Childhood vaccinations - yea or nay?

[Greg]

I would look at each disease on a case by case basis.  Risk reward.

MMR is a money saving effort.  Three vaccines at once seems stupid to me.  Plus, whoever heard of a child dying of mumps or rubella ?

How risky is measles?  Have you heard of many cases of it?  Are the chances of dying from it lower than 50 years ago thanks to better therapeutic drugs?

Can you get the classic vaccine as opposed to the latest concoction?

I have heard of children in my social circle dying from cot deaths, birth defects, car accidents but I don't think I know one case of a child dying of a disease they commonly vaccinate against.

[Francisco Javier]

I just came across a reddit thread for junior doctors discussing training (residency) and life beyond, and they are talking about whether or not they should get paid based off of what they bill for (RVUs = relative value units) or off of how healthy their patients are (ie docs should be rewarded not just for cutting but for actually taking time to make sure their patients have a decent quality of life, aren't obese, etc)

The top post is a pediatrician discussing how he gets paid according to both criteria, but the wellness of his childhood patients is basically determined by how many vaccines they get before turning 2 (not their actual health). It amounts to a 36k/yr bonus, which is quite substantial for pediatricians as they are the lowest paid medical specialty. So perhaps 1/6 of this doctor's total comp (and maybe half of his discretionary play money) is tied up in pushing the vaccines, and the 2 year time crunch would explain why docs get upset if you 'just want to wait on the hep b vaccines because I don't think my baby is at risk of a needle stick or dirty sex acts transmitting the disease'

kinda shocking to see how the sausage is made - I've heard people allude to such metrics of control online but I haven't seen it so bluntly laid out with actual facts and figures

Again, I don't want to counter signal all vaccines for all people all the time, but the facts need to be laid out and they simply aren't in a transparent manner

https://old.reddit.com/r/Residency/comments/14606t4/rvu_modelfee_for_service_vs_managed_carebased_on/

Dr. Mike Ginny:

"At the end of the year, there are seven quality measures. If we meet six of them we get $36k (the seventh is a freebee so you can biff one measure and still get the full payout).

At least in peds, the quality measures are really challenging. My newborns have to get by age 2:

3xHBV
3xIPV
2xRV1 or 3xRV5 (or 3x of a combo of the two)
4xDTaP
3xPRP-OMP or 4xPRP-T (HiB)
4xPCV13
1xMMR
1xVZV
1xHAV
2xFlu"

[Lynne]

a 36k/yr bonus

The system is broken.

[Baylee]

Lastly I would remind you that it doesn't have to be an all or nothing scenario.

This seems to make the most sense to me.  It seems to me that the vaccines one should look to get are the ones that have been given to us for decades with no apparent side effects (polio, rubella, etc).  Not sure when we got the uptick in the number and variety of vaccines given to children, but I would say that unless there was a real obvious need for them, I'd skip those.

[Lynne]

Lastly I would remind you that it doesn't have to be an all or nothing scenario.

This seems to make the most sense to me.  It seems to me that the vaccines one should look to get are the ones that have been given to us for decades with no apparent side effects (polio, rubella, etc).  Not sure when we got the uptick in the number and variety of vaccines given to children, but I would say that unless there was a real obvious need for them, I'd skip those.

It's good that RFK Jr is running for president. All sorts of previous reports/studies on the "safety" of *all* vaccines will be uncovered. If only he was pro-life.

[Bonaventure]

I came up with a question to pose to you all.

How does the Forum collectively feel with regards to childhood vaccination (not thinking/speaking of the COVID one)? 

Are you for it?  Against it?  Did the COVID debacle change your mind? 

What do you think? 

We did them. The boy won't be able to enroll in any schools (NO or public) without them.

This is something I am willing to answer for at the Judgment Seat.

[LausTibiChriste]

We gave the bare minimum to our first, giving none to our second.

Vaccines are bullshit.

And if you think I'm a nutcase, conspiracy theorist, take a gander at my thoughts 7 years ago: https://www.suscipedomine.com/forum/index.php?topic=14104.0

#Humility.


Everyone should read "To Vaccinate or not to Vaccinate: A Review of Scientific Literature on Vaccines" by A. Amantonio

[ChairmanJoeAintMyPrez]

We gave the bare minimum to our first, giving none to our second.

Vaccines are bullshit.

And if you think I'm a nutcase, conspiracy theorist, take a gander at my thoughts 7 years ago: https://www.suscipedomine.com/forum/index.php?topic=14104.0

#Humility.


Everyone should read "To Vaccinate or not to Vaccinate: A Review of Scientific Literature on Vaccines" by A. Amantonio

Same.  The first kid got a few (but not even enough to enroll in public school) because we were still under the impression that only a few of them had problematic ingredients and lousy safety records.  No more.

[LausTibiChriste]

We gave the bare minimum to our first, giving none to our second.

Vaccines are bullshit.

And if you think I'm a nutcase, conspiracy theorist, take a gander at my thoughts 7 years ago: https://www.suscipedomine.com/forum/index.php?topic=14104.0

#Humility.


Everyone should read "To Vaccinate or not to Vaccinate: A Review of Scientific Literature on Vaccines" by A. Amantonio

Same.  The first kid got a few (but not even enough to enroll in public school) because we were still under the impression that only a few of them had problematic ingredients and lousy safety records.  No more.

Our pediatrician, bless her heart, doesn't understand us at all, but she let's us do as we wish - we just need to sign waivers.

But to give a viewpoint into one of the MANY reasons why I oppose vaccines, our ped said to us today:

"You know for this vaccine, the companies are always competing so every 4 years or so it changes. So 4 years ago your son got XXX vaccine, but then the other company won and now we use YYYY's vaccine"


Tell me how you're supposed to know the long-term effects of these vaccines if they're changing every 4 years?!

[ChairmanJoeAintMyPrez]

Tell me how you're supposed to know the long-term effects of these vaccines if they're changing every 4 years?!

It's worse in the United States.

None of the vaccines on the "childhood schedule" are subject to ongoing research or even independent quality control.  What was approved thirty years ago might be substantially different from what's injected today, and no one would know the difference.

[LausTibiChriste]

Tell me how you're supposed to know the long-term effects of these vaccines if they're changing every 4 years?!

It's worse in the United States.

None of the vaccines on the "childhood schedule" are subject to ongoing research or even independent quality control.  What was approved thirty years ago might be substantially different from what's injected today, and no one would know the difference.

The one that gets me is that in almost all vaccine studies, the placebo is some variant of a neurotoxin, instead of actually being inert.

That's like comparing BXVI's encyclicals against the Tradition, but the Tradition is V2

[ChairmanJoeAintMyPrez]

The one that gets me is that in almost all vaccine studies, the placebo is some variant of a neurotoxin, instead of actually being inert.

It's typically the vaccine itself, except without the pathogen.  It includes all of the adjuvants and preservatives.

I refuse to believe the people running these studies are too stupid to ask whether the adjuvants and preservatives present a risk.

[TradGranny]

a 36k/yr bonus

The system is broken.

Greed is king.

[TradGranny]

Over 20 years ago I was told I had an inoperable brain tumor and six months to live. They suspected it to be from my childhood polio vaccine which was known to be contaminated from monkey viruses.

The specific virus is called SV40 or Simion Virus 40. Had to go to Yandex to find info being hidden elsewhere.

https://yandex.com/search/?text=simeon+virus+40&lr=103520&search_source=yacom_desktop_common

med journal
https://www.frontiersin.org/journals/oncology/articles/10.3389/fonc.2019.00670/full

[ChairmanJoeAintMyPrez]

Over 20 years ago I was told I had an inoperable brain tumor and six months to live.

Happy you're still around.