Who Are the Jews?

Started by TerrorDæmonum, February 28, 2022, 10:50:38 PM

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TerrorDæmonum

This forum in general makes many references to The Jews. This is often in a very abstract way using particular personalities and families as examples, yet, referring to a collective that has cohesion beyond religious profession and ethnicity and language.

Extreme political rhetoric, non-Catholic ideologies, and conspiracy theories aside, there is a specific distinction made by the Church:

Quote from: Catechism of Pius X
The Ninth Article of the Creed

Those Outside the Communion of Saints

11 Q. Who are they who are outside the true Church?
A. Outside the true Church are: Infidels, Jews, heretics, apostates, schismatics, and the excommunicated.

13 Q. Who are the Jews?
A. The Jews are those who profess the Law of Moses; have not received baptism; and do not believe in Jesus Christ.

The word "Jew" can be used for other meanings and frequently is so, but what is condemned specifically are those who, according to the Church, profess the Law of Moses vainly, have not received or desired to receive Baptism, and reject the doctrines of the Church.

This clear and simple presentation allows us to essential ignore what is useless and distracting at best and focus on the truth. The words related to the children of Abraham, the twelve tribes from the patriarch Jacob, whose one son Judah whose tribe took possession of the southern part of the territory which was called Judah as well, who eventually had a king named David, who ended up king of the united tribes, creating a unified kingdom of Israel (the northern kingdom) and Judah. The children of Abraham, through Jacob, eventually were collectively referred to as "Jews" after this particular tribe and kingdom, as it was a very significant for it being the source of David and Christ who fulfilled the Law and instituted the Church to teach all nations.

The scattering of people of this land who professed the Law of Moses, even those who had become Christians, after the destruction of the Temple in AD 70, resulted in those who remained outside the Church establishing Jewish practices without the Temple in Jamnia (Yavne), and with the Bar Kokhba revolt in AD 136, there was further scattering of the people who had observed the Law of Moses and worshipped and sacrificed in the Temple.

These Jews are the basis for what we call Judaism now. The religious practices, rejection of Christianity, and identity was maintained around the diaspora and there were many historical and social reasons for them being what they are now, just as any ethnic or social group.

The rise of political issues, religious deceptions, and finally modern thinking of eugenics led to the redefinition of "Jew" to being a quasi-religious philosophical category that is seen as being exceptionally influential in the world, in secret and in the open, rather than just being another ethnic/cultural group that has been spread around the world.

We can for the most part reject those ideologies, for we have the Church and the doctrines most certain. We do not need to look for hidden powers: we know who the infidels, Jews, heretics, apostates, schismatics, and the excommunicated are. We know the prince of this world rules the kingdoms of this world and the Church's mission is holy, to be continued under persecution:

Quote from: Catechism of Pius X
The Ninth Article of the Creed

35 Q. Can the Catholic Church be destroyed or perish?
A. No; the Catholic Church may be persecuted, but she can never be destroyed or perish. She will last till the end of the world, because Jesus Christ, as He promised, will be with her till the end of time.

36 Q. Why is the Catholic Church so persecuted?
A. The Catholic Church is so persecuted because even her Divine Founder, Jesus Christ, was thus persecuted, and because she reproves vice, combats the passions, and condemns all acts of injustice and all error.

Whether individuals, groups, false religions, conspiracies of any sort, we can be certain of only one thing: that which is revealed to us by God.

Quote from: Catechism of Pius X
On Faith

9 Q. What is Faith?
A. Faith is a supernatural virtue, which God infuses into our souls, and by which, relying on the authority of God Himself, we believe everything which He has revealed and which through His Church He proposes for our belief.

10 Q. How do we know the truths God has revealed?
A. We know the revealed truths by means of the Church, which is infallible; that is, by means of the Pope, the successor of St. Peter, and by means of the Bishops, the successors to the Apostles, who were taught by Jesus Christ Himself.

11 Q. Are we certain of the truths the Church teaches us?
A. We are most certain of the truths the Church teaches, because Jesus Christ pledged His word that the Church should never be led into error.

12 Q. By what sin is the Faith lost?
A. Faith is lost by denying or voluntarily doubting even a single article proposed for our belief.

13 Q. How is lost Faith recovered
A. Lost Faith is recovered by repenting of the sin committed and by believing anew all that the Church believes.

With this in mind, we can hold the doctrine of the Church and not be worried about cultural and ethnic aspects of the world which do not deny the Church. What is unholy is the rejection of God, the Church, and the sacraments. It is not in having a particular ancestry, speaking a certain language, or having a particular non-religious customs which have developed as any other over history.

We are all children of Adam, and we all have ancestors who were outside the Church and worshipped false gods. When it comes to the grace of God:

Quote from: Galatians 3:28
There is neither Jew nor Greek: there is neither bond nor free: there is neither male nor female. For you are all one in Christ Jesus.

Quote from: Romans 10:12
For there is no distinction of the Jew and the Greek: for the same is Lord over all, rich unto all that call upon him.

And the Jews, as a broad category of heritage, do have a unique position:

Quote from: Romans 2:9-10
Tribulation and anguish upon every soul of man that worketh evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Greek. But glory, and honour, and peace to every one that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.

"Greek" refers to the most prominent culture of the time in contrast to the Jews, who had the Law of Moses, worshiped God with certainty, and who had just received the fulfillment of the Law and the establishment of the Church for the salvation of all who believed and persevered.

The distinction is not with ancestry, but in faith, as the Lord said:

Quote from: Luke 11:23
He that is not with me, is against me; and he that gathereth not with me, scattereth.

And to the Samaritan (descendants of Jacob in the northern kingdom who had become separated from the others and followed their distinct traditions and which still do exist):

Quote from: John 4:21-24
Jesus saith to her: Woman, believe me, that the hour cometh, when you shall neither on this mountain, nor in Jerusalem, adore the Father.  You adore that which you know not: we adore that which we know; for salvation is of the Jews. But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true adorers shall adore the Father in spirit and in truth. For the Father also seeketh such to adore him. God is a spirit; and they that adore him, must adore him in spirit and in truth.

Those who seek revelation in the world, from unholy spirits, from false prophets, and from false religions will be led away from truth. We should not follow these things which we know will attempt to lead us away from truth:

Quote from: Matthew 6:33
Seek ye therefore first the kingdom of God, and his justice, and all these things shall be added unto you.

We should not attribute any extraordinary ability or status to those who are outside the Church, for we may think our enemy is like us, when in fact it is not:

Quote from: Ephesians 6:12
For our wrestling is not against flesh and blood; but against principalities and powers, against the rulers of the world of this darkness, against the spirits of wickedness in the high places.

These unholy spirits will use whatever is at their disposal for their diabolic ends: we should not pretend that a group of humans has on their own ability become extraordinarily influential. Even if any group is over-represented, it is not by their own doing or human design. The false doctrines of one group may appear to be against the false doctrines of another, but in the end, they are both on the same side if they are against Christ and if we choose one of those false doctrines in the mistaken belief we are opposing another false doctrine, we risk being in the same position as those we condemn.

It is only firmly in the Church, under the guidance of the Holy Spirit, with the grace of God that we can be saved, not by seeking salvation in the politics of the world.

John Lamb

Genesis Chapter IV

And Adam knew Eve his wife: who conceived and brought forth Cain, saying: I have gotten a man through God. And again she brought forth his brother Abel. And Abel was a shepherd, and Cain a husbandman. And it came to pass after many days, that Cain offered, of the fruits of the earth, gifts to the Lord. Abel also offered of the firstlings of his flock, and of their fat: and the Lord had respect to Abel, and to his offerings. But to Cain and his offerings he had no respect: and Cain was exceedingly angry, and his countenance fell.

And the Lord said to him: Why art thou angry? and why is thy countenance fallen? If thou do well, shalt thou not receive? but if ill, shall not sin forthwith be present at the door? but the lust thereof shall be under thee, and thou shalt have dominion over it. And Cain said to Abel his brother: Let us go forth abroad. And when they were in the field, Cain rose up against his brother Abel, and slew him. And the Lord said to Cain: Where is thy brother Abel? And he answered, I know not: am I my brother's keeper? And he said to him: What hast thou done? the voice of thy brother's blood crieth to me from the earth.

Now, therefore, cursed shalt thou be upon the earth, which hath opened her mouth and received the blood of thy brother at thy hand. When thou shalt till it, it shall not yield to thee its fruit: a fugitive and a vagabond shalt thou be upon the earth. And Cain said to the Lord: My iniquity is greater than that I may deserve pardon. Behold thou dost cast me out this day from the face of the earth, and I shall be hidden from thy face, and I shall be a vagabond and a fugitive on the earth: every one, therefore, that findeth me, shall kill me. And the Lord said to him: No, it shall not be so: but whosoever shall kill Cain, shall be punished sevenfold. And the Lord set a mark upon Cain, that whosoever found him should not kill him.

And Cain went out from the face of the Lord, and dwelt as a fugitive on the earth, at the east side of Eden.
"Let all bitterness and animosity and indignation and defamation be removed from you, together with every evil. And become helpfully kind to one another, inwardly compassionate, forgiving among yourselves, just as God also graciously forgave you in the Anointed." – St. Paul

james03

Quotewe should not pretend that a group of humans has on their own ability become extraordinarily influential.

Catholic monarch after Catholic monarch expelled the jews from their kingdoms due to the damage they were doing, especially through their usury.  If your point is that the jews are led by demons, that was more of a reason for the monarchs to expel them.
"But he that doth not believe, is already judged: because he believeth not in the name of the only begotten Son of God (Jn 3:18)."

"All sorrow leads to the foot of the Cross.  Weep for your sins."

"Although He should kill me, I will trust in Him"

TerrorDæmonum

The point is to enable a firm understanding of exactly what is meant by "The Jews" in the context of moral condemnation in the Church. This thread is not about the details of the politics and history of Europe.

Greed is a capital vice and not specific to any one group and that is another topic and not part of this discussion.

European history and politics aside, the use of the term "The Jews" on this forum tends to be about heritage and political divisions and ideas, not religion. People of Jewish heritage who are not in the Church but do not specifically profess and practice the Law of Moses are just as anybody else who does that. There is no specific category that is significant. Unbelievers, heretics, apostates, and schismatics can be of any heritage and have any secular role.

We should not adopt non-Catholic ideologies in the place of Catholic doctrine.

james03

QuoteWe should not adopt non-Catholic ideologies

You'd first have to name the non-Catholic ideology you are referencing.  Are you still trying to cover up your lie?  I thought you changed that to conspiracy theories.  But go ahead and name the non-Catholic "ideology".

QuotePeople of Jewish heritage who are not in the Church but do not specifically profess and practice the Law of Moses are just as anybody else who does that.
Depends.  They can still carry on culturally what they learned from their religion.  David Horowitz, a jew, ascribes the teaching of Tikkun Olam as the cause of marxism in his book The Politics of Bad Faith.  This is why you see a lot of non-practicing (and practicing) jews on the left.  I trust in the opinion of Horowitz who spent his young adult life as a non-practicing jew who was a leader in the marxist movement in the USA including helping to found Ramparts magazine.  He got traumatized after his friend was assassinated and returned to being a practicing jew and is now a leading anti-communist.

When it comes to other matters like usury, it is the beliefs of practicing jews that is troublesome.  Goy are cattle.  You can lie to them and rob from them.

"But he that doth not believe, is already judged: because he believeth not in the name of the only begotten Son of God (Jn 3:18)."

"All sorrow leads to the foot of the Cross.  Weep for your sins."

"Although He should kill me, I will trust in Him"

james03

Look up "Red Diaper Baby Camps", jewish youth camps in the Catskills, NY, where young jews were sent during the summer to be trained in marxist theory.
"But he that doth not believe, is already judged: because he believeth not in the name of the only begotten Son of God (Jn 3:18)."

"All sorrow leads to the foot of the Cross.  Weep for your sins."

"Although He should kill me, I will trust in Him"

Goldfinch

Ignoring the Jewish question is a sign of a badly formed Catholic conscience. This error is prevalent in the Conciliar church, an institution that has become a branch of the Synagogue, but it cannot be ignored by traditional Catholics. The Jews are perpetual enemies of the Church and of Christian civilization.

Our forefathers knew it better and showed us the way.

Quote from: Tradition in ActionIn the Bull Hebraeorum gens of February 26, 1569, St. Pius V (1566-1572) expressly condemned the Jews who dedicated themselves to the practice of "divination, sortilege, sorcery and witchcraft." (32) In that bull St. Pius V also accused the Jews of other crimes such as usury, theft, receiving stolen goods, and soliciting for prostitution. He closes his bull with these words:

"Finally, we consider as known and proven how offensively this perverse generation [the Jews] offends the name of Christ, how hostile it is to those who carry the name of Christians, even making attempts against their lives."

By a decree of February 26, 1569, St. Pius V expelled the Jews from the Pontifical States, since, in addition to the mentioned crimes, the Jews spied for the Muslims and supported their plans of conquest that endangered all Christendom. In this Brief, he said:

"We know that this most perverse people have always been the cause and seed-bag of almost all the heresies."

To this vigilant energy against the Jewish perfidy, St. Pius V added his zealous desire for their conversion. One of the most remarkable conversions he achieved was that of the chief-rabbi of Rome, Elias, followed by the conversions of his three sons and one grandson. On June 4, 1566, they solemnly received Baptism at St. Peter's Basilica in the presence of the Sacred College of Cardinals and a multitude of the faithful.
"For there are no works of power, dearly-beloved, without the trials of temptations, there is no faith without proof, no contest without a foe, no victory without conflict. This life of ours is in the midst of snares, in the midst of battles; if we do not wish to be deceived, we must watch: if we want to overcome, we must fight." - St. Leo the Great

diaduit

Quote from: james03 on March 01, 2022, 10:48:52 AM
Look up "Red Diaper Baby Camps", jewish youth camps in the Catskills, NY, where young jews were sent during the summer to be trained in marxist theory.

Its frightening just how organised our enemies are.  While normies were enjoying 50's and 60's easy living, these crooks were socially engineering their kids with todays agenda in mind.

james03

Quote from: Cum Nimis AbsurdumAs it is completely absurd and improper in the utmost that the Jews, who through their own fault were condemned by God to eternal servitude, can under the pretext that pious Christians must accept them and sustain their habitation, are so ungrateful to Christians, as, instead of thanks for gracious treatment, they return contumely, and among themselves, instead of the slavery, which they deserve, they manage to claim superiority: we, who newly learned that these very Jews have insolently invaded our City Rome and  a number of the Papal States, territories and domains their impudence increased so much that they dare not only to live amongst the Christian people, but also in the vicinity of the churches without any difference of dressing, and even that they rent houses in the main streets and squares, buy and hold immovable property, engage maids, nurses and other Christian servants, and commit other and numerous misdeeds with shame and contempt of the Christian name.

Quote from: Hebraeorum gens"The Jewish people fell from the heights because of their faithlessness and condemned their Redeemer to a shameful death. Their godlessness has assumed such forms that, for the salvation of our own people, it becomes necessary to prevent their disease. Besides usury, through which Jews everywhere have sucked dry the property of impoverished Christians, they are accomplices of thieves and robbers; and the most damaging aspect of the matter is that they allure the unsuspecting through magical incantations, superstition, and witchcraft to the Synagogue of Satan and boast of being able to predict the future. We have carefully investigated how this revolting sect abuses the name of Christ and how harmful they are to those whose life is threatened by their deceit. On account of these and other serious matters, and because of the gravity of their crimes which increase day to day more and more, We order that, within 90 days, all Jews in our entire earthly realm of justice -- in all towns, districts, and places -- must depart these regions."
"But he that doth not believe, is already judged: because he believeth not in the name of the only begotten Son of God (Jn 3:18)."

"All sorrow leads to the foot of the Cross.  Weep for your sins."

"Although He should kill me, I will trust in Him"

queen.saints

Quote from: diaduit on March 01, 2022, 12:54:42 PM
Quote from: james03 on March 01, 2022, 10:48:52 AM
Look up "Red Diaper Baby Camps", jewish youth camps in the Catskills, NY, where young jews were sent during the summer to be trained in marxist theory.

Its frightening just how organised our enemies are.  While normies were enjoying 50's and 60's easy living, these crooks were socially engineering their kids with todays agenda in mind.

Tried to share the sermon, "Parenting with the Zeal of Our Enemies" but the link is broken. I emailed the website to let them know, as they have changed the layout recently and have a new note saying this could be happening.

In the sermon he talks about an interview on NPR or some similar station with a woman whose mother was hard core Russian communist who moved to America. Around the time Roe v Wade was going on the daughter came home from school and said they had a mock trial of the case for debate class and she was on the pro-life side because, she said, "abortion is murder".
Her mother immediately made her "go to Siberia" which was her term for solitary confinement in a closet until she changed her mind. The daughter didn't give in for a long time, but finally said she had realized she was wrong just to get out of Siberia. But the mother could tell she didn't mean it, so she made her start writing letters to girls who had had abortions (I hope I'm remembering everything correctly). Then months passed and the girl thought the mom had forgotten about it, but she hadn't and the girl had been saving up for ice skates or something and the mother made her use the money to pay for a woman's abortion instead. This and other stuff I forget went on for a long time until the daughter had really come to believe that abortion is good.

The priest said what Catholic parents would go to the same rounds for their children.




One interesting thing I was struck by, though, is that the woman in the interview said that today she is pro-choice and all the rest of it... but deep down inside she remembers that first day when she said, "abortion is murder" and there's a part of her that still believes it.

I've always wondered if that's because of her conscience or because no matter how much zeal you have, communist or otherwise, you just can't really change someone's mind by force.
I am sorry for the times I have publicly criticized others on this forum, especially traditional Catholic religious, and any other scandalous posts and pray that no one reads or believes these false and ignorant statements.

james03

"But he that doth not believe, is already judged: because he believeth not in the name of the only begotten Son of God (Jn 3:18)."

"All sorrow leads to the foot of the Cross.  Weep for your sins."

"Although He should kill me, I will trust in Him"

Aulef

Jews are jews... they are just an ethnic group.

Tota pulchra es, Maria
Et macula originalis non est in Te

TerrorDæmonum

Quote from: james03 on March 01, 2022, 10:45:41 AM
QuoteWe should not adopt non-Catholic ideologies

You'd first have to name the non-Catholic ideology you are referencing.  Are you still trying to cover up your lie?  I thought you changed that to conspiracy theories.  But go ahead and name the non-Catholic "ideology".
Ideologies. There are many. Do not accuse me of lying when you are misrepresenting my own statements as you quote them.

QuoteDepends.  They can still carry on culturally what they learned from their religion.  David Horowitz, a jew, ascribes the teaching of Tikkun Olam as the cause of marxism in his book The Politics of Bad Faith.
That is an agnostic person with Jewish ancestry who writes about politics. That is a non-Catholic ideology, is it not? Why are you citing it?

Quote
This is why you see a lot of non-practicing (and practicing) jews on the left.  I trust in the opinion of Horowitz who spent his young adult life as a non-practicing jew who was a leader in the marxist movement in the USA including helping to found Ramparts magazine.  He got traumatized after his friend was assassinated and returned to being a practicing jew and is now a leading anti-communist.
What is "left"? This is theology and doctrine, not politics. Citing non-Catholic sources and ideologies in opposition to Catholic is the problem. You trust in the wrong people.

Quote
When it comes to other matters like usury, it is the beliefs of practicing jews that is troublesome.  Goy are cattle.  You can lie to them and rob from them.
This is not the topic of this thread and greed is not specific to any population. If you want to have a discussion about Christian kingdoms allowing non-Christians to engage in usurious practices when Christians were legally forbidden, make another thread for it. This thread is not about that.

TerrorDæmonum

I made this thread about about the question about who the Jews were that were of relevance to Catholics and in opposition to non-Catholic ideologies.

Citing non-Catholic sources, political commentators and writers, and the like are proving my concern.

Does anyone not think I anticipate the kind of reactions that this thread could get? I know of the political non-Catholic ideological prominence on this forum already. Demonstrating it in this board without self-awareness or discipline proves the point.

Opposing the simple statements of the Catechism are another concern as well, as it was very clear and direct. Bringing in other non-Catholic sources to deny this teaching is very worrisome.

james03

QuoteIdeologies. There are many. Do not accuse me of lying when you are misrepresenting my own statements as you quote them.

I'm giving you a way out.  You accused me of promoting non-catholic ideologies.  That's calumny, unless you can name the non-Catholic ideology I'm promoting.  Up to now you have made your moral situation worse through guile.

It's simple, name the non-Catholic ideology I'm promoting.  I already know you can't because I never did that.  Continue to squirm, it won't make your lie go away.


QuoteThat is an agnostic person with Jewish ancestry who writes about politics. That is a non-Catholic ideology, is it not? Why are you citing it?
I lost track of Horowitz many years ago.  I checked him out when I read his books.  At the time he'd returned to judaism.  If you claim he's now agnostic, I won't dispute it.  The reason I'm citing his work is because he was a main actor in the communism movement in the 60's and fully understood their motives and means.
"But he that doth not believe, is already judged: because he believeth not in the name of the only begotten Son of God (Jn 3:18)."

"All sorrow leads to the foot of the Cross.  Weep for your sins."

"Although He should kill me, I will trust in Him"