Author Topic: Geocentric retrograde motion seems a lot faster than heliocentric?  (Read 315 times)

Offline Thomas1901

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Hello everyone,

First post here, though I often check ‘the headlines’ to see what’s going on.

I’ve recently been reading Dr. Sungenis’ ‘Galileo was Wrong’ book. It’s accompanied with a CD-Rom that has animations to help explain things. Animations being extremely helpful with stuff like this of course.

Here’s a 5 minute youtube video with very similar animation. The youtuber has attributed the copyright to Sungenis so this may in fact be from a more recent edition of Sungenis’ book/CD-Rom.


It’s all very good and the two systems seem to produce the exact same retrograde motion. That is until you notice that the retrograde in the heliocentric model takes about 6 months (the earth has revolved half way around the Sun), whereas the same retrograde in the geocentric model takes about 12 hours (the sun has revolved half way around the earth).

I would be very surprised if Sungenis had overlooked something like this, so perhaps I’ve misunderstood. Can anyone explain?
 

Offline Kephapaulos

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Re: Geocentric retrograde motion seems a lot faster than heliocentric?
« Reply #1 on: October 05, 2017, 02:44:42 AM »
Welcome, Thomas1901!

I'm not sure if we're allowed to discuss geocentrism on this forum anymore. I would suggest contacting the moderator Kaesekopf. Also, I would recommend messaging cassini about the issue, but I think he was banned. Maybe you could try emailing or messaging Robert Sungenis himself through his Galileo Was Wrong website: http://galileowaswrong.com/contact/

 

Offline Kaesekopf

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Re: Geocentric retrograde motion seems a lot faster than heliocentric?
« Reply #2 on: October 05, 2017, 11:35:29 AM »
Yeah, geocentrism is more or less a banned topic, mostly because you get all sorts of kooks coming out of the woodwork, who then start damning people over obscure documents.
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Offline Thomas1901

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Re: Geocentric retrograde motion seems a lot faster than heliocentric?
« Reply #3 on: October 05, 2017, 01:51:01 PM »
Ok, my apologies Kaesekopf, and thank-you Kephapaulos, I'll try to contact him directly.   :)
 

Offline Kephapaulos

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Re: Geocentric retrograde motion seems a lot faster than heliocentric?
« Reply #4 on: October 06, 2017, 01:06:36 AM »
You're welcome, Thomas1901!
 

Offline Kaesekopf

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Re: Geocentric retrograde motion seems a lot faster than heliocentric?
« Reply #5 on: October 06, 2017, 09:27:40 AM »
No worries.

Sent from my STV100-1 using Tapatalk

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Offline PerEvangelicaDicta

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Re: Geocentric retrograde motion seems a lot faster than heliocentric?
« Reply #6 on: October 06, 2017, 02:01:26 PM »
Thomas1901, I'd be interested to know the responses you receive from Mr. Sungenis and/or cassini, if Kaes will permit you to convey it here.  If not, would you be so kind as to PM it to me?
(just fyi, cassini is a member of Cathinfo)

I understand Kaesekopf's aversion to geocentrism discussions, however, it's in my top 5 topics. Another is EENS/BOD/BOB, which I firmly believe is the heart of modernism among trads.  Lex orandi. lex credendi, lex vivendi. 
But that's another story for another forum  ;D   
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Offline Thomas1901

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Re: Geocentric retrograde motion seems a lot faster than heliocentric?
« Reply #7 on: October 06, 2017, 08:22:15 PM »
 No problem PerEvangelicaDicta, we'll get something sorted   :)
 

Offline Quaremerepulisti

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Re: Geocentric retrograde motion seems a lot faster than heliocentric?
« Reply #8 on: October 15, 2017, 02:07:53 PM »
There's nothing wrong with the video.  In fact no physicist or astronomer even halfway knowledgeable would say that retrograde motion proves heliocentrism or geocentrism.  As long as the relative positions of the planets and the sun stay the same in each system (as they do in the neo-Tychonic geocentric system shown in the video) the view of Mars from the earth will be identical.

It is not the case that only 12 hours have passed in the geocentric version.  It's true the entire universe revolves around the earth every 24 hours in the geocentric system, but the video is in a rotating frame that revolves around the earth at the same speed; thus, it is going to take the same amount of time to arrive at the same configuration.  (Note that in the heliocentric system, the positions are of Mars observed at the same time of day (or night).)  And Mars still takes the same amount of time to orbit the sun in the geocentric as in the heliocentric system.
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Offline Thomas1901

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Re: Geocentric retrograde motion seems a lot faster than heliocentric?
« Reply #9 on: October 21, 2017, 07:18:48 PM »
Thanks Quaremerepulisti,

You're more than likely correct, I can sort of visualise it, but not quite. Cosmology isn't something I spend a lot of time on so I'm not used to trying to visualise these things. Or maybe I'm just dumb.

I had wanted to view Sungenis' 'Journey to the Center of the Universe', thinking it might help me view these things in my mind's eye; however it seems to be very difficult to get hold of. The 'ScreeningNOW' download link that's available says it's 'sold out'. How do you sell out of a download?

It may be available as a hard copy from somewhere (I can't remember for sure), but along with postage, is beyond what I'm able (or willing) to pay. I think people had similar difficulties with 'The Principle'. Does anyone know what the problem is? Why does Sungenis go to great effort to make documentaries and then make them very difficult to for people to buy. I think there are a lot of people eager to pay to watch his documentaries but can't find them.

Strange.

 

Offline Gardener

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Re: Geocentric retrograde motion seems a lot faster than heliocentric?
« Reply #10 on: October 23, 2017, 08:14:27 AM »
Thanks Quaremerepulisti,

You're more than likely correct, I can sort of visualise it, but not quite. Cosmology isn't something I spend a lot of time on so I'm not used to trying to visualise these things. Or maybe I'm just dumb.

I had wanted to view Sungenis' 'Journey to the Center of the Universe', thinking it might help me view these things in my mind's eye; however it seems to be very difficult to get hold of. The 'ScreeningNOW' download link that's available says it's 'sold out'. How do you sell out of a download?

It may be available as a hard copy from somewhere (I can't remember for sure), but along with postage, is beyond what I'm able (or willing) to pay. I think people had similar difficulties with 'The Principle'. Does anyone know what the problem is? Why does Sungenis go to great effort to make documentaries and then make them very difficult to for people to buy. I think there are a lot of people eager to pay to watch his documentaries but can't find them.

Strange.

Makes one think of "The Producers"
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