An Invitation from The Thinking Atheist Forum

Started by Christknight104, October 17, 2013, 09:56:32 PM

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Christknight104

I thought it would be good to post this...

Added Link:  http://www.thethinkingatheist.com/forum/Thread-Catholics-vs-TTA-Respectfully

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Catholics vs. TTA......Respectfully.....


So due to recent developments in the "Real debat with fundies" thread, I've decided to start this thread. I'd like to have a civil, respectful discussion with them, pertaining to the same issue that was discussed on their forum. I believe it was homosexuality. I didn't read the thread, so I don't know what all was laid out, but here's a chance to put it out there, without the usual threat of being banned for going against the grain.

I'd invite Chesterbelloc, LouisIX, and anyone else that might want to join in for the catholics to feel free to be heard here.

I'd like to ask the members of TTA to be respectful and civilized during this discussion, as I believe as human being we are capable of doing so in any circumstance, so long as we understand that these are just ideas that we are presenting in this particular argument.

Put your heartfelt emotion into your argument, not into petty insults.

So then, catholics........why do you see it as a moral right to be able to legislate against homosexuality?

Kaesekopf

As a heads up, Crimson has been unbanned.

But, this will be interesting to read/see. 
Wie dein Sonntag, so dein Sterbetag.

I am not altogether on anybody's side, because nobody is altogether on my side.  ~Treebeard, LOTR

Jesus son of David, have mercy on me.

mikemac

I'd just ignore them over at that atheist forum.  Crimson Flyboy is not being honest even in his first post over there.  He posted;

"Great idea. The following story started that thread: http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013/09/05/burn-in-hell-you-racist-pigs-christian-baker-who-refused-to-make-lesbian-couples-wedding-cake-details-creepy-alleged-break-in-ongoing-challenges/

I made the statement that this is a violation of the cake shop's first amendment rights, and the Catholics explained that they hate religious liberty and homosexuals. The rest was craziness."

Meanwhile contrary to what Crimson Flyboy posted this is the story that started the thread.  It says that not just the one company was forced to close down like the article that Crimson Flyboy posted over there, but at least 13 companies are listed in this article that were forced to close for the same reason.
http://www.crisismagazine.com/2013/gay-persecution-of-christians-the-latest-evidence

They have declared war.  But people are just fed up to the ears with it, not just Catholics and not just Christians in general, but everyone is fed up with the militant atheist homosexual agenda.  I've even seen some homosexuals that have posted their disgust with their militant actions.  This can only end three different ways.

1. They back off with their militant actions.
2. Catholic persecution will increase.
3. We start to fight back and see victory.

The time of treating them with kid gloves is long past.   
Like John Vennari (RIP) said "Why not just do it?  What would it hurt?"
Consecrate Russia to the Immaculate Heart of Mary (PETITION)
https://lifepetitions.com/petition/consecrate-russia-to-the-immaculate-heart-of-mary-petition

"We would be mistaken to think that Fatima's prophetic mission is complete." Benedict XVI May 13, 2010

"Tell people that God gives graces through the Immaculate Heart of Mary.  Tell them also to pray to the Immaculate Heart of Mary for peace, since God has entrusted it to Her." Saint Jacinta Marto

The real nature of hope is "despair, overcome."
Source

Basilios

Lol no thanks Jeff. Athiest forums are hell holes. Self congratulatory ignoramuses high fiving each other for how rude, obnoxious and immoral they can be. I don't believe a word those snakes say. Too many times I've tried to debate with internet atheists. Have yet to come across one that was sincere. Think about it, if they were sincere God would have already rewarded them for their seeking truth. As it stands it's nothing more than mockery, ganging up and some pretended intellectual interest which is nothing more than an excuse later in life to tell someone "I know all your arguments you Jesus loving pedo". This is a bold and prideful forum war challenge not a meaningful and humble pursuit of truth.

In my opinion!
Set a watch, O Lord, before my mouth: and a door round about my lips. Incline not my heart to evil words.

Recovering NOer

Quote from: Basilios on October 17, 2013, 11:51:25 PM
Lol no thanks Jeff. Athiest forums are hell holes. Self congratulatory ignoramuses high fiving each other for how rude, obnoxious and immoral they can be.

Nailed it IMO.  "No thanks Jeff" was actually my same exact thought as soon as I saw the OP lol.

Probius

I'm back.  Thank you Louis for letting me come back on y'all's forum.  I am sorry for mocking y'all on The Thinking Atheist forum, that wasn't very nice of me.  I have learned quite a lot from y'all, such as my need to brush up on philosophy.  I have many assumptions in my philosophical world view which I struggle to explain adequately.  Thanks for the help so far.
You yourself, as much as anybody in the entire universe deserve your love and affection." - The Buddha

"Until you make the unconscious conscious, it will direct your life and you will call it fate." - Carl Jung

voxxpopulisuxx

Quote from: Crimson Flyboy on October 18, 2013, 02:12:29 AM
I'm back.  Thank you Louis for letting me come back on y'all's forum.  I am sorry for mocking y'all on The Thinking Atheist forum, that wasn't very nice of me.  I have learned quite a lot from y'all, such as my need to brush up on philosophy.  I have many assumptions in my philosophical world view which I struggle to explain adequately.  Thanks for the help so far.
Your not fooling me...your insincere and deliberately obtuse
TRUTH is a toy to you...to sincere Catholics...Jesus Christ is Truth.....not A truth....but THE Truth. You want to redeem yourself? What say ye friend of Jesus Christ.?
Lord Jesus Christ Most High Son of God have Mercy On Me a Sinner (Jesus Prayer)

"You can never cross the ocean until you have the courage to lose sight of the shore." – Christopher Columbus
911!
"Let my name stand among those who are willing to bear ridicule and reproach for the truth's sake, and so earn some right to rejoice when the victory is won. "— Louisa May Alcott

"From man's sweat and God's love, beer came into the world."St. Arnold (580-640)

Geocentrism holds no possible atheistic downside.

Othmar

From what I remember, The Thinking Atheist certainly isn't the worst atheist forum. You should've seen r/atheism in its heyday, or Dawkins' Facebook fanpage.

RobertJS

Quote from: Crimson Flyboy on October 18, 2013, 02:12:29 AM
I'm back.  Thank you Louis for letting me come back on y'all's forum.  I am sorry for mocking y'all on The Thinking Atheist forum, that wasn't very nice of me.  I have learned quite a lot from y'all, such as my need to brush up on philosophy.  I have many assumptions in my philosophical world view which I struggle to explain adequately.  Thanks for the help so far.

A fundamental of philosophy is getting it straight about what objective "truth" is. Does the moon objectively exist, even if one is blind? Does a virus exist, objectively, for a newborn being that his mind is unaware of it? The answer is, yes.

What is truth's relationship to logic & reason? It brings us truth. If a=b and b=c, it is a truth that  a=c.

However, logic and reason are not identical. You can have true logic that does not result in reasonableness or truth - if the premises for the logic are not entirely true, or are lacking the consideration of some other truth.

Truth and reason cannot bear contradiction. Truth is internally consistent. No truth, on any subject, can be inconsistent with another truth.

Demonstration and empirical evidence help us towards truth. The mind is made for truth as the eye is made for light. The mind is not really satisfied unless it knows something is true. A person who professes that lying is good, will get angry when he is lied to.

If one doesn't grasp these fundamentals, he will flounder in argument without as solid foundation.

Empirical evidence: 1917 at Fatima, Portugal. Scientists who pride themselves in reason and normally put empirical evidence on a pedestal, do not want to touch this. It is a glaring silence. From memory, over 25,000 people, religious and anti-religious, and documented in the anti-Catholic press, witnessed the sun spiral towards the earth, and flash out rainbow colors, witnesses thinking the sun was plummeting to the earth. The earth was just previously soaking wet due to heavy rains. Within minutes everything and everyone was dry. No sunburn, no harm to the eyes of the people looking at the sun.

Scientists don't really want to touch this empirical evidence. Atheists included. When what they normally put on a pedestal wholesale, and then perpetual fear in certain instances, we conclude great significance exists they don't want to face.
ideo mittit illis Deus operationem erroris ut credant mendacio

Elizabeth

Quote from: Basilios on October 17, 2013, 11:51:25 PM
. Athiest forums are hell holes.

  I believe you.  And also boring beyond belief, judging by their ambassadors here.

Probius


Quote from: RobertJS on October 18, 2013, 07:35:09 AM
Quote from: Crimson Flyboy on October 18, 2013, 02:12:29 AM
I'm back.  Thank you Louis for letting me come back on y'all's forum.  I am sorry for mocking y'all on The Thinking Atheist forum, that wasn't very nice of me.  I have learned quite a lot from y'all, such as my need to brush up on philosophy.  I have many assumptions in my philosophical world view which I struggle to explain adequately.  Thanks for the help so far.

A fundamental of philosophy is getting it straight about what objective "truth" is. Does the moon objectively exist, even if one is blind? Does a virus exist, objectively, for a newborn being that his mind is unaware of it? The answer is, yes.

What is truth's relationship to logic & reason? It brings us truth. If a=b and b=c, it is a truth that  a=c.

However, logic and reason are not identical. You can have true logic that does not result in reasonableness or truth - if the premises for the logic are not entirely true, or are lacking the consideration of some other truth.

Truth and reason cannot bear contradiction. Truth is internally consistent. No truth, on any subject, can be inconsistent with another truth.

Demonstration and empirical evidence help us towards truth. The mind is made for truth as the eye is made for light. The mind is not really satisfied unless it knows something is true. A person who professes that lying is good, will get angry when he is lied to.

If one doesn't grasp these fundamentals, he will flounder in argument without as solid foundation.

Empirical evidence: 1917 at Fatima, Portugal. Scientists who pride themselves in reason and normally put empirical evidence on a pedestal, do not want to touch this. It is a glaring silence. From memory, over 25,000 people, religious and anti-religious, and documented in the anti-Catholic press, witnessed the sun spiral towards the earth, and flash out rainbow colors, witnesses thinking the sun was plummeting to the earth. The earth was just previously soaking wet due to heavy rains. Within minutes everything and everyone was dry. No sunburn, no harm to the eyes of the people looking at the sun.

Scientists don't really want to touch this empirical evidence. Atheists included. When what they normally put on a pedestal wholesale, and then perpetual fear in certain instances, we conclude great significance exists they don't want to face.

How can I look into the Fatima incident more?  Where is the evidence that this actually was a miracle?  I find it disappointing when a man refuses to look into something.  What is there to be afraid of?
You yourself, as much as anybody in the entire universe deserve your love and affection." - The Buddha

"Until you make the unconscious conscious, it will direct your life and you will call it fate." - Carl Jung

red solo cup

Quote from: voxxpopulisuxx on October 18, 2013, 04:11:00 AM
Quote from: Crimson Flyboy on October 18, 2013, 02:12:29 AM
I'm back.  Thank you Louis for letting me come back on y'all's forum.  I am sorry for mocking y'all on The Thinking Atheist forum, that wasn't very nice of me.  I have learned quite a lot from y'all, such as my need to brush up on philosophy.  I have many assumptions in my philosophical world view which I struggle to explain adequately.  Thanks for the help so far.
Your not fooling me...your insincere and deliberately obtuse
TRUTH is a toy to you...to sincere Catholics...Jesus Christ is Truth.....not A truth....but THE Truth. You want to redeem yourself? What say ye friend of Jesus Christ.?
I agree with VP on this one. I think the TTAs are here looking for more ammo so they can run another  snarky "who's craziest" poll. They're like children who ring the
the doorbell and run away. I guess that's par for the course from a bunch of wet-behind the-ears twenty somethings.
non impediti ratione cogitationis

Probius

I've apologized for the poll, I was a bit upset about the name calling toward homosexuals.  I have a homosexual in my family, and that can touch a nerve.
You yourself, as much as anybody in the entire universe deserve your love and affection." - The Buddha

"Until you make the unconscious conscious, it will direct your life and you will call it fate." - Carl Jung

RobertJS

Quote from: Crimson Flyboy on October 18, 2013, 08:03:39 AM

Quote from: RobertJS on October 18, 2013, 07:35:09 AM
Quote from: Crimson Flyboy on October 18, 2013, 02:12:29 AM
I'm back.  Thank you Louis for letting me come back on y'all's forum.  I am sorry for mocking y'all on The Thinking Atheist forum, that wasn't very nice of me.  I have learned quite a lot from y'all, such as my need to brush up on philosophy.  I have many assumptions in my philosophical world view which I struggle to explain adequately.  Thanks for the help so far.

A fundamental of philosophy is getting it straight about what objective "truth" is. Does the moon objectively exist, even if one is blind? Does a virus exist, objectively, for a newborn being that his mind is unaware of it? The answer is, yes.

What is truth's relationship to logic & reason? It brings us truth. If a=b and b=c, it is a truth that  a=c.

However, logic and reason are not identical. You can have true logic that does not result in reasonableness or truth - if the premises for the logic are not entirely true, or are lacking the consideration of some other truth.

Truth and reason cannot bear contradiction. Truth is internally consistent. No truth, on any subject, can be inconsistent with another truth.

Demonstration and empirical evidence help us towards truth. The mind is made for truth as the eye is made for light. The mind is not really satisfied unless it knows something is true. A person who professes that lying is good, will get angry when he is lied to.

If one doesn't grasp these fundamentals, he will flounder in argument without as solid foundation.

Empirical evidence: 1917 at Fatima, Portugal. Scientists who pride themselves in reason and normally put empirical evidence on a pedestal, do not want to touch this. It is a glaring silence. From memory, over 25,000 people, religious and anti-religious, and documented in the anti-Catholic press, witnessed the sun spiral towards the earth, and flash out rainbow colors, witnesses thinking the sun was plummeting to the earth. The earth was just previously soaking wet due to heavy rains. Within minutes everything and everyone was dry. No sunburn, no harm to the eyes of the people looking at the sun.

Scientists don't really want to touch this empirical evidence. Atheists included. When what they normally put on a pedestal wholesale, and then perpetual fear in certain instances, we conclude great significance exists they don't want to face.

How can I look into the Fatima incident more?  Where is the evidence that this actually was a miracle?  I find it disappointing when a man refuses to look into something.  What is there to be afraid of?

I didn't use the word "miracle". So, apparently you have heard of it. How can you look more into it? Try google.com 

Don't disappoint yourself and look into it. Do not be afraid. It is obvious from the points I gave from memory that I had looked into it already.
ideo mittit illis Deus operationem erroris ut credant mendacio

Probius

#14
Quote from: RobertJS on October 18, 2013, 08:08:52 AM
Quote from: Crimson Flyboy on October 18, 2013, 08:03:39 AM

Quote from: RobertJS on October 18, 2013, 07:35:09 AM
Quote from: Crimson Flyboy on October 18, 2013, 02:12:29 AM
I'm back.  Thank you Louis for letting me come back on y'all's forum.  I am sorry for mocking y'all on The Thinking Atheist forum, that wasn't very nice of me.  I have learned quite a lot from y'all, such as my need to brush up on philosophy.  I have many assumptions in my philosophical world view which I struggle to explain adequately.  Thanks for the help so far.

A fundamental of philosophy is getting it straight about what objective "truth" is. Does the moon objectively exist, even if one is blind? Does a virus exist, objectively, for a newborn being that his mind is unaware of it? The answer is, yes.

What is truth's relationship to logic & reason? It brings us truth. If a=b and b=c, it is a truth that  a=c.

However, logic and reason are not identical. You can have true logic that does not result in reasonableness or truth - if the premises for the logic are not entirely true, or are lacking the consideration of some other truth.

Truth and reason cannot bear contradiction. Truth is internally consistent. No truth, on any subject, can be inconsistent with another truth.

Demonstration and empirical evidence help us towards truth. The mind is made for truth as the eye is made for light. The mind is not really satisfied unless it knows something is true. A person who professes that lying is good, will get angry when he is lied to.

If one doesn't grasp these fundamentals, he will flounder in argument without as solid foundation.

Empirical evidence: 1917 at Fatima, Portugal. Scientists who pride themselves in reason and normally put empirical evidence on a pedestal, do not want to touch this. It is a glaring silence. From memory, over 25,000 people, religious and anti-religious, and documented in the anti-Catholic press, witnessed the sun spiral towards the earth, and flash out rainbow colors, witnesses thinking the sun was plummeting to the earth. The earth was just previously soaking wet due to heavy rains. Within minutes everything and everyone was dry. No sunburn, no harm to the eyes of the people looking at the sun.

Scientists don't really want to touch this empirical evidence. Atheists included. When what they normally put on a pedestal wholesale, and then perpetual fear in certain instances, we conclude great significance exists they don't want to face.

How can I look into the Fatima incident more?  Where is the evidence that this actually was a miracle?  I find it disappointing when a man refuses to look into something.  What is there to be afraid of?

I didn't use the word "miracle". So, apparently you have heard of it. How can you look more into it? Try google.com 

Don't disappoint yourself and look into it. Do not be afraid. It is obvious from the points I gave from memory that I had looked into it already.

Yes I have heard of it, and even though toy didn't use the word miracle, what you described would be called a miracle since that sort of thing doesn't normally happen.  I believe in looking into matters skeptically, so one shouldn't accept or reject something without evidence.  I would of course have questions going in, how can it be proved that all 25,000 people saw the same thing?  Were 25,000 testimonies taken?
You yourself, as much as anybody in the entire universe deserve your love and affection." - The Buddha

"Until you make the unconscious conscious, it will direct your life and you will call it fate." - Carl Jung