-something idiot, and that was a decade ago! 

So, what do you think?

[TerrorDæmonum]

It has a clear case of demonic infestation.

The moderation issue has caused a few forum tendencies:

• People test boundaries until they find them
• Niche interest forums can attract rejects from elsewhere (see: Nazis flocking to any "free speech" project)
• Dissociation: people don't act this way in chat, even if they do on the forum and they certainly don't act this way in person.

[The Curt Jester]

Old feuds run on and people won't forget them.  If anyone new tries to do anything about it, he is just dragged into it.  Rinse, repeat.

Ultimately, people lack self-control.

Writing is a medium that should make self-moderation a lot easier.  After all, it takes time to read someone's post, click reply, type it out, and hit post.  Should be plenty of time to re-read, re-think, and stop.  Sometimes I wonder if people even read what they write.

[The Curt Jester]

And yet the bickering and fighting and pot-shotting and everything that goes on persists and only amplifies.  I get it, I'm getting a taste of my own medicine from when I posted at FishEaters.  But, in my defense, I was a 20-something idiot, and that was a decade ago! 

For every 20-something idiot who grows up, there's another dozen to replace him.  And it'll keep on going!

[Jayne]

Because it is contagious.  One or two people do it and then some others get the idea that it is normal and acceptable.  And people feel like they need to defend themselves by doing it back or doing it proactively.  So then more people do it and that makes if feel more normal and acceptable.  The cycle continues until it dominates the forum and becomes one of its most noticeable features.

And moderation does matter.  Even when the forum members are adult traditional Catholics who should know better, there are always going to be a few who only behave appropriately when forced to do so.  If those few are not kept under control, the poison spreads.

[TerrorDæmonum]

And for me, the moderation issue is clearly demonstrated here.

Looking at who has been banned and why, and seeing posting this thread while not addressing that situation is very, very different from how any forum has been run in my experience.

What is someone like me supposed to think?

That's nice. [edit: very vulgar name], but nice.

Post the one from tonight when I called you a  [edit: very vulgar name]

I don't want these words in my posts, but I also expect that this kind of thing result in some sort of action from those who have written rules and previous enforced them.

He left on his own in chat, but he brought it up on your forum.

All my previous interactions with him were pleasant...I was going to send him somethings related to his favourite TV as I live in the area in which that show is set (once he gets a stable mailing address as he was moving).

Then today, he goes off.

Why? I don't know. But I do know that this cannot be dismissed as "toxic".

Plus, there are possibly previous interactions he has had with others that may be worthy of consideration.

But as long as it remains, the more it seems like this stuff is welcome here and it will attract more such behavior.

[diaduit]

Ban me or ban Laus or whatever but this place will still be toxic as long as Jayne is allowed to stir her trouble with the 'innocent' I just want this place to be moderated.  While she was gone teaching or whatever and missing during the summer and the Insanis sidekick disappeared there was no trouble here.

If we are the real bullies and we are too intimidating for the quieter gentile folk then ban us already and let ye get on with it.  She will behave herself for awhile but then her itching for drama will start again and she will cause some trouble.

Ban the toxic and if that is me, then so be it, I'll take it like an adult and you can stop my account.  I'll be happy to lurk as I do find this place amazing for Catholic information (like this very evening signing up for Mundas suggestion of Benedictus).

[TerrorDæmonum]

And, this was posted recently:

I will tell you, xavier is a louis de montfort slave consecration practitioner.  That says it all.  And, I can only laugh.  Because, I live a happy life, and my faith is much greater than that of the tradworld troll.   He is the forum owner's problem, not mine.

This was reported to you in email, and this was a person who was banned at least twice for his blasphemies against a holy Saint and the devotions he promoted and which have long been approved by the Church.

The fact he is welcomed back and this remains up after it was reported indicates that such a thing is welcome here.

What am I to think?

I know you don't approve of that stuff, but actions are what matter.

I think you need to enforce boundaries so everybody knows where they are and everything else will largely fix itself.

[Jayne]

Ban the toxic and if that is me, then so be it, I'll take it like an adult and you can stop my account. 

Since diaduit has raised this topic, I want to be on record with my opinion that she should not be banned (at least not permanently).  She is not disruptive of the forum, in general, although she seems to have vendettas against a couple of posters.  But she is the sort of person who would stop making personal attacks and outlandish accusations if told to do so by a moderator.  She needs to be corrected not banned.

The forum is clearly very important to her and it would be a shame if she could no longer participate, both for her sake and others.  I am sure that many people would miss her.

[james03]

Why is this place so toxic

Bad apples.  Gog, Paeniteo, Jayne, and Lauremar.  Gog has been stirring up the most trouble lately.  Paeniteo just came back, so give him a week and he'll be talking about demonic infestations and calling people heretics again.  Jayne's just a troll who goes after the women folk here.

[Philip G.]

And, this was posted recently:

I will tell you, xavier is a louis de montfort slave consecration practitioner.  That says it all.  And, I can only laugh.  Because, I live a happy life, and my faith is much greater than that of the tradworld troll.   He is the forum owner's problem, not mine.

This was reported to you in email, and this was a person who was banned at least twice for his blasphemies against a holy Saint and the devotions he promoted and which have long been approved by the Church.

The fact he is welcomed back and this remains up after it was reported indicates that such a thing is welcome here.

What am I to think?

I know you don't approve of that stuff, but actions are what matter.

I think you need to enforce boundaries so everybody knows where they are and everything else will largely fix itself.

That is a cheap shot.  I apologized to Xavier for all of that posting. 


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Re: Let's Grow Suscipe Domine to 10,000 Members as a Thank You to Kaese's Family!
« Reply #61 on: December 05, 2021, 11:22:00 AM »
Quote
Quote from: Pon de Replay on December 05, 2021, 08:06:16 AM
Quote from: Xavier on December 05, 2021, 02:47:41 AM
I have never thought, and have never written anywhere, that I am convinced God has forsaken me, or I am unforgivable, or that Jesus Christ is already here on earth, you liar and slanderer. Prove your slander with documented links or retract your slander immediately.

I think he has you confused with the CathInfo forum user xavierpope, who has the peculiar belief that Jesus is currently returned but is waiting three years before passing his Last Judgement.  According to xavierpope's view, this current age is a period in which sins cannot be forgiven; the sacrament of confession is null.  He worries that he is irrevocably damned.  His user name on this forum is pioflower.

Thanks Pon de Replay, I think that is exactly what happened.  Xavier, my dearest apologies!  I usually try to leave you/Xavier be, because at the very least you do not get nasty with other posters, and that is something I can respect regardless of our differences in opinion and how we approach practicing our religion.

xavier, you will unfortunately have to view all of my recent outbursts against you in light of the fact that I mistook you for another poster(xavierpope instead of xaviersem).  Because, with that being inaccurate, it is highly unlikely I would have said any of the disrespectful things I said, and certainly not in the same manner.
« Last Edit: December 05, 2021, 11:27:32 AM by Philip G. »

[TerrorDæmonum]

It has a clear case of demonic infestation.

Bad apples.  Gog, Paeniteo, Jayne, and Lauremar.  Gog has been stirring up the most trouble lately.  Paeniteo just came back, so give him a week and he'll be talking about demonic infestations and calling people heretics again.  Jayne's just a troll who goes after the women folk here.

A week? Did you not even read this thread before responding?

And you said I had poor reading comprehension:

Poor reading comprehension. 

I was called [edit: very vulgar names] today out of the blue.

And you call me a "bad apple"?

Quote all my posts. Quote everybody's posts. The issues should be plain to see.

Look at the admin's own description of this forum and then go read a Catholic exorcist's description of "demonic infestation".

[Jayne]

Quote all my posts. Quote everybody's posts. The issues should be plain to see.

It is hard to take seriously a list of forum "bad apples" that does not include Laus, who is the most prolific and blatant rule-breaker here.  It looks more like a list of posters that James doesn't like than anything connected to forum function.

Edit:  I just realized what the people on James's list have in common.  We are all people who have posted about being vaccinated.  James must be one of those people who wants the forum to be "pure bloods" only.

[TerrorDæmonum]

That is a cheap shot.  I apologized to Xavier for all of that posting. 

It has nothing to do with Xavier, but using Catholic devotions as some sort of proof one is...not Catholic.

You still hold that view.

It is not about insulting Xavier at all.

[TerrorDæmonum]

Isn't it telling that a post can contain insults, vulgarities, ethnic slurs, Nazi propaganda, blasphemies, yet, the most vocal complaints are about people who just post more than average without any of those things?

People can use Jew as an insult and go after Jayne with more venom than I have ever seen on a forum, yet, she is the one that is accused of causing problems merely by being Catholic and posting more than average?

Just look at the posts and consider them in light of all previous forum usage.