Byzantine Empire and the Jewish Problem

[Jayne]

I love arguing, but not with devious types who make you do all the legwork.

What is devious about expecting you to make logical arguments?  Graham is taking the same position that you are and he is making reasoned arguments, not complaining about how hard it is to have to think.

[Jayne]

I am a Catholic in the sense that I believe everything the Church teaches I should believe, participate in the Sacraments and am in communion with the Pope (when there is one.)

[dueSicilie]

Jayne, it's pointless presenting you with logical arguments. You simple sidestep them and then ask for an argument again.

[Jayne]

Jayne, it's pointless presenting you with logical arguments. You simple sidestep them and then ask for an argument again.

I concede to logical arguments if they are good enough.  But I am sure not convinced by people telling me I am devious or not a real Catholic. 

[dueSicilie]

But I am sure not convinced by people telling me I am devious or not a real Catholic.

Well, I'm certainly not going to endorse that.

[Graham]

Right now, Judaism is the weakest it has ever been.  They will not survive if current trends continue.

Wow, that's an incredibly bold position. The Jews have their own ethno-state, in which the current political climate is pretty far right. They have a world class conventional military and an arsenal of nukes. The have what amounts to a death grip on the economy, politics, and cultural life of the West. Now, if you want to argue that diaspora Jews are increasingly secular, that the godlessness they did so much to spread is coming back to bite them, I'm sure there's some truth to that, but they retain their group loyalty and their Talmudic anti-Christ mentality.

Of course, they weren't forced into predatory lending.  They chose to be predatory.  But money lending was one of few means of livelihood left open to them.

I suspect this is an overgeneralization, and I'm certain that the Jewish affinity for usury predates ecclesiastical and civil restrictions, since Jesus cast them out of the temple 1000 years before Innocent III was around. It is probably a Jewish narrative that they were forced into it.

I did not say anything about having particular sympathy for Jews.

You sure post a lot about the subject.

If the highest law is the salvation of souls then encouraging conversions should be the determining factor in establishing policies toward Jews.  There is nothing in Catholic tradition that says it is OK to say "well they won't convert anyhow so we don't need to think about this."

Then why did the Church act to restrict them for so many centuries? It was self-defense against an intransigent and rapacious enemy.

[Vetus Ordo]

He who denys that Christ has come in the flesh is of antichrist

Which includes a lot of people besides Jews.

[voxxpopulisuxx]

He who denys that Christ has come in the flesh is of antichrist

Which includes a lot of people besides Jews.

well of course but eretz Israel is an entire nuclear armed criminal nation which holds the USA's leadership by the shortys. It is the seat of antichrist in the current world.

[Vetus Ordo]

He who denys that Christ has come in the flesh is of antichrist

Which includes a lot of people besides Jews.

well of course but eretz Israel is an entire nuclear armed criminal nation which holds the USA's leadership by the shortys. It is the seat of antichrist in the current world.

Is that a definite assessment?

[poche]

If Jesus was not a Jew, then why did he follow the Jewish law?

[voxxpopulisuxx]

He who denys that Christ has come in the flesh is of antichrist

Which includes a lot of people besides Jews.

well of course but eretz Israel is an entire nuclear armed criminal nation which holds the USA's leadership by the shortys. It is the seat of antichrist in the current world.

Is that a definite assessment?

as far as Im concerned...prove me wrong.

[Vetus Ordo]

He who denys that Christ has come in the flesh is of antichrist

Which includes a lot of people besides Jews.

well of course but eretz Israel is an entire nuclear armed criminal nation which holds the USA's leadership by the shortys. It is the seat of antichrist in the current world.

Is that a definite assessment?

as far as Im concerned...prove me wrong.

You want me to prove a negative? That Israel is not the seat of the antichrist?

I believe it works the other way around.

[voxxpopulisuxx]

He who denys that Christ has come in the flesh is of antichrist

Which includes a lot of people besides Jews.

well of course but eretz Israel is an entire nuclear armed criminal nation which holds the USA's leadership by the shortys. It is the seat of antichrist in the current world.

Is that a definite assessment?

as far as Im concerned...prove me wrong.

You want me to prove a negative? That Israel is not the seat of the antichrist?

I believe it works the other way around.

No I asserted my evidence you need to refute it. The Bible clearly states what it does....Eretz Isreal is the only world power that has at its core an adherence to the denial of Jesus Christ specifically. While other communists countrys ban Christianity or religion...no other nation uses the denial of Jesus Christ as a tenet of its nationality. And no other country is so committed to violence and hatred....and no other nation has the holy land in its borders.

[Gottmitunsalex]

We even have Jewish converts to Catholicism today, like Roy Schoeman and David Moss, who propagate these same sentiments by claiming that the Old Covenant is still in force, and that the Jews are going to take over Palestine under divine mandate and offer sacrifices in Jerusalem again, and all this in fulfillment, they claim, by the words of Jesus Christ. This is total nonsense, and it is one of the most pernicious and nefarious heresies the Church has ever faced...

http://sungenisandthejews.com/Converts_and_Conclusion.html

Talk about modern marranos.

[Vetus Ordo]

He who denys that Christ has come in the flesh is of antichrist

Which includes a lot of people besides Jews.

well of course but eretz Israel is an entire nuclear armed criminal nation which holds the USA's leadership by the shortys. It is the seat of antichrist in the current world.

Is that a definite assessment?

as far as Im concerned...prove me wrong.

You want me to prove a negative? That Israel is not the seat of the antichrist?

I believe it works the other way around.

No I asserted my evidence you need to refute it. The Bible clearly states what it does....Eretz Isreal is the only world power that has at its core an adherence to the denial of Jesus Christ specifically. While other communists countrys ban Christianity or religion...no other nation uses the denial of Jesus Christ as a tenet of its nationality. And no other country is so committed to violence and hatred....and no other nation has the holy land in its borders.

Israel is a secular country, as far as I can tell.  I'd hardly say that the nation has at its core an adherence to the denial of Jesus Christ.

As for being committed to violence and hatred, it's no more than its Arab neighbours.