Tempted to Walk-Out of Novus Ordo Mass?

[Greg]

I am not tempted to walk into one.

I would rather unblock a toilet by hand.

[bben15]

How do I resist these temptations?

Those are not temptations. That is the voice of your guardian angel who hates to be in the presence of blasphemy and sacrilege.

All the options open to you present difficulties, so I don't want to make it seem that I am pushing you towards one choice. But you don't have to feel that you have an obligation to attend that Mass. You don't.

Let's say this was 100 years ago and there was no issue of the New Mass, but the only Catholic Church near where you lived was located on the other side of a river. And then the bridge was washed out in a flood. You now find that you have a physical impediment which prevents you from attending Mass. You are not violating your obligation of weekly Mass when an impediment of that sort blocks you.

But impediments don't have to be physical, they can also be spiritual. Let's say that you lived in England back in the 16th century, and your parish one day became Anglican. The changes might be barely noticeable at first, less shocking than the New Mass today. And the parish priest still claims to be Catholic, and he tells you that you have an obligation to attend the services there. But you don't. In fact, for the good of your soul, in that case you must refuse to attend, even if it means being tortured to death as happened to many Englishmen during that time.

I agree with this post.  I bet that many of us here struggled with going to the NO many, many times before finally choosing to just stop for the good of our souls.  Suddenly something happens at church or something is said when you say to yourself, "I'm done." And never look back again.

Unfortunately, there is no way around it. It is basically implied that one cannot avoid the Novus Ordo and remain in good standing with Rome. So, I could either become a schismatic (which is one of the most grievous of sins), or force myself to an NO Mass every week.

So, either I turn SSPX, or I get my soul stabbed every week.

I wouldn't post this on CAF, because I know what all the liberalists and NO Catholics on that forum would say: "The Ordinary Form is a perfect valid, and acceptable form to attend. You are insulting Our Lord by not attending it." I never knew how severe abuses and modernism in the Mass can be pleasing to God. 

[columba]

It might help to read the lives of particular saints who were faced with a similar dilemma of conscience regarding their duty of obedience to the fourth commandment vs their repulsion of conscience in obeying it when in conflict with their faith. Three saints come to mind immedieately: St. Philomena,  St. Dymphna of Ireland and St. Margaret Clitherow of York, England.

[Gerard]

Find an isolated spot non the Church, read the prayers of the Old Mass, duck out right after the priest's communion.  Go home, watch a live streaming broadcast of a TLM (eg. FSSP in Florida???)  and make a spiritual communion with them. 

http://www.livemass.net/LiveMass/daily.html

If you really want to do something radical, try to learn to serve the Mass, find a priest who is trying to learn it, or knows it and see if you can organize something that can grow roots.  I don't know of any impediment to serving the Mass if you're not yet a Catholic.  You would just not be able to receive Holy Communion.  There may be an impediment, I'm just stating I don't know of any.

Hannibal said we will find a way or make a way.

[Daniel]

Since you are not a Catholic, I don't believe you have an obligation to attend Sunday Mass.  My advice would be to try going to Mass on a weekday instead (if you can find one that doesn't conflict with your high school schedule) and see if it's any better.  I go to Novus Ordo Mass on the weekdays and it seems more reverent than the Novus Ordo Sunday Mass.

[Michael Wilson]

How do I resist these temptations?

Those are not temptations. That is the voice of your guardian angel who hates to be in the presence of blasphemy and sacrilege.

All the options open to you present difficulties, so I don't want to make it seem that I am pushing you towards one choice. But you don't have to feel that you have an obligation to attend that Mass. You don't.

Let's say this was 100 years ago and there was no issue of the New Mass, but the only Catholic Church near where you lived was located on the other side of a river. And then the bridge was washed out in a flood. You now find that you have a physical impediment which prevents you from attending Mass. You are not violating your obligation of weekly Mass when an impediment of that sort blocks you.

But impediments don't have to be physical, they can also be spiritual. Let's say that you lived in England back in the 16th century, and your parish one day became Anglican. The changes might be barely noticeable at first, less shocking than the New Mass today. And the parish priest still claims to be Catholic, and he tells you that you have an obligation to attend the services there. But you don't. In fact, for the good of your soul, in that case you must refuse to attend, even if it means being tortured to death as happened to many Englishmen during that time.

Brilliant Max!

[VeraeFidei]

Find an isolated spot non the Church, read the prayers of the Old Mass, duck out right after the priest's communion.  Go home, watch a live streaming broadcast of a TLM (eg. FSSP in Florida???)  and make a spiritual communion with them. 

http://www.livemass.net/LiveMass/daily.html

If you really want to do something radical, try to learn to serve the Mass, find a priest who is trying to learn it, or knows it and see if you can organize something that can grow roots.  I don't know of any impediment to serving the Mass if you're not yet a Catholic.  You would just not be able to receive Holy Communion.  There may be an impediment, I'm just stating I don't know of any.

Hannibal said we will find a way or make a way.

A non-Catholic should probably not be in the Sanctuary nor touching holy things, both of which are required of the altar server.

I don't have a source off the top of my head, but it seems logical.

Now that I think about it, here is the problem: an altar server is really a substitute for an ordained man, ordained to the order of Acolyte. A non-Catholic cannot receive Holy Orders licitly (although if he were validly baptized, I suppose he could do so validly but the Church would investigate, see, for ex., the "Dutch Touch"); therefore a non-Catholic may not serve at the Altar.

[Parresia]

The last few weeks I have experienced some of the worst Masses in terms of abuse, and overall lack of reverence that I have ever seen.  Our parish, which had started to make some progress, seems to be actually backsliding recently.  There are three parishes locally that I can reasonably attend, all of which are in the same boat.  Its a very frustrating situation, and one that I know I am hardly alone in. 

My wife and I are moving in a few months, and thankfully things will be much better at that point in regards to Mass.

Taylor Marshall wrote an article a while back that is worth a few minutes if you have them to spare.
http://taylormarshall.com/2013/01/are-you-part-of-great-catholic.html

[Gerard]

Find an isolated spot non the Church, read the prayers of the Old Mass, duck out right after the priest's communion.  Go home, watch a live streaming broadcast of a TLM (eg. FSSP in Florida???)  and make a spiritual communion with them. 

http://www.livemass.net/LiveMass/daily.html

If you really want to do something radical, try to learn to serve the Mass, find a priest who is trying to learn it, or knows it and see if you can organize something that can grow roots.  I don't know of any impediment to serving the Mass if you're not yet a Catholic.  You would just not be able to receive Holy Communion.  There may be an impediment, I'm just stating I don't know of any.

Hannibal said we will find a way or make a way.

A non-Catholic should probably not be in the Sanctuary nor touching holy things, both of which are required of the altar server.

I don't have a source off the top of my head, but it seems logical.

Now that I think about it, here is the problem: an altar server is really a substitute for an ordained man, ordained to the order of Acolyte. A non-Catholic cannot receive Holy Orders licitly (although if he were validly baptized, I suppose he could do so validly but the Church would investigate, see, for ex., the "Dutch Touch"); therefore a non-Catholic may not serve at the Altar.

Good points worth looking into.  Makes me wonder if the same rules should also apply to the choir, schola or instrumentalists I would think since they are actors in the Liturgy according to St. Pius X. 

[Penelope]

I read something recently (I forget the source) that says that members of a schola or choir must also be Catholics.

[Older Salt]

Funny you ask this question.

Two days ago I e-mailed Fr Finigan, pastor  from Blackfen England, a diocesan priest who is very devout, about being at NO Mass if one has to fulfill the obligation.

I asked Father, if I could just stand outside the Church building during Mass and would it fulfill the obligation?

Fr told me yes it probably would.

Here is Father Tim Finigans exact response to me standing outside the Church building:

"Dear Dan


Yes, I think that would fulfill the obligation but might draw attention to yourself. Some people I know just take along their hand missal (old rite) and follow that during the Mass, and discreetly read some prayers or say the rosary during the sermon. However I do hear tell of authoritarian Ushers in the States whom one has to evade. (Of course there is also the "offering up" strategy.)


My father once admitted to me that when he was in the Army during WW2, a few of them used to go out for a smoke during the sermon - you could do that and, when the Usher-in-Chief interrogates you, reply in an unintelligibly strong Kerry accent that it is an old Oirish tradition ;-)


God bless you for your faithfulness to Holy Mother Church in these troubled times and may he convert some of my brother priests who make life so difficult for faithful Catholics."

[Habitual_Ritual]

Against my better judgment I allowed myself to be dragged along to a Latin Nervous disordo service recently. I mostly wanted to see the Church which is in the byzantine style and very beautiful.  This Church only offers the revamped Latin 'Mass' once a month on a Saturday night. I figured the novelty aspect alone might drag people out. The Church was empty, maybe 10 souls in attendance and half of those were directly involved in proceedings. Myself and my friend were the only ones actually attempting the Latin responses. It was clear no else had a clue. Despite the relative 'reverence' it was clear that this was still a big ol liturgical turd draped in a silk blanket. In this case I can say the renewal of the renewal is a big fat FAIL.

[Older Salt]

Against my better judgment I allowed myself to be dragged along to a Latin Nervous disordo service recently. I mostly wanted to see the Church which is in the byzantine style and very beautiful.  This Church only offers the revamped Latin 'Mass' once a month on a Saturday night. I figured the novelty aspect alone might drag people out. The Church was empty, maybe 10 souls in attendance and half of those were directly involved in proceedings. Myself and my friend were the only ones actually attempting the Latin responses. It was clear no else had a clue. Despite the relative 'reverence' it was clear that this was still a big ol liturgical turd draped in a silk blanket. In this case I can say the renewal of the renewal is a big fat FAIL.

I agree.

I went to a Latin Novus Ordo, and though it was well attended it is obviously a liturgically deficient Mass.

[Maximilian]

I can say the renewal of the renewal is a big fat FAIL.

Yes, that's a good point.

And it also points out a larger trend. New movements are started, develop for a while, and then they die and no one mentions them again. They're like the seed that fell on rocks. They sprout quickly but soon die because they have no roots. But all the people who made a living being cheerleaders for the movement during its lifespan, quickly fall silent as vanishes into the mists of time.

I was briefly fooled by "the renewal of the renewal." I even attended the NO in Latin for several years when I was too stupid and uninformed to know better. Today, however, it could hardly be more clear that it is a FAIL, as HR says.

[VeraeFidei]

Find an isolated spot non the Church, read the prayers of the Old Mass, duck out right after the priest's communion.  Go home, watch a live streaming broadcast of a TLM (eg. FSSP in Florida???)  and make a spiritual communion with them. 

http://www.livemass.net/LiveMass/daily.html

If you really want to do something radical, try to learn to serve the Mass, find a priest who is trying to learn it, or knows it and see if you can organize something that can grow roots.  I don't know of any impediment to serving the Mass if you're not yet a Catholic.  You would just not be able to receive Holy Communion.  There may be an impediment, I'm just stating I don't know of any.

Hannibal said we will find a way or make a way.

A non-Catholic should probably not be in the Sanctuary nor touching holy things, both of which are required of the altar server.

I don't have a source off the top of my head, but it seems logical.

Now that I think about it, here is the problem: an altar server is really a substitute for an ordained man, ordained to the order of Acolyte. A non-Catholic cannot receive Holy Orders licitly (although if he were validly baptized, I suppose he could do so validly but the Church would investigate, see, for ex., the "Dutch Touch"); therefore a non-Catholic may not serve at the Altar.

Good points worth looking into.  Makes me wonder if the same rules should also apply to the choir, schola or instrumentalists I would think since they are actors in the Liturgy according to St. Pius X.

I think you are absolutely correct about the schola - properly speaking, the choir should itself be in the Sanctuary (as HK could tell us). Think about how priests assist "in choir" sometimes, if they are not ministers in the Mass but attend. Furthermore, seeing as the schola must be all-male because it is a liturgical office, it would follow that they should be male Catholics. That being said, I would surmise that a choir which sings the Ordinary, and/or instrumentalists, might be different, and I am sure paid non-Catholics have been around for awhile.