If Germany won the First Battle of the Marne, 1914

[Angelorum]

Let's go all the way back to September 1914.

World War I is in its early stages. The Germans have invaded Belgium to cross over into France. So far, they've occupied parts of Northern France and are dangerously close to Paris. If they cross the Marne, its inevitable that Paris falls. In our timeline, France miraculously wins and this leads to four more years of brutal trench warfare with an eventual Entente victory.

But suppose Germany wins and are able to conquer Paris, quickly knocking France out à la 1870. I can't see the Entente continuing to fight at that point. Meanwhile, Germany can unleash its full army alongside Austro-Hungary on the Eastern Front, quickly crushing the Russians.

What happens differently at this point? Some possible consequences...

• No Fascism/Nazism in Germany - such a movement doesn't happen with Kaiser Wilhelm II fully in power thanks to his victory.
• No Communism in Russia - though they lose the war, the situation hasn't deteriorated like in 1917 to where Nicholas II is forced to abdicate. Worst case scenario is that Russia becomes a constitutional monarchy like Britain.
• No dissolution of the Austro-Hungarian Empire - With a Central Powers victory, the Habsburgs are able to continue their rule of the dual monarchy.
• No Balfour Declaration and no Israel - In our timeline, Britain announces the Balfour declaration (which declares Palestine as the home of the Jewish people) in 1917 to sway public opinion to the Entente side. A quick German victory in 1914 prevents that from happening.

The wild card is France. They're the big loser who is likely to lose even more territory to Germany after they lost Alsace-Lorraine in the Franco-Prussian War. Their losses might look something like this:



Who knows what happens to them next in such a scenario - whether the commies take power or some kind of reactionary movement takes place - but I can't see them being more dangerous than Stalinist Russia in this scenario.

[Goldfinch]

Thank you for posting this, Angelorum.

The victory of the Entente in WW1 was one of the biggest tragedies in modern History. It was the first big war to "make the world safe for democracy", as Woodrow Wilson put it. The beginning of the end for Western Civilization.

[GMC]

Remember that the Kaiser was who facilitated Lenin's return to Russia from his exile in Switzerland, so even if the bolshevik  revolution had taken place, without their leader and mastermind, they would have had it much harder.

[King Wenceslas]

Thank you for posting this, Angelorum.

The victory of the Entente in WW1 was one of the biggest tragedies in modern History. It was the first big war to "make the world safe for democracy", as Woodrow Wilson put it. The beginning of the end for Western Civilization.

The beginning of the end of Western Civilization started in 1776 and 1789. The broad social movements that these two events spawned doomed the Civilization before 1776. The victory of the Entente was nothing more than an event that supported the events of 1776 and 1789. Autocratic rule is helpless before these great social movements spawned by 1776 and 1789. One way or another Autocratic rule was going to fall.

What happened at the Marne or didn't happen is really irrelevant. History would have rolled on and rolled over Imperial Germany and autocrat Kaiser Willy.

Looking back in history and saying if this would have happened or this would not have happened things would have turned out better is an exercise in futility.

Whatever path you take you will always generally end up where we are at. Maybe a little bit different players and events but generally the same outcome: approval of abortion, sodomy, fornication, adultery, contraception even by the Human part of the Church. All of which will doom humanity to WWIII.

[Joseph_3]

>No Fascism/Nazism in Germany - such a movement doesn't happen with Kaiser Wilhelm II fully in power thanks to his victory.
No Communism in Russia - though they lose the war, the situation hasn't deteriorated like in 1917 to where Nicholas II is forced to abdicate. Worst case scenario is that Russia becomes a constitutional monarchy like Britain.
No dissolution of the Austro-Hungarian Empire - With a Central Powers victory, the Habsburgs are able to continue their rule of the dual monarchy.
No Balfour Declaration and no Israel - In our timeline, Britain announces the Balfour declaration (which declares Palestine as the home of the Jewish people) in 1917 to sway public opinion to the Entente side. A quick German victory in 1914 prevents that from happening.

If the Central Powers would have won it is difficult to say what the future of Communism in Germany would have been. Personally, I think that Communism would've still entrenched itself there, but in a much more subversive manner instead of the blatant power struggles that happened just after the dissolution of the Monarchy. Because of this the hard reaction which was National Socialism might not have occurred. Hitler still certainly would've likely entered politics and because of his genius done quiet well in it, potentially becoming chancellor anyway. Since the Empire would have retained the culture, there wouldn't have been the degenerative abominations that were allowed to occur under the republic and anti-Judaist opinions wouldn't have been so fiery. Hitler himself may even have taken a more relaxed approach to the "Jewish question in Europe," as Himmler put it, and the push to create Israel and move Europe's Jews to it, via the Havarra Agreement, might not have happened (although Zionism was still a very real and powerful sect and the state of Israel would have happened regardless).

I can't see any real scenario post 1914 where Russia does not become Communist unless either they win national prestige in battle or the rest of Europe actively combats the Bolshevik's finances and provides troops to the White Army.

The Austro Hungarian Empire was already in a state of collapse in WW1. The "Germanic" rule was being eroded and the effects of multiculturalism were flaring up racial tensions (racial in the most historic sense... Hungarians, Slavs, Germans, ect.. All considered different races), especially on the political stage. Nationalism was greatly increasing among the minority groups and civil war was certainly brewing. This environment is one where communism seems to thrive, with all it's lies and deceptions. The Austro-Hungarian Empire staying in tact would have potentially allowed another easy and large victory for the Bolsheviks, especially once they solidified their positions in the East, rather than the break up into smaller pieces and self determination allowed among the once "oppressed" nationalities.

Israel was bound to happen regardless. The British Empire was very pro-Zionist on top. Churchill was a Zionist, the King was a Zionist. The bankers were Zionist.

[Prayerful]

Thank you for posting this, Angelorum.

The victory of the Entente in WW1 was one of the biggest tragedies in modern History. It was the first big war to "make the world safe for democracy", as Woodrow Wilson put it. The beginning of the end for Western Civilization.

Woodrow Wilson as US President did the most damage afterwards. If Marne had been won by Germany, he might simply have piled in earlier, isolationism be d*mned. Ancient polities which worked well enough were torn apart based on theories of that racist and anti-Catholic.