Let's Get Ready for Lent!

Started by Miriam_M, February 04, 2018, 12:09:18 PM

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Miriam_M

OK, fellow procrastinators:
:-[

Ash Wednesday is around the corner, and too often some of us don't plan properly.  Here's some preparatory reading and listening to help us live the season productively.

Lenten sermons:
http://traditionalcatholicsermons.org/index_files/SermonsDuringLent.htm

Francis de Sales on Temptation:
http://www.piercedhearts.org/theology_heart/teaching_saints/temptation_francis_de_sales.htm

The late Father Carota on Scripture for Lent
http://www.traditionalcatholicpriest.com/2015/02/18/read-latin-mass-bible-verses-lent/

Father Carota on pious practices:
http://www.traditionalcatholicpriest.com/2015/02/16/12-traditional-catholic-lenten-practices/

One lay person's list and collection of traditional resources:
https://acatholiclife.blogspot.com/2012/02/20-pious-practices-for-lent-what-should.html

SSPX on Fasting:
http://sspx.org/en/rules-fast-and-abstinence

Traditional Catholic e-books:
http://www.traditionalcatholic.co/free-catholicbooks/

MundaCorMeum

I'll definitely get to checking out these links.....later.

Signed,
your fellow procrastinator
;)

actually, that Francis de Sales one looks good.  I've been trying to come up with ONE thing to read this Lent (as opposed to a dozen that I never read)


dymphna17

It seems many are in the preparatory mood.  The Angelus bookstore has been sending out e-mails with suggestions, as well as Tan Books.  Thank you for this Miriam.  You've reminded me that it's time to get into gear!  :)
?
I adore Thee O Christ, and I bless Thee, because by Thy holy cross Thou hast redeemed the world!

Jesus, Mary, and Joseph save souls!

Of course I wear jeans, "The tornadoes can make dresses immodest." RSC

"Don't waste time in your life trying to get even with your enemies. The grave is a tremendous equalizer. Six weeks after you all are dead, you'll look pretty much the same. Let the Lord take care of those whom you think have harmed you. All you have to do is love and forgive. Try to forget and leave all else to the Master."– Mother Angelica

Miriam_M

#3
Quote from: dymphna17 on February 04, 2018, 07:50:19 PM
It seems many are in the preparatory mood.  The Angelus bookstore has been sending out e-mails with suggestions, as well as Tan Books.  Thank you for this Miriam.  You've reminded me that it's time to get into gear!  :)

Perhaps this page below from Angelus was included in those emailed suggestions.  (I cannot find the actual complete Lenten sermons of De Sales except in printed format, for purchase.)  There are other good suggestions here on the link, such as the Holy Hour of Reparation:

https://angeluspress.org/products/the-sermons-of-st-francis-de-sales-for-lent.

I know that TAN books has it, too, but I liked the extra suggestions on the above page.
:)

Last year I bought Tomas A Kempis, On the Passion of Christ
Viewable here:

https://books.google.com/books?id=w4tHDwAAQBAJ

Lynne

Back in 2016, KK published a great spreadsheet for organizing one's sacrifices for Lent. I updated it for 2018.
In conclusion, I can leave you with no better advice than that given after every sermon by Msgr Vincent Giammarino, who was pastor of St Michael's Church in Atlantic City in the 1950s:

    "My dear good people: Do what you have to do, When you're supposed to do it, The best way you can do it,   For the Love of God. Amen"

Carleendiane

Quote from: Lynne on February 09, 2018, 04:39:25 PM
Back in 2016, KK published a great spreadsheet for organizing one's sacrifices for Lent. I updated it for 2018.

Thank you, lynne!
To board the struggle bus: no whining, board with a smile, a fake one will be found out and put off at next stop, no maps, no directions, going only one way, one destination. Follow all rules and you will arrive. Drop off at pearly gate. Bring nothing.

Miriam_M

Archbishop Lefebvre on fasting and abstinence

"Pray and do penance. Do penance in order to pray better, in order to draw closer to Almighty God."

In his Lenten message of February 1982, Archbishop Marcel Lefebvre addresses the important subject of fasting and abstinence, especially in light of the newer, relaxed regulations instituted by Pope Paul VI in his apostolic constitution, Paenitemini. The archbishop exhorts the faithful for their personal sanctification to voluntarily practice the traditional rules, even though they are not strictly binding.

Archbishop Marcel Lefebvre on fasting and abstinence
"My dear brethren,

According to an ancient and salutary tradition in the Church, on the occasion of the beginning of Lent, I address these words to you in order to encourage you to enter into this penitential season wholeheartedly, with the dispositions willed by the Church and to accomplish the purpose for which the Church prescribes it.

If I look in books from the early part of this century, I find that they indicate three purposes for which the Church has prescribed this penitential time:

first, in order to curb the concupiscence of the flesh;
then, to facilitate the elevation of our souls toward divine realities;
finally, to make satisfaction for our sins.
Our Lord gave us the example during His life, here on earth: pray and do penance. However, Our Lord, being free from concupiscence and sin, did penance and made satisfaction for our sins, thus showing us that our penance may be beneficial not only for ourselves but also for others.

Pray and do penance. Do penance in order to pray better, in order to draw closer to Almighty God. This is what all the saints have done, and this is that of which all the messages of the Blessed Virgin remind us.

Would we dare to say that this necessity is less important in our day and age than in former times? On the contrary, we can and we must affirm that today, more than ever before, prayer and penance are necessary because everything possible has been done to diminish and denigrate these two fundamental elements of Christian life.

Never before has the world sought to satisfy—without any limit, the disordered instincts of the flesh, even to the point of the murder of millions of innocent, unborn children. One would come to believe that society has no other reason for existence except to give the greatest material standard of living to all men in order that they should not be deprived of material goods.

Thus we can see that such a society would be opposed to what the Church prescribes. In these times, when even Churchmen align themselves with the spirit of this world, we witness the disappearance of prayer and penance-particularly in their character of reparation for sins and obtaining pardon for faults. Few there are today who love to recite Psalm 50, the Miserere, and who say with the psalmist, Peccatum meum contra me est semper—"My sin is always before me." How can a Christian remove the thought of sin if the image of the crucifix is always before his eyes?

At the Council the bishops requested such a diminution of fast and abstinence that the prescriptions have practically disappeared. We must recognize the fact that this disappearance is a consequence of the ecumenical and Protestant spirit which denies the necessity of our participation for the application of the merits of Our Lord to each one of us for the remission of our sins and the restoration of our divine affiliation [i.e., our character as adoptive sons of God].

In the past the commandments of the Church provided for:
an obligatory fast on all days of Lent with the exception of Sundays, for the three Ember Days and for many Vigils;
abstinence was for all Fridays of the year, the Saturdays of Lent and, in numerous dioceses, all the Saturdays of the year.
What remains of these prescriptions—the fast for Ash Wednesday and Good Friday and abstinence for Ash Wednesday and the Fridays of Lent.

One wonders at the motives for such a drastic diminution. Who are obliged to observe the fast?—adults from age 21 to 60 [here in the USA, the minimum age is 18 years old—Ed.]. And who are obliged to observe abstinence?—all the faithful from the age of 7 years.

What does fasting mean? To fast means to take only one (full) meal a day to which one may add two collations (or small meals), one in the morning, one in the evening which, when combined, do not equal a full meal.[The archbishop is referring to the European order of meals; in the United States though, dinner is usually the evening meal—Ed.]

What is meant by abstinence? By abstinence is meant that one abstains from meat.

The faithful who have a true spirit of faith and who profoundly understand the motives of the Church which have been mentioned above, will wholeheartedly accomplish not only the light prescriptions of today but, entering into the spirit of Our Lord and of the Blessed Virgin Mary, will endeavor to make reparation for the sins which they have committed and for the sins of their family, their neighbors, friends and fellow citizens.

It is for this reason that they will add to the actual prescriptions. These additional penances might be to fast for all Fridays of Lent, abstinence from all alcoholic beverages, abstinence from television, or other similar sacrifices. They will make an effort to pray more, to assist more frequently at the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass, to recite the rosary, and not to miss evening prayers with the family. They will detach themselves from their superfluous material goods in order to aid the seminaries, help establish schools, help their priests adequately furnish the chapels and to help establish novitiates for nuns and brothers.

The prescriptions of the Church do not concern fast and abstinence alone but also of the obligation of the Paschal Communion (Easter Duty). Here is what the Vicar of the Diocese of Sion, in Switzerland, recommended to the faithful of that diocese on February 20, 1919:

During Lent, the pastors will have the Stations of the Cross twice a week; one day for the children of the schools and another day for the other parishioners. After the Stations of the Cross, they will recite the Litany of the Sacred Heart.
During Passion Week, which is to say, the week before Palm Sunday, there will be a Triduum in all parish churches, Instruction, Litany of the Sacred Heart in the Presence of the Blessed Sacrament, Benediction. In these instructions the pastors will simply and clearly remind their parishioners of the principal conditions to receive the Sacrament of Penance worthily.
The time during which one may fulfill the Easter Duty has been set for all parishes from Passion Sunday to the first Sunday after Easter.
Why should these directives no longer be useful today? Let us profit from this salutary time during the course of which Our Lord is accustomed to dispense grace abundantly. Let us not imitate the foolish virgins who having no oil in their lamps found the door of the bridegroom's house closed and this terrible response: Nescio vos—"I know you not." Blessed are they who have the spirit of poverty for theirs is the kingdom of heaven. The spirit of poverty means the spirit of detachment from things of this world.

Blessed are they who weep for they shall be consoled. Let us think of Jesus in the Garden of Olives who wept for our sins. It is henceforth for us to weep for our sins and for those of our brethren.

Blessed are they who hunger and thirst for holiness for they shall be satisfied. Holiness—sanctity is attained by means of the Cross, penance and sacrifice. If we truly seek perfection then we must follow the Way of the Cross.

May we, during this Lenten Season, hear the call of Jesus and Mary and engage ourselves to follow them in this crusade of prayer and penance.

May our prayers, our supplications, and our sacrifices obtain from heaven the grace that those in places of responsibility in the Church return to her true and holy traditions, which is the only solution to revive and reflourish the institutions of the Church again.

Let us love to recite the conclusion of the Te Deum: In te Domine, speravi; non confundar in aeternum—"In Thee, O Lord, I have hoped. I will not be confounded in eternity." '

+ Marcel Lefebvre
Sexagesima Sunday
February 14, 1982
Rickenbach, Switzerland

martin88nyc

Here a special treat from CatholiFamilyNews:
my favorite preacher, Fr. Maru Issac Relyea
[yt]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0knYz07Bq3g[/yt]
"These things I have spoken to you, that in me you may have peace. In the world you shall have distress: but have confidence, I have overcome the world." John 16:33

Miriam_M

Quote from: martin88nyc on February 14, 2018, 02:43:59 PM
Here a special treat from CatholiFamilyNews:
my favorite preacher, Fr. Issac Mary Relyea
[yt]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0knYz07Bq3g[/yt]

Martin, I listened to all of it today -- the 1 hr, 10 minutes.  Quite stirring.  There's a power to the audio of a recorded sermon.
Thank you so much.

Chestertonian

so...i clicked on it and listened to it

i probably shouldnt have because online sermons tend to make me really anxious and worried i am doing everything wrong. 

he mentioned the st alphonsus sermon about how each of us has a number of sins God will allow before He stops beingmerciful and how we cnt test the liits of his mercy

but the thing about focusing on our obligations, and the obligation to practice mortification.  this is something that will keep me up all night--how do I know what I'm obligated to do, and what mortification i'm obligated to do.  are we obligated to take on more mortification than God gives us through daily life.  i really do think that daily life has more than enough penances but if i say that I worry that I'm being selfish with God.  i dont know how to stop worrying about this.  I feel like God expects us to run ourselves into the ground with penances and He isn't satisfied until we are pushed to the absolute limit and then some, on the verge of drowning.  i worry that if i'm not extremely harsh with myself pushing myself to the absolute limit then God will think I am selfish and lazy i keep worrying that i'm making excuses or rationalizing.  i cant sleep because i cant stop worryng. 
"I am not much of a Crusader, that is for sure, but at least I am not a Mohamedist!"

Jayne

One of my favourite things to reread during Lent is Introduction to the Devout Life by St. Francis de Sales. I came across a passage that made me think of Chestertonian:

QuoteThe discipline of purification can and must cease only with our life, therefore be not discouraged by infirmities; our perfection consists in struggling against them, which we cannot do unless we perceive them, neither can we conquer unless we come into collision with them. Victory does not lie in ignoring our infirmities, but in resisting them.

Therefore being grieved by them is not consenting to them - our humility is at times tested by the wounds which we receive in this spiritual combat, but we are never conquered unless we lose our courage or our life.  And our spiritual life can be extinguished only by mortal sins - not by imperfections and venial sins - therefore we have the more need to watch that these do not destroy our courage.... It is a favourable feature of this war that as long as long as we will fight, we must be victorious.

tl;dr verson: God does not expect us to overcome all of our sins in this lifetime, just to keep trying.
Jesus, meek and humble of heart, make my heart like unto Thine.

martin88nyc

Quote from: Chestertonian on February 16, 2018, 09:54:41 AM
so...i clicked on it and listened to it

i probably shouldnt have because online sermons tend to make me really anxious and worried i am doing everything wrong. 

he mentioned the st alphonsus sermon about how each of us has a number of sins God will allow before He stops beingmerciful and how we cnt test the liits of his mercy

but the thing about focusing on our obligations, and the obligation to practice mortification.  this is something that will keep me up all night--how do I know what I'm obligated to do, and what mortification i'm obligated to do.  are we obligated to take on more mortification than God gives us through daily life.  i really do think that daily life has more than enough penances but if i say that I worry that I'm being selfish with God.  i dont know how to stop worrying about this.  I feel like God expects us to run ourselves into the ground with penances and He isn't satisfied until we are pushed to the absolute limit and then some, on the verge of drowning.  i worry that if i'm not extremely harsh with myself pushing myself to the absolute limit then God will think I am selfish and lazy i keep worrying that i'm making excuses or rationalizing.  i cant sleep because i cant stop worryng.
No Ches. Don't think this way. You are carrying a heavy cross already. You cannot feel sorry about this. Jesus brought peace not anxiety. I know it is easy to say don't worry but our worries are often uncontrollable like inner anxiety and fear which are often a result of a disease or physical suffering. However if you worry about your obligations then think if you are even physically able to fulfill them. If your condition paralyzes you and makes it super hard to think or do anything then God doesn't expect you to do anything heroic. Just offering your own suffering in union with Christ's suffering will suffice I am sure.
"These things I have spoken to you, that in me you may have peace. In the world you shall have distress: but have confidence, I have overcome the world." John 16:33

Miriam_M

Quote from: Chestertonian on February 16, 2018, 09:54:41 AM
so...i clicked on it and listened to it

i probably shouldnt have because online sermons tend to make me really anxious and worried i am doing everything wrong. 

he mentioned the st alphonsus sermon about how each of us has a number of sins God will allow before He stops beingmerciful and how we cnt test the liits of his mercy

but the thing about focusing on our obligations, and the obligation to practice mortification.  this is something that will keep me up all night--how do I know what I'm obligated to do, and what mortification i'm obligated to do.  are we obligated to take on more mortification than God gives us through daily life.  i really do think that daily life has more than enough penances but if i say that I worry that I'm being selfish with God.  i dont know how to stop worrying about this.  I feel like God expects us to run ourselves into the ground with penances and He isn't satisfied until we are pushed to the absolute limit and then some, on the verge of drowning.  i worry that if i'm not extremely harsh with myself pushing myself to the absolute limit then God will think I am selfish and lazy i keep worrying that i'm making excuses or rationalizing.  i cant sleep because i cant stop worryng.

Actually, that was the part (about mortification) which I think was the most helpful, grounded, and instructive.  His emphasis was especially on how mortification must not (a) endanger our bodies, (b) override our duties to our state in life, which always come first (c) supersede our everyday obligations (jobs, our own health, other responsibilities), which come first.  He gave many examples of that.  That would obviously include protecting an already vulnerable body. 

I think your reaction is an example of how you project from the inside out, although in your post here you also seem to acknowledge that you do that in general and that you might have done that in this case, too.

In addition, if sermons make you anxious, don't listen to them!  Each of us has our "triggered" and sensitive areas.  For me, I have to make an extra effort to avoid occasions of anger -- such as certain topics on the Internet or IRL.  I know those areas that are not good for my soul or even for my psyche.  Keep in mind that sermons are directed toward "general audiences," and so by definition will not be shaped toward the extreme on either end.  In this case, that would mean he did not direct his sermon toward either the completely non-practicing Catholic or the scrupulously practicing Catholic.  Rather, he was targeting his words toward the tendency of the rest of us to excuse our need for mortifying our senses and practicing custody of the eyes, the ears, etc.  But on the other hand he was also positive about how helpful mortification is to conquering our vices in general or specifically.  I've listened to traditional sermons that were much more rigorous and admonishing than this one.

Nevertheless, I know what you mean about the "number of sins" business (St. Alphonsus Liguori).  It has indeed come up here on SD, possibly because you may have brought it up, but it's something that has concerned me, too.  I'm going to ask my spiritual director about it when next I see him.

Back to mortification:  You said it yourself...Your daily life has sufficient mortification in it.  I daresay that for most of us, we also -- while not acknowledging that -- have "sufficient mortification," not because we have a serious physical disease, but because we consider opportunities for mortification to be opportunities for complaint, and because in our Pride we are indignant that we should have to suffer the annoyances of the loud person in line in front of us, the inconsiderate co-worker, the slow-moving parishioner, the critical supervisor, etc.  Instead of thanking God for the opportunity to share the Cross, we reject the opportunity.  Lent gives us time to become more grateful, so that we might carry our Lenten lessons into Paschaltide and beyond.  :)

Miriam_M

Quote from: Chestertonian on February 16, 2018, 09:54:41 AM

he mentioned the st alphonsus sermon about how each of us has a number of sins God will allow before He stops beingmerciful and how we cnt test the liits of his mercy

And I just listened to this traditional sermon about the numbering of sins of St. Alphonsus Liguori:
http://traditionalcatholicsermons.org/index_files/StAlphonsus_FirstSundayOfLent_OnTheNumberOfSinsBeyondWhichGodPardonNoMore.mp3

The two concepts underpinning this theology are these:

(1) Presumption (especially).  Presumption is a grave sin, which is the opposite of Despair (another grave sin, but don't imagine that you are, by contrast, guilty of despair; but when you nourish too much discouragement -- when any of us do -- we invite the possibility of the sin of Despair, which is one of many reasons people on the forum try to dissuade you from extreme discouragement). 

As an aside, discouragement is important to subdue because it does not represent reality; it is an illusion sustained by our imaginations and exploited by the Devil to get us to turn away from God.  The Devil loves discouragement.  Loves it.  It makes his job of alienation from God super-easy, because the line between excessive, prolonged discouragement and outright despair is thin.  We have an obligation, morally, to tame discouragement --ignore it, discard it, walk away from it, pray confidently to Mary that she will help us to reject it and give it no power over our prayer lives.  And that is because we have a moral obligation to avoid temptation, and discouragement (for some of us) is a real temptation.  It obviously is for you.

We also have an obligation to seek release from our attachments which are unhealthy and unholy.  (Holiness thrives within emotional health, but emotional health is not the same thing as a life free from from suffering.)  It is not that difficult to stay attached to unhealthy habits and emotions, because even ones which make us sad can provide a kind of comfort to us because they keep us complacent in our unhappiness, without the urgency to change. They are familiar.  I speak of personal experience with this.  Attachments to unholy and unhealthy states  (by attachment is meant the lack of interest in vigorously seeking grace to counteract them) tend to sustain the likelihood of temptation to sins of omission or commission, depending on the nature of the attachment.

Back to this priest's elaboration on St. Alphonsus: 
The priest quoted many Scripture passages which fall into the category of the sin of presumption.  That's another indication that Presumption is St. Alphonsus' reference point, or one of them.

(2) Absence of firm purpose of amendment

The context the priest spoke of was (especially) repetitive sin, in which the sinner does not make sincere attempts to change.  Obviously, the more habitual our sin is, the more effort is required to separate ourselves from habit, so more effort would be expected of the habitual violator of any particular Commandment.  But that would include (again) vigorous and concrete efforts to avoid temptation.  An example would be the cohabiting fornicator who realizes his/her error, rationalizes that it is possible to continue sharing a household but sleeping in different beds (or in the same bed; seriously, I was once acquainted with a situation just like this), thus theoretically remain chaste.  But in practical terms the situation is impossible to sustain more than a week or two, and the couple finds themselves sinning. (Surprise!)  A serious effort has not yet been made.

So what are we cohabiting with?  What or whom are we welcoming into our bed to tempt us into sin?  Attachments to dispositions which threaten our loving and obedient trust in God -- our ordered sense that we are neither "specially" good nor especially bad, such that we are an exception to the rest of humanity, and God "cannot" forgive us?  God can and will forgive us if we give Him permission to.  Think about it.

Quotei worry that if i'm not extremely harsh with myself pushing myself to the absolute limit then God will think I am selfish and lazy i keep worrying that i'm making excuses or rationalizing.  i cant sleep because i cant stop worryng.

God is not subject to the processes of deduction.  His understanding, knowledge, and interpretation are instant, perfect, incontrovertible, and absolute.  He knows whether you are selfish and lazy --whether a particular action or omission was -- and does not have to deduce that from your "pushing yourself to the absolute limit."  Second, He knows what the absolute limit of each individual is, which would differ depending on the individual's temperament and circumstances.  Someone who is already in pain or is suffering some kind of other limitation (such as emotional), which, under other circumstances might not be experienced as debilitating, has a different "absolute limit" at a particular moment than someone else.  There is no "general standard" with God.  And for that matter, both lay people and clergy who are blessed with specific graces, are expected to avail themselves of those graces, which may make their "absolute limit" quite different from yours or mine.  The same is true of natural inclinations.  One daughter of mine bears physical pain and emotional setbacks almost heroically (compared to the general population), while the other daughter struggles with physical pain because she is so sensitive and feels everything so acutely.

Chestertonian

Quote from: Miriam_M on February 19, 2018, 02:34:46 PM
Quote from: Chestertonian on February 16, 2018, 09:54:41 AM

he mentioned the st alphonsus sermon about how each of us has a number of sins God will allow before He stops beingmerciful and how we cnt test the liits of his mercy

And I just listened to this traditional sermon about the numbering of sins of St. Alphonsus Liguori:
http://traditionalcatholicsermons.org/index_files/StAlphonsus_FirstSundayOfLent_OnTheNumberOfSinsBeyondWhichGodPardonNoMore.mp3

The two concepts underpinning this theology are these:

(1) Presumption (especially).  Presumption is a grave sin, which is the opposite of Despair (another grave sin, but don't imagine that you are, by contrast, guilty of despair; but when you nourish too much discouragement -- when any of us do -- we invite the possibility of the sin of Despair, which is one of many reasons people on the forum try to dissuade you from extreme discouragement). 

As an aside, discouragement is important to subdue because it does not represent reality; it is an illusion sustained by our imaginations and exploited by the Devil to get us to turn away from God.  The Devil loves discouragement.  Loves it.  It makes his job of alienation from God super-easy, because the line between excessive, prolonged discouragement and outright despair is thin.  We have an obligation, morally, to tame discouragement --ignore it, discard it, walk away from it, pray confidently to Mary that she will help us to reject it and give it no power over our prayer lives.  And that is because we have a moral obligation to avoid temptation, and discouragement (for some of us) is a real temptation.  It obviously is for you.

We also have an obligation to seek release from our attachments which are unhealthy and unholy.  (Holiness thrives within emotional health, but emotional health is not the same thing as a life free from from suffering.)  It is not that difficult to stay attached to unhealthy habits and emotions, because even ones which make us sad can provide a kind of comfort to us because they keep us complacent in our unhappiness, without the urgency to change. They are familiar.  I speak of personal experience with this.  Attachments to unholy and unhealthy states  (by attachment is meant the lack of interest in vigorously seeking grace to counteract them) tend to sustain the likelihood of temptation to sins of omission or commission, depending on the nature of the attachment.

Back to this priest's elaboration on St. Alphonsus: 
The priest quoted many Scripture passages which fall into the category of the sin of presumption.  That's another indication that Presumption is St. Alphonsus' reference point, or one of them.

(2) Absence of firm purpose of amendment

The context the priest spoke of was (especially) repetitive sin, in which the sinner does not make sincere attempts to change.  Obviously, the more habitual our sin is, the more effort is required to separate ourselves from habit, so more effort would be expected of the habitual violator of any particular Commandment.  But that would include (again) vigorous and concrete efforts to avoid temptation.  An example would be the cohabiting fornicator who realizes his/her error, rationalizes that it is possible to continue sharing a household but sleeping in different beds (or in the same bed; seriously, I was once acquainted with a situation just like this), thus theoretically remain chaste.  But in practical terms the situation is impossible to sustain more than a week or two, and the couple finds themselves sinning. (Surprise!)  A serious effort has not yet been made.

So what are we cohabiting with?  What or whom are we welcoming into our bed to tempt us into sin?  Attachments to dispositions which threaten our loving and obedient trust in God -- our ordered sense that we are neither "specially" good nor especially bad, such that we are an exception to the rest of humanity, and God "cannot" forgive us?  God can and will forgive us if we give Him permission to.  Think about it.

Quotei worry that if i'm not extremely harsh with myself pushing myself to the absolute limit then God will think I am selfish and lazy i keep worrying that i'm making excuses or rationalizing.  i cant sleep because i cant stop worryng.

God is not subject to the processes of deduction.  His understanding, knowledge, and interpretation are instant, perfect, incontrovertible, and absolute.  He knows whether you are selfish and lazy --whether a particular action or omission was -- and does not have to deduce that from your "pushing yourself to the absolute limit."  Second, He knows what the absolute limit of each individual is, which would differ depending on the individual's temperament and circumstances.  Someone who is already in pain or is suffering some kind of other limitation (such as emotional), which, under other circumstances might not be experienced as debilitating, has a different "absolute limit" at a particular moment than someone else.  There is no "general standard" with God.  And for that matter, both lay people and clergy who are blessed with specific graces, are expected to avail themselves of those graces, which may make their "absolute limit" quite different from yours or mine.  The same is true of natural inclinations.  One daughter of mine bears physical pain and emotional setbacks almost heroically (compared to the general population), while the other daughter struggles with physical pain because she is so sensitive and feels everything so acutely.

Quote from: Miriam_M on February 19, 2018, 02:34:46 PM
The same is true of natural inclinations.  One daughter of mine bears physical pain and emotional setbacks almost heroically (compared to the general population), while the other daughter struggles with physical pain because she is so sensitive and feels everything so acutely.

that's an interesting distinction.  i would say that i am definitely in the latter category, not necessarily about physical pain mostly becaue physical pain is so relative and it's hard to gauge how one is *supposed* to be coping with it.  that old scale of 1 to 10... what is 10?  i know my 10 changes the worse things get.  i know giving up pain medication for lent put me in the hospital. 

but i have always been extremely sensitive / "the anxious type" ever since I was a little kid.  My parents did try to beat it out of me but clearly they were unsuccessful.  i also remember growing up, failure was not an option.  so i do not cope with failure and setbacks well, even small failures.  i often worry that it is impossible to be heroic with this temperament.  i am always worrying that God wants absolute perfection and since i missed my opportunity to do something perfectly in the past, or i feel like perfection is impossible so why even try.  cant stop dwelling on how many times i made choices that were less heroic and less perfect even if they werent objectively sinful. 

i am not sure how to tell if i am "attached to a disposition."  I dont know how it would be possible to detach.  a lot of the times the thoughts come into my head so fast and they're so numerous i cant handle them allat once.  there are medications i sometimes take to calm down but i'm not taking any of them because i have to be awake enough to handle visiting my wife every day. 

it's hard to identify what I can control about my thoughts and disposition and what's beyond my control so the most sensible thing to do is assume thw worst possible conclusion about myself which is that everything is my own damn fault and that i could be doing more to mortify myself.. maybe this is the spiritual blindness of the Jews the church talks about... I used to think that canverting gave me a stot at salvation but at this point it's hopeless... Just seems like i angered God even more by converting and not living a perfect catholic life.  He gave me these kids but I can't enjoy them I just think about how much I failed them and how their chance at salvation is probably not very high considering the fewness of the saved

what makes this so confusing is that yes, only God knows what our own personal limits is.  He knows what our "personal best" looks like, but the problem is, I don't.  I have no clue whether I'm at my limit or whether maybe God thinks I can push myself a little more.  Like i thought about giving up occupational therapy because it's the only thing i do that's relaxing.  if i ask myself the question, am i really doing my best or am i just being lazy?" i have no idea what the answer is.  On some level giving up OT seemsirrational but there's no way to know especially with the concern about laxity?... What if I'm lax
"I am not much of a Crusader, that is for sure, but at least I am not a Mohamedist!"